News Permenent ATF (not forum) leader position will remain open as it has since 2015!

[Amol S.]

Bureau of Alcohol, Tabaco, Firearm, and Explosives, has not had a leader since 2015. Biden's nominee to fill this leader position has withdrawn as some Democrats in the Senate are against Bidens choice for the position.

White House withdraws ATF nominee Chipman after Senate support falls short

David Chipman was voted out of committee in a tie vote on June 24, but Majority Leader Chuck Schumer has not brought him up on the Senate floor.

www.nbcnews.com

Both Democrats and Republicans are worried with the alcohol and tobacco abuse problem, but they do not want to fix the issue with filling the leader position of the department that deals with the issue. Furthermore, our Democrat party that vows for stricter gun laws, have politicians that do not want to have a permenent director.

 

[SmCaudata]

It's a joke. Senate should be confirming qualifications and security concerns. Why do a group of 52 people representing a minority of the voting populace have this much power? If there were a national popular vote for this guy, he'd be approved easily.

 

[MrSquished]

It's a joke. Senate should be confirming qualifications and security concerns. Why do a group of 52 people representing a minority of the voting populace have this much power? If there were a national popular vote for this guy, he'd be approved easily.

The American system of government is essentially broken. It has not stood the test of time particularly well these last 20 years. The Senate is broken, the Supreme Court is broken, and electing the president is broken (EC). Literally every branch is fucked up.

 

[Leeea]

It's a joke. Senate should be confirming qualifications and security concerns. Why do a group of 52 people representing a minority of the voting populace have this much power? If there were a national popular vote for this guy, he'd be approved easily.

Because we never have had a free or fair election in the history of this country. We live in a corrupt republic, that gives lip service to democracy while systemically preventing and discouraging citizens from voting from day one.

Originally only white land owners were allowed to vote, and while improved, this continues to be the goal in the majority of precincts.

 

[Moonbeam]

Because we never have had a free or fair election in the history of this country. We live in a corrupt republic, that gives lip service to democracy while systemically preventing and discouraging citizens from voting from day one.

Originally only white land owners were allowed to vote, and while improved, this continues to be the goal in the majority of precincts.

Not whites but male whites, same as today. Women if left to their own devices might abort your rape baby. They are dangerous.

 

[woolfe9998]

Yeah, that's true, but bear in mind that when the republic was formed with the limited franchise, no one else in the world was even voting, anywhere.

 

[SmCaudata]

Yeah, that's true, but bear in mind that when the republic was formed with the limited franchise, no one else in the world was even voting, anywhere.

That's likening stopping your training in anything the first time you do something right. I know you aren't trying to defend the behavior, but you highlight the main problem with this country. Too many are so proud to be born in America, they fail to recognize that innovation and change is what made us great. Going backwards is about as unpatriotic as you can get.

 

[woolfe9998]

That's likening stopping your training in anything the first time you do something right. I know you aren't trying to defend the behavior, but you highlight the main problem with this country. Too many are so proud to be born in America, they fail to recognize that innovation and change is what made us great. Going backwards is about as unpatriotic as you can get.

But we didn't stop the first time we got something right. Later we enacted the 19th Amendment, and after that, the Voting Rights Act. Recently we have been regressing, entirely because of a regressive political party. That is clearly unacceptable.

I think the reason I posted that is because someone up thread said "we never have had a free or fair election in the history of this country." First of all, "free and fair" are relative terms. If you want to complain that women and blacks weren't allowed to vote at the outset, well this WAS the 18th century after all. No one else anywhere was voting for anyone back then. I thought it was fair to point that out as historical context.

 

[SmCaudata]

But we didn't stop the first time we got something right. Later we enacted the 19th Amendment, and after that, the Voting Rights Act. Recently we have been regressing, entirely because of a regressive political party. That is clearly unacceptable.

I think the reason I posted that is because someone up thread said "we never have had a free or fair election in the history of this country." First of all, "free and fair" are relative terms. If you want to complain that women and blacks weren't allowed to vote at the outset, well this WAS the 18th century after all. No one else anywhere was voting for anyone back then. I thought it was fair to point that out as historical context.

I get that. The issue is that many of the things you mentioned happened after other countries did it. So while the US is first at some point they quickly fell behind, and now we're regressing.

 

[woolfe9998]

I get that. The issue is that many of the things you mentioned happened after other countries did it. So while the US is first at some point they quickly fell behind, and now we're regressing.

Dunno exactly when other countries did. Checked the UK on the women vote as an example. Women over 30 got the right to vote there in 1918. All women over 18 in 1928. US 19A was passed in 1919. So it was about neck and neck.

Checked France, too. Didn't happen there until 1944, literally while the allies were still physically pushing Germany out of France, De Gaulle's government in exile voted to allow it.

Checked Canada. It happened there province by province rather than nationally. The first to allow it occurred in 1914. The last, in 1940.

I think you'll find that all democracies did not initially permit women to vote. And that we were quite competitive with the rest of them on the timing of it.

Blacks had the right to vote since 1865, but the right was infringed by many states and localities until federal legislation was passed in 1965.

I think there's a tendency to react to current events like these suppression laws the GOP is passing right now and apply them retroactively. I don't agree that the US has been bad with voting rights historically, not in a comparative sense.

 

[rommelrommel]

The ATF is a disaster and hardly needs to exist. Why the USA has so many federal policing entities is incomprehensible.

 

[Brainonska511]

The ATF is a disaster and hardly needs to exist. Why the USA has so many federal policing entities is incomprehensible.

The ATF exists because it keeps enforcement in that area neutered compared to just folding it under the FBI.

 

[Zorba]

It's a joke. Senate should be confirming qualifications and security concerns. Why do a group of 52 people representing a minority of the voting populace have this much power? If there were a national popular vote for this guy, he'd be approved easily.

There are far far too many political appointees. Thanks Regan.

 

[Moonbeam]

But we didn't stop the first time we got something right. Later we enacted the 19th Amendment, and after that, the Voting Rights Act. Recently we have been regressing, entirely because of a regressive political party. That is clearly unacceptable.

I think the reason I posted that is because someone up thread said "we never have had a free or fair election in the history of this country." First of all, "free and fair" are relative terms. If you want to complain that women and blacks weren't allowed to vote at the outset, well this WAS the 18th century after all. No one else anywhere was voting for anyone back then. I thought it was fair to point that out as historical context.

I agree. It doesn't happen enough in my opinion. I think it springs from the irrationality caused by fear.