Perplexing networking/ras issue - any help?

[ajf3]

Hi all,

I have three win2k machines on a network at home using a SMC Barricade... I need to have one of the machines (call it M1) RAS into another network, but I'm having some problems. I was hoping for some help from the experts out there!

Anyway, when M1 is on my network it can see all of the other machines and all is well. Settings are as follows:
LAN:
IP: 10.1.55.162
SUB: 255.255.255.0
Gateway 10.1.55.254

When I RAS in with M1 with the ethernet cable still connected I connect OK and am verified, but I cannot see _anything_ on the remote network. Settings are as follows:
LAN: (same as above)
IP: 10.1.55.162
SUB: 255.255.255.0
Gateway 10.1.55.254
PPP adapt:
IP: 10.1.52.246
SUB: 255.255.255.255
GATE: 10.1.52.246

The strange thing is that when I _unplug_ the network cable from M1 and RAS in everything works OK and I can see the remote
network. Settings are as follows:
LAN:
cable disconnected
PPP adapt: (same as above)
IP: 10.1.52.246
SUB: 255.255.255.255
GATE: 10.1.52.246

I guess it must be something other than the TCPIP settings thats causing the problem since they're the same whether I'm plugged into my local net or not... thing is, I'm a total amatuer at this, so I'm not really sure where to look next. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!

Thanks!

 

[Psychoholic]

If I understand you correctly when you're connected you can see the anything in the remote segment in Network Neighborhood. This is normal. The browse list cannot be maintained across different network segments.

Try opening Explorer while connected and type in a UNC share name. That will likely timeout or give you erratic messages. The best way to solve this problem is to create a hosts file. This will not show you everything in Network Neighborhood because that's still handled by the master browser on the remote segment. However you will be able to connect by using UNC share names once you set the hosts file up.

 

[ajf3]

Hi -

Thanks for the reply... the result I'm trying to achieve is this. I want to control M1 (as described above) via pcAnywhere from another machine (M2). I can do this while the ethernet is connected - however; I can't get RAS to work at all while the ethernet is connected. Any tips for this hosts file? What would I need to put in there?

 

[Psychoholic]

Okay I'm confused, you didn't mention PCAnywhere in your first post. For right now let's pretend it doesn't exist.

Let's concentrate on the LAN and the RAS connection. When you make the RAS connection the problem is that you can't see anything on the remote segment (the one you're connecting to with RAS), right??? As I had mentioned before you are probably going to need to make a hosts file, lmhosts to be exact and place it on M1. Here's some reference articles to help you create one:

How to Write an LMHOSTS File for Domain Validation and Other Name Resolution Issues (Q180094)
LMHOSTS File Information and Predefined Keywords (Q102725)
The Lmhosts File for TCP/IP in Windows (Q101927)

I can send you a sample lmhosts file if that would help, PM me with you email address if you're interested. If you have a system Administrator enlisting his services will also help accomplish what you want with a minimal amount of hair-pulling. It will help if there's someone that knows the layout of the LAN you're connecting to.

Like I mentioned we're leaving PCAnywhere out of the equation for now, but if it makes you feel any easier I have several remote computers, including my own, than connect through a VPN connection into the Domain I'm in charge of. Several of these run PCAnywhere as well as Client Access Express and other software. So it can be done.

 

[Garion]

Start with the very basics. Can you ping the PC Anywhere server by IP address? Can you ping it by name? If you can do the former and not the latter, just connect via IP and forget the name.

Is the IP address of the remote computer on the same subnet of the IP you get when you dial in? You can usually check by looking at the entire IP - If only the last digit is different, then you're probably on the same network. Otherwise, likely not.

If you're on a different network, chances are you have a routing problem. You have a default route ("If I don't know where to send traffic, I'll send it to the default gateway") on your Ethernet, the SMC. If your computer doesn't know about the network the PC Anywhere machine is in, it will automatically send it the default route, through the Ethernet to the SMC. Can be rather odd.

Anyhow, let us know the answer to these questions and we'll try to help.

- G

 

[ajf3]

Hi -

Thanks guys - I really do appreciate all of the help!

Anyway, here are answers to some of the questions you've asked:

1. Bringing PCA into the discussion was definately off-topic. I just wanted to make known my reason for needing M1 to see both networks at once.

