Phenom II X3, does AMD not care about 4th core?

[Jacen]

I came across this story today as I had seemingly missed the boat on this story the first time around.

I guess I am kind of curious as to why AMD would allow this to continue and why it hasn't been patched up yet? It seems like it would cut in to their profits/margins if more people opt for the tri vs the quad core chip?

Is this intentional? Was it from the get go? Just kind of curious on where this all stands since this "fix" came about. Has the success rate of the unlocks been better than the failure rates?

 

[richierich1212]

Because it's not 100% unlockable.

 

[Idontcare]

The question to ask is how much more money will it cost AMD to resolve the issue versus how much loss in profits (not revenue) are they expecting to see from continuing to let this go unresolved.

As for the timeline of seeing it "fixed" at the consumer level...typical life cycle of a wafer in a fab is 60-90 days, add another 10-15days for test and packaging ex-fab, another 7-10days for shipment and inventory management...so if AMD fixed it and implemented the fix today in their fabs (it is presumably a weak fuse-blow issue, so the fix will require new fuse array design which is done in doped poly-silicon so only product pre-metal in the fab can be intercepted for the new mask set) then we consumers would not see the "fixed" product until mid-June at the earliest (90 days) or possibly July to August timeframe (most likely case).

 

[waffleironhead]

why would they want to fix it? With this "mistake" they suddenly created a demand for these chips. There are a lot of people out there who are always looking to get some extra performance for nothing.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: Jacen
I came across this story today as I had seemingly missed the boat on this story the first time around.

I guess I am kind of curious as to why AMD would allow this to continue and why it hasn't been patched up yet? It seems like it would cut in to their profits/margins if more people opt for the tri vs the quad core chip?

Is this intentional? Was it from the get go? Just kind of curious on where this all stands since this "fix" came about. Has the success rate of the unlocks been better than the failure rates?

I'm sure the "failure" rate has been higher than the "success" rate. The 4th core unlocking depends on several factors. 1) The 4th core actually has to be working 2) You need a specific motherboard/chipset combo - must be 790GX/SB750 Am2+ 3) Only certain BIOSes work.

I've seen several posts where an individual has said that he intends to purchase an X3 and "it would be nice" if he could unlock the 4th core, but would be content even if he couldn't. I've yet to see a post where the person says, "if I can't unlock the 4th core, I'm sending it back".

There are "fixed" BIOSes out there that preclude the 4th core from being unlocked.

All in all, I doubt AMD has lost any money on this, and has gotten some nice pub.

 

[TurtleCrusher]

Originally posted by: waffleironhead
why would they want to fix it? With this "mistake" they suddenly created a demand for these chips. There are a lot of people out there who are always looking to get some extra performance for nothing.

QFT. They needed this bad. It created buzz on their tri-cores to the budget-enthusiast segment, which in part is one of the biggest markets to be a part of. Its a win-win situation for amd. They still make a good profit from it and in turn everyone who enabled that fourth core (or even people who didn't) feel like they got away with a steal.

AMD: More money. Yay!
Consumer: FAST quad core on the cheap! Yay!

 

[nyker96]

i am curious, are all the unlocked 4th core functional? or some are defective?

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: nyker96
i am curious, are all the unlocked 4th core functional? or some are defective?

Many of the unlocked cores are non-functional, even at lowered speeds.

 

[konakona]

Originally posted by: nyker96
i am curious, are all the unlocked 4th core functional? or some are defective?

I get weird artifacts in 3d/video with the 4th core enabled. At first I thought it was video card related as 2D was just fine otherwise. Its a shame, I don't even care about the 4th core as much as I do about ACC (and potentially higher OC with it in effect)

 

[Jacen]

Oh so there are updated bios that prevent this? But since AMD cant force anyone to use them it is pretty trivial I presume?

 

[taltamir]

Originally posted by: waffleironhead
why would they want to fix it? With this "mistake" they suddenly created a demand for these chips. There are a lot of people out there who are always looking to get some extra performance for nothing.

and when it turns out enabling the defective core was a bad idea because it gives errors that corrupt your data, all those people will have an AM2 board and an itch to get an X4.
It is a double win for AMD, and they cannot be faulted for it, even the people to which it happens are gonna have to be collossal jerks to blame AMD for it, most will just blame themselves for beeing "Greedy" with their OC/Unlocking.

not to mention people are getting a new 790/750 chipset for it, which otherwise there is no reason to upgrade to.

