Personal Responsibility....or the lack thereof

[shiner]

Let's see if I understand the state of personal
responsibility in America in the last 20 years......

If a woman burns her thighs on the hot coffee she was
holding in her lap while driving, she blames the restaurant.

If your teen-age son kills himself, you blame the rock 'n'
roll musician he liked.

If you smoke three packs a day for 40 years and die of lung
cancer your family blames the tobacco company.

If your daughter gets pregnant by the football captain you
blame the school for poor sex education.

If your neighbor crashes into a tree while driving home
drunk, you blame the bartender.

If your cousin gets AIDS because the needle he used to
shoot heroin was dirty, you blame the government for not
providing clean ones.

If your grandchildren are brats without manners, you blame
television.

And, if your friend is shot by a deranged madman, you blame
the gun manufacturer.

 

[Yeeny]

If a woman burns her thighs on the hot coffee she was holding in her lap while driving, she blames the restaurant.

While I agree with you on the lack of personal responsibility being atrociously high in this country, that case you mentioned above was deserving of a law suit. The woman was old, they did not give her a coffee carrier to hold it in, and she received third degree burns on her legs and thighs that required skin grafts. There was no reason to have it that hot, and they should have had to pay her medical bills, and give her money for pain and suffering IMO at least.

 

[Passions]

Hahahahahaha I dont think so. If you dat old, maybe u shouldnt be drinking coffee. bwahahah

 

[toph99]

i agree, especially with the music thing. how the heck can people blame what people listen to for their actions? people just like quick-fix situations and scapegoats instead of caring about what really happened :|

 

[shiner]

<< The woman was old, they did not give her a coffee carrier to hold it in >>



Unless she was driving a car from the 50's it most likely had a cup holder somewhere.



<< There was no reason to have it that hot >>



Ummm...it was coffee....did she expect it to be cool and refreshing?



<< and give her money for pain and suffering IMO at least. >>



If that's true then Ricky Martin owes me a crapload of money for damaging my ears and causing me pain &amp; suffering.

 

[Yeeny]

Hahahahahaha I dont think so. If you dat old, maybe u shouldnt be drinking coffee. bwahahah

Li Mu Bai: Sharpness is a state of mind.

Need I say more......

There is a lot of hype about the McDonalds' scalding coffee case. No
one is in favor of frivolous cases of outlandish results; however, it is
important to understand some points that were not reported in most of
the stories about the case. McDonalds coffee was not only hot, it was
scalding -- capable of almost instantaneous destruction of skin, flesh
and muscle. Here's the whole story.

Stella Liebeck of Albuquerque, New Mexico, was in the passenger seat of
her grandson's car when she was severely burned by McDonalds' coffee in
February 1992. Liebeck, 79 at the time, ordered coffee that was served
in a styrofoam cup at the drivethrough window of a local McDonalds.

After receiving the order, the grandson pulled his car forward and
stopped momentarily so that Liebeck could add cream and sugar to her
coffee. (Critics of civil justice, who have pounced on this case, often
charge that Liebeck was driving the car or that the vehicle was in
motion when she spilled the coffee; neither is true.) Liebeck placed
the cup between her knees and attempted to remove the plastic lid from
the cup. As she removed the lid, the entire contents of the cup spilled
into her lap.

The sweatpants Liebeck was wearing absorbed the coffee and held it next
to her skin. A vascular surgeon determined that Liebeck suffered full
thickness burns (or third-degree burns) over 6 percent of her body,
including her inner thighs, perineum, buttocks, and genital and groin
areas. She was hospitalized for eight days, during which time she
underwent skin grafting. Liebeck, who also underwent debridement
treatments, sought to settle her claim for $20,000, but McDonalds
refused.

During discovery, McDonalds produced documents showing more than 700
claims by people burned by its coffee between 1982 and 1992. Some claims
involved third-degree burns substantially similar to Liebecks. This
history documented McDonalds' knowledge about the extent and nature of
this hazard.

McDonalds also said during discovery that, based on a consultants
advice, it held its coffee at between 180 and 190 degrees fahrenheit to
maintain optimum taste. He admitted that he had not evaluated the
safety ramifications at this temperature. Other establishments sell
coffee at substantially lower temperatures, and coffee served at home is
generally 135 to 140 degrees.

Further, McDonalds' quality assurance manager testified that the company
actively enforces a requirement that coffee be held in the pot at 185
degrees, plus or minus five degrees. He also testified that a burn
hazard exists with any food substance served at 140 degrees or above,
and that McDonalds coffee, at the temperature at which it was poured
into styrofoam cups, was not fit for consumption because it would burn
the mouth and throat. The quality assurance manager admitted that burns
would occur, but testified that McDonalds had no intention of reducing
the &quot;holding temperature&quot; of its coffee.

From http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cur78.htm. There was no reason, as I stated before, to have the coffee THAT hot. And she was burned more severely than anyone should ever have to worry about from a cup of coffee.

BTW: I like the Ricky Martin line, hehe.

 

[Mesomorph]

GirlFriday, in that situation, maybe the old woman shouldn't have been drinking the coffee and driving at the same time? She argued that there was no warning saying that the coffee was hot!!! So, maybe when she went in there, she really wanted some cold to lukewarm coffee. She should have known the risks. That's what life itself is all about, assessing risks and accepting them.