2. Correct - when the network cable is plugged into M1, I cannot see anything on the remote segment. When I unplug I see everything on the remote segment. Plug it back in and it's gone.

3. My email addr is in my sig below - I would appreciate an example hosts file. Will I need to make an entry in there for every machine on the remote segment that I need to connect to? I ask because there are _lots_ - is there anyway I can reverse the problem - ie, setup M1 to see everything on the remote segment when the ethernet is connected, but nothing on the local net? I ask this since there are only 3 machines on the local net & I already know the IP's for them, so it would (probably) be simple to create the hosts file that way.

4. I can get to the sysadmin, but I'm not expecting much help from there... our company recently laid off the entire net-admin dept except for the one guy left. He doesn't have much free time on his hands & this is definately just a convienence for me...

5. I'm able to establish my pcanywhere session from M1 to M2 right now with no problem (and I'm not trying to PCA into the remote segment). The problem is that in order to have the connection, the cable needs to be plugged in causing me to not see any of the machines from M1 on the remote segment.

Anyway, to sum my questions now...

1. Is there a way to make M1 see everything on the remote segment and not be able to route to the local net when the cable is connected? Then I could just create the hosts file with my 3 local machine entries, right?

2. If not, is there an easy way to "scan" the remote network and assemble a list of machine names & IP's to use in the hosts file? I guess I'd have to reconstruct this file on a regular basis since the machines are constantly being upgraded and replace (we're migrating to win2k from nt4).

3. I travel on-site regularly and M1 is physically connected to the network I'm ras'ing into... will creating this hosts file cause any problems in that situation?

Again, thanks for all the help!

 

[Psychoholic]

<< Correct - when the network cable is plugged into M1, I cannot see anything on the remote segment. When I unplug I see everything on the remote segment. Plug it back in and it's gone. >>


Okay I must have misunderstood exactly what you meant before. So you're saying you unplug M1 and you can see the remote segment from M1??? When you unplug the cable there should be nothing connecting M1 to anything or do I misunderstand this??? Or do you mean you're unplugging from the SMC to the cable/DSL modem. If that's the case we may have a different problem maybe M1 is multi-homed. What two points does the cable you unplug run between???



<< My email addr is in my sig below - I would appreciate an example hosts file. >>


I'm going to hold off on this until I figure out what you're talking about, I don't want to add to the confusion. I'm not sure I on the same page as you yet.

 

[spidey07]

My guess would be a routing problem on M1. open a command prompt and type "route print" in each of your two scenarios. I'll bet you have a default route on M1 when the LAN cable is plugged in. Please post the results of each.

 

[ajf3]

I'm sorry - I guess I didn't state that very well before. M1 has _two_ connections: 1) the ethernet cable connecting it to my local lan and 2) the ras connection to the remote network that I establish via the phone line. When I talk about unplugging the cable, I'm in a state where I have a ras connection over the phone established and I remove the local ethernet cable from M1.

I did the route trace, here are the results:

Route print: RAS connected (via phone), local lan UNPLUGGED
I can see the remote segment (over ras), but not the local network in this situation.
===========================================================================
Interface List
0x1 ........................... MS TCP Loopback interface
0x1000003 ...00 10 a4 86 6a 9f ...... Intel(R) PRO PCI Adapter
0x24000004 ...00 53 45 00 00 00 ...... WAN (PPP/SLIP) Interface
===========================================================================
===========================================================================
Active Routes:
Network Destination Netmask Gateway Interface Metric
0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
10.1.52.246 255.255.255.255 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 1
10.1.52.247 255.255.255.255 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
10.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
127.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 1
224.0.0.0 224.0.0.0 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.1.52.246 1000003 1
Default Gateway: 10.1.52.246
===========================================================================
Persistent Routes:
None