 

[taker777]

From what I've heard unlocking the 4th core gives 25-33% Performance gain
but is it true that new bios updates prevent it from being unlocked??

 

[Mothergoose729]

On some boards it is possible to unlock the fourth core and the L2 and L1 cache that comes with it. Others only can unlock the core. You have to use specific bios versions and often are limited to a certain range of boards that support it. Most of the time there is nothing wrong with this fourth core at all, and it is desabled in factors to meet the demand of triple core consumers. Often though, they are binned triple core for a reason, and overclocking potential generally suffers on the last core. AMD, thankfully, allows individual cores to be clocked at different frequencies, so it is often not even that big of a deal.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: taker777
From what I've heard unlocking the 4th core gives 25-33% Performance gain
but is it true that new bios updates prevent it from being unlocked??

AMD has reportedly worked with some motherboards mfr's to produce new BIOSes which ensure the 4th core cannot be unlocked.

As for performance improvements... that depends on the application. Even on apps that take advantage of multicore CPU's, sometimes there is a smaller performance realization. When you unlock that 4th core, you are also dropping the core-to-L3 cache ratio. With 6mb L3 cache, tri-core has 2mb for each core, while quads wind up with 1.5mb for each core.

 

[Jacen]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: taker777
From what I've heard unlocking the 4th core gives 25-33% Performance gain
but is it true that new bios updates prevent it from being unlocked??

AMD has reportedly worked with some motherboards mfr's to produce new BIOSes which ensure the 4th core cannot be unlocked.

As for performance improvements... that depends on the application. Even on apps that take advantage of multicore CPU's, sometimes there is a smaller performance realization. When you unlock that 4th core, you are also dropping the core-to-L3 cache ratio. With 6mb L3 cache, tri-core has 2mb for each core, while quads wind up with 1.5mb for each core.

That is assuming people update their bios to reflect the change. If you had 4 cores working smoothly it would probably be pretty silly to not use the old bios and keep the core.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: Jacen

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: taker777
From what I've heard unlocking the 4th core gives 25-33% Performance gain
but is it true that new bios updates prevent it from being unlocked??

AMD has reportedly worked with some motherboards mfr's to produce new BIOSes which ensure the 4th core cannot be unlocked.

As for performance improvements... that depends on the application. Even on apps that take advantage of multicore CPU's, sometimes there is a smaller performance realization. When you unlock that 4th core, you are also dropping the core-to-L3 cache ratio. With 6mb L3 cache, tri-core has 2mb for each core, while quads wind up with 1.5mb for each core.

That is assuming people update their bios to reflect the change. If you had 4 cores working smoothly it would probably be pretty silly to not use the old bios and keep the core.

'zackly. That's why I have no intention of ever updating my BIOS.

 

[Denithor]

AMD obviously hasn't talked to ASRock about disabling this feature.

Less than a month after it was revealed that you could unlock the fourth core on some Phenom II X3 CPUs, budget motherboard manufacturer ASRock has jumped on the feature as a selling point for its motherboards. As well as claiming to be able to unlock the fourth core on some and Phenom II X3 CPUs, the company also claims that some of its motherboards can also unlock the full 6MB of Level 3 cache on some low-end Phenom II X4 CPUs.

The company says that both features can be enabled by selecting the AOD-ACC (AMD OverDrive - advanced clock calibration) feature in the BIOS, which was the same method used by Playwares to enable the fourth core on a Phenom II X3 710 using a Biostar TA790GX 128M motherboard.

ASRock says that the AOD-ACC feature unlocks 2MB of extra Level 3 cache on the Phenom II X4 805 and 810 CPUs, upping the L3 cache from 4MB to 6MB. Meanwhile, the motherboard manufacturer also says that the AOD-ACC feature will unlock the fourth core on Phenom II X3 710 and 720 Black Edition CPUs, which are basically quad-core CPUs with one of the cores disabled. The company has released CPU-Z screenshots with AOD-ACC enabled and disabled as evidence that the feature works.