 

[eakers]

<< Hahahahahaha I dont think so. If you dat old, maybe u shouldnt be drinking coffee. bwahahah >>



thankyou for sharing the most ignorant thought i seen in weeks.

*kat. <-- *applauds*

 

[Damaged]

<< Hahahahahaha I dont think so. If you dat old, maybe u shouldnt be drinking coffee. bwahahah >>



Heh, maybe she shouldn't have been driving.

I gotta go with shinerburke on this one. Especially on the cup holder thing. I mean you can buy those ones that hang on the door. And it's a flimsy styrofoam cup. C'mon now! b/w your legs?

I should've sued McD's for that time I got stung by a bee in their drive through line and rear ended the van in front of my (no damage, how fast you can go in 2 ft?).

 

[Yeeny]

Ok, I edited my above post with facts from the case, and as you can see, she was not driving at the time, nobody was. She also tried to settle for her medical bills only, they would not do it.

 

[Viperoni]

IMO, all those people are stupid.

Coffee is hot. Everywhere. Except if you order a &quot;iced&quot;. However this lady didn't. Sucks to be her. She should be happy she wasn't born male :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q

 

[Damaged]

<< Liebeck placed the cup between her knees and attempted to remove the plastic lid from the cup. As she removed the lid, the entire contents of the cup spilled into her lap. >>


Still a bad idea on her part: flimsy cup, add pressure (put b/w knees), remove stability (remove top)...uh oh. But...I had forgotten that the coffee was actually that hot. Definitely NOT smart on McD's part as well. 185 degrees! Wrong.

 

[Zucchini]

but u have to admit they heated their coffee a little much.. i just remember thinking it was a tad unusual how hot their coffee was back then Much more then what my coffee maker spits out.

 

[Jmman]

Actually, I have to disagree with the coffee thing. As a former executive for a large restaurant chain(no, not McDonalds), coffee is to be brewed and held at that temperature (around 180-190). Ask any Barista and they will say the same thing. To properly extract the flavor from the bean, it needs to be super hot. As a matter of fact, restaurants did not lower the temp of their coffee after this decision, they just added a warning label on the cup. Anyway, McDs was stupid not to settle....

 

[RaDragon]

<< Li Mu Bai: Sharpness is a state of mind. >>

GF, you rock! It's kewl how you remembered the 'words' of Li Mu Bai...



<< If you smoke three packs a day for 40 years and die of lung
cancer your family blames the tobacco company. >>

-- yeah, i don't get this...



<< If your grandchildren are brats without manners, you blame
television. >>

-- does everyone remember that whole spiel when The Simpsons' first aired?!

 

[Mister T]

here is the root of the problem:

In the US, it costs nothing to sue someone.
The Law should be that if you sue someone, and lose, then you pay the legals fees for EVERYONE.

IMHO, this would decrease the number of BS lawsuits by 80%

 

[Jmman]

Tort reform!! Bigtime!!!

 

[Yeeny]

GF, you rock! It's kewl how you remembered the 'words' of Li Mu Bai...

Thanks RaDragon, but I copied that from BobbyRibbs signature. Can I still rock though, please?

 

[Russ]

Jmman is correct. The vast majority of restaurants, until the ambulance chasers nailed McDonald's, used to keep it at or near that temp range.

Russ, NCNE

 

[pamchenko]

GF, I expected this kind of sympathetic fluff from you.

 

[Pastore]

ok, so this lady puts a flimsy styrofoam cup between her knees while she takes a the top off of it? this lady is stupid, and since i dont know what happened in the case, i sure hope she didnt get any money...

the ignorance in this country is amazing...

ok, so can anyone explain to me why she thought that this was mcdonalds falt?

 

[Dedpuhl]

It's human nature to blame someone else...

 

[yakko]

GirlFriday,

What the hell have you been smoking? That whining bitch ordered HOT coffee, what else did she think she was going to get? Since the car had no cup holders why didn't she ask for a drink carrier? It was her decision to put the coffee between her legs so she is the one who should take responsibility for her actions. I would also like to know where they got some of the so called facts in that article you posted. I have used coffee makers in fast food restaurant and none of them make coffee that hot nor have the abillity to maintain that temperature. Most hot water heaters don't even make water that hot and the few that do are not set that high to protect employees and to keep operating costs down. Since the article mentions that her son was with her why didn't he ask for a drink carrier? Is he that stupid too? Since the article also states that the car was at rest when she removed the lid and spilled the coffee,what difference would a drink carrier have made anyway?

 

[Pastore]

yakko, most restaurants do keep the coffe that hot for the simple reason to get the maximum flavor from the beans...

 

[yakko]

Beast1284,

None of the ones I worked in did. I even had hot coffee spill on my hand that was right out of the machine. It was hot but I only ended up getting a slight burn that went away after a day or two. No blistering or peeling at all. I would like to see evidence of this 180 degree coffee. Also, this is McDonalds what kind of flavor do you think they are trying to maintain? It is not like the are having the beans flown in from the mountains of Columbia and grining them fresh for each pot.