Route print: RAS connected (via phone), local lan CONNECTED
I can see the local lan, but nothing on the remote segment (over ras) in this situation.
===========================================================================
Interface List
0x1 ........................... MS TCP Loopback interface
0x1000003 ...00 10 a4 86 6a 9f ...... Intel(R) PRO PCI Adapter
0x24000004 ...00 53 45 00 00 00 ...... WAN (PPP/SLIP) Interface
===========================================================================
===========================================================================
Active Routes:
Network Destination Netmask Gateway Interface Metric
0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 10.1.55.254 10.1.55.162 1
10.1.52.246 255.255.255.255 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 1
10.1.52.247 255.255.255.255 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
10.1.55.0 255.255.255.0 10.1.55.162 10.1.55.162 1
10.1.55.162 255.255.255.255 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 1
10.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
10.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.1.55.162 10.1.55.162 1
127.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 127.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 1
224.0.0.0 224.0.0.0 10.1.52.246 10.1.52.246 1
224.0.0.0 224.0.0.0 10.1.55.162 10.1.55.162 1
255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.1.55.162 10.1.55.162 1
Default Gateway: 10.1.52.246
===========================================================================
Persistent Routes:
None

Of note, my local lan (smc/ethernet) gateway address is 10.1.55.254. The remote segment (ras) gateway is 10.1.52.246.

Thanks!

 

[ajf3]

Argh! I just edited the msg to try and get the cols lines up - looked fine in the editor, but when I save it, it smashes it all back together - sorry!

 

[spidey07]

make sure the properties of your dial-up adapter have "use default gateway of remote network" is checked.

 

[ajf3]

I took a look and it is checked... the trace also says that it is using the 10.1.52.246 remote network gateway as the default router...

When bos the lan and ras are connected on M1, I am able to ping the remote gateway (10.1.52.246). I tried one of the remote machines I need to connect to both by name (xxxsqlserver1) and ip (10.1.55.137) - the name ping returned "unknown host" and the ip ping timed out.

Seems like I can see the gateway, but nothing that it is supposed to route me to - either by name or ip...

 

[Psychoholic]

<< I tried one of the remote machines I need to connect to both by name (xxxsqlserver1) and ip (10.1.55.137) - the name ping returned "unknown host" and the ip ping timed out. >>


Hmm..., okay if the ping doesn't find the remote server by IP multi-homing and lmhosts are a non-issue right now.

Are you sure you're on the right subnet for the PPP adapter???

 

[ajf3]

Man - I thought we were onto something! As for the subnet:

M1 connected via RAS (phone) and plugged into the ethernet. Can't see remote segement.
LAN: (same as above)
IP: 10.1.55.162
SUB: 255.255.255.0
Gateway 10.1.55.254
PPP adapt:
IP: 10.1.52.246
SUB: 255.255.255.255
GATE: 10.1.52.246

M1 connected via ras (phone) ethernet not plugged in:
LAN:
cable disconnected
PPP adapt: (same as above)
IP: 10.1.52.246
SUB: 255.255.255.255
GATE: 10.1.52.246

The subnet of my ppp connection is 255.255.255.255, but my local lan is 255.255.255.0 - not sure if that makes a diff or not. Is there a way to change my SMC to use .255 instead of .0? I've included the trace routes above (ras connected, both on and off lan) if that helps...

Thanks again!

 

[Garion]

Ignore the subnet masks provided by the PPP link - They are pretty much worthless.

Something is wrong here - You say your PC and your SMC Router are using the IP subnet of 10.1.55.x (Your PC is 162 and your router is 254).

You refer to the SQL server you're trying to connect to having an IP address of 10.1.55.137, and you say it's across the dial-up link. It's a bit confusing following all the threads, but I think that's correct.

If this is the case, you'll NEVER be able to ping that IP - You are using the same subnet locally as you're using at the remote site. Your PC will automatically assume that any traffic for any machine on that subnet goes out the Ethernet port and won't ever send it out the PPP connection.

Double-check that I'm not missing something and that all the IP addresses are correct that you've got here and we'll go from there.

- G

 

[ajf3]

That's right... I set up the local net to be 10.1.55.x thinking it would be more compatible with the remote network... are you saying that I should change that? If so, does it need to be any particular value - ie, should I just try 10.1.54.xxx instead?

 

[ajf3]

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Garion - you RULE! I really appreciate everyone's help, but Garion nailed it on his last post. I went ahead & reconfig'd the smc to run on 10.1.54.xxx, did a /release /renew on the laptop, rebooted the router and... IT WORKS LIKE A FREAKIN' top.

I can PCAnywhere into M1, establish my RAS connection to the remote network from there & everything works fine!

Thanks again - I really appreciate all you guys taking time to try and get this set up for me!