However, although ASRock is marketing this as a feature of its motherboards, the company points out that your CPU won?t necessarily unlock with AOD-ACC enabled. ?The success rate of this trick depends on the CPU version,? says ASRock, pointing that it?s tested a number of CPUs with mixed results. ASRock didn?t provide any figures for the success rate, but did say that a ?certain percentage? of CPUs failed.

The company has listed seven motherboards that it?s successfully used to unlock the extra features of the aforementioned processors. This includes those based on AMD?s 790GX chipset, as well as some boards based on AMD?s 780G chipset with an SB710 Southbridge. ASRock is particularly proud of the latter combination on its A780GXH/128M motherboard, saying that the chipset?s support for AOD-ACC is an ?Exclusive Worldwide First.?

 

[Jacen]

Originally posted by: Denithor
AMD obviously hasn't talked to ASRock about disabling this feature.

Less than a month after it was revealed that you could unlock the fourth core on some Phenom II X3 CPUs, budget motherboard manufacturer ASRock has jumped on the feature as a selling point for its motherboards. As well as claiming to be able to unlock the fourth core on some and Phenom II X3 CPUs, the company also claims that some of its motherboards can also unlock the full 6MB of Level 3 cache on some low-end Phenom II X4 CPUs.

The company says that both features can be enabled by selecting the AOD-ACC (AMD OverDrive - advanced clock calibration) feature in the BIOS, which was the same method used by Playwares to enable the fourth core on a Phenom II X3 710 using a Biostar TA790GX 128M motherboard.

ASRock says that the AOD-ACC feature unlocks 2MB of extra Level 3 cache on the Phenom II X4 805 and 810 CPUs, upping the L3 cache from 4MB to 6MB. Meanwhile, the motherboard manufacturer also says that the AOD-ACC feature will unlock the fourth core on Phenom II X3 710 and 720 Black Edition CPUs, which are basically quad-core CPUs with one of the cores disabled. The company has released CPU-Z screenshots with AOD-ACC enabled and disabled as evidence that the feature works.

However, although ASRock is marketing this as a feature of its motherboards, the company points out that your CPU won?t necessarily unlock with AOD-ACC enabled. ?The success rate of this trick depends on the CPU version,? says ASRock, pointing that it?s tested a number of CPUs with mixed results. ASRock didn?t provide any figures for the success rate, but did say that a ?certain percentage? of CPUs failed.

The company has listed seven motherboards that it?s successfully used to unlock the extra features of the aforementioned processors. This includes those based on AMD?s 790GX chipset, as well as some boards based on AMD?s 780G chipset with an SB710 Southbridge. ASRock is particularly proud of the latter combination on its A780GXH/128M motherboard, saying that the chipset?s support for AOD-ACC is an ?Exclusive Worldwide First.?

Lol... clearly AMD isn't all too pissy over this if they are okay with ASRock marketing this way.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: Denithor
as well as some boards based on AMD?s 780G chipset with an SB710 Southbridge. ASRock is particularly proud of the latter combination on its A780GXH/128M motherboard, saying that the chipset?s support for AOD-ACC is an ?Exclusive Worldwide First.?

[/quote]

780G with a SB710? Sure that's not supposed to be SB700?

 

[imported_Scoop]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry

Originally posted by: Denithor
as well as some boards based on AMD?s 780G chipset with an SB710 Southbridge. ASRock is particularly proud of the latter combination on its A780GXH/128M motherboard, saying that the chipset?s support for AOD-ACC is an ?Exclusive Worldwide First.?

780G with a SB710? Sure that's not supposed to be SB700?

SB710 is a new southbridge that also comes with the 760G boards like the MSI KA760GM.

 

[nyker96]

Originally posted by: konakona

Originally posted by: nyker96
i am curious, are all the unlocked 4th core functional? or some are defective?

I get weird artifacts in 3d/video with the 4th core enabled. At first I thought it was video card related as 2D was just fine otherwise. Its a shame, I don't even care about the 4th core as much as I do about ACC (and potentially higher OC with it in effect)

:{

maybe there's way to turn it off during 3d game play.