Performance Review : Rise of the Tomb Raider

[sontin]

So, they cant optimized it for AMD. They dont say they are not allowed to optimize it.

This is a huge difference. Hairworks is using Tessellation and nVidia is 2x to 4x faster with it.

 

[Gikaseixas]

Don't blame AMD. If say BMW would bribe all tire manufacturers so that all tires suck expect on BMW do you blame the tire manufacturer, BMW or the other car companies?

This is just another reason to never buy NV.
How to solve this:

Stop buying tires from bribed manufactures and stop buying BMWs. I think you get what I mean.

Very well said
Devs should be putting out working products, not games that depend on Hardware vendors optimizations. Like someone said, Gimpworks is making PC gaming less enjoyable.

 

[NTMBK]

I'm dangerously close to quitting PC gaming...

My tip- relax, don't spend so much time worrying about these things, and wait a couple of months to buy a game so a) it gets cheaper and b) drivers get updated/game bugs get patched. It's not like there's any shortage of great games to play 🙂

 

[Gikaseixas]

My tip- relax, don't spend so much time worrying about these things, and wait a couple of months to buy a game so a) it gets cheaper and b) drivers get updated/game bugs get patched. It's not like there's any shortage of great games to play 🙂

And what if i want to enjoy this game now? Serious question.

I have to worry because we don't know if our very capable GPU's will perform acceptably, and by capable GPU's i mean GTX 780, GTX 780TI, GTX 970, GTX 980, 390, 390X, Fury/X, Nano, etc

 

[Techhog]

My tip- relax, don't spend so much time worrying about these things, and wait a couple of months to buy a game so a) it gets cheaper and b) drivers get updated/game bugs get patched. It's not like there's any shortage of great games to play 🙂

This stuff rarely improves. In fact, it often gets worse.

 

[zlejedi]

You should update yourself with the benchmarks for Far Cry 4, ACU, Watch Dogs, Dying Light, and Witcher 3 before you make such false statements. AMD is very competitive and even faster in some of those titles at most market segments. For most of these titles, the uplift in AMD performance came from official game patches a few months post release.

So no, it's got nothing to do with open world games, it's GimpWorks.

Was it a conspiracy that Intel back in the days threw their $$ around to gimp AMD? Because the international court of law didn't think it was a conspiracy.

GameWorks is a PR war and NV has more $$ to throw at it than AMD.

Oh like this test done few weeks ago on most recent drivers which shows GTX 960 gaining huge lead over 380 in CPU dependant places?

Even in neutral game like GTA V ?

http://www.purepc.pl/karty_graficzn...0_vs_fx_6300_oraz_gtx_960_vs_r9_380?page=0,15

AMD GPUs are only bit faster when they are paired with highly overclocked i5/i7 cpu from test rigs. Put them in actual lower end rig with i3 or FX6300 and that advantage disappears.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Actually, even the devs are blaming Nvidia now:

AMD's Richard Huddy
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/...s-completely-sabotaged-witcher-3-performance/


Witcher 3 Dev says Nvidia HairWorks unoptimizable for AMD GPUs

Here is a statement made by CD Project's Marcin Momot, claiming that Nvidia's HairWorks code cannot be optimized to perform well on AMD GPUs;


http://www.overclock3d.net/articles...nvidia_hairworks_unoptimizable_for_amd_gpus/1


The problem, as always, appears to be Nvidia's steadfast refusal to open up GameWorks so that AMD and developers can more easily optimize TWIMTBP titles for Radeon hardware.

Richard Huddy, now there is an objective source.

 

[Techhog]

Oh like this test done few weeks ago on most recent drivers which shows GTX 960 gaining huge lead over 380 in CPU dependant places?

Even in neutral game like GTA V ?

http://www.purepc.pl/karty_graficzn...0_vs_fx_6300_oraz_gtx_960_vs_r9_380?page=0,15

AMD GPUs are only bit faster when they are paired with highly overclocked i5/i7 cpu from test rigs. Put them in actual lower end rig with i3 or FX6300 and that advantage disappears.

You say this as if everyone uses lower end GPUs and CPUs. Before you respond to this, save me some time and look at the Steam survey yourself.


As far as I'm concerned, all of you guys in favor of GameWorks are just sheep blinding yourselves to the truth because you need to believe that Nvidia can do no wrong for the sake of your own egos.

 

[frozentundra123456]

My tip- relax, don't spend so much time worrying about these things, and wait a couple of months to buy a game so a) it gets cheaper and b) drivers get updated/game bugs get patched. It's not like there's any shortage of great games to play 🙂

Bingo, well said. There is way, way too much drama and venom in this forum. Seems like every thread devolves into bashing Gameworks. It may be the most evil software library ever created /sarcasm/ but turn it off, turn down some settings, wait for some patches, etc. These are just games after all, nobody's life is depending on get 60 FPS minimum instead of 45. I have a low end AMD card, and although performance isnt great, I have enjoyed very much Witcher 3 and Fallout 4. I dont really worry if the games would perform better on an nVidia card or if Gameworks is gimping my performance, I just adjust the settings to what I can play and enjoy the games.

Edit: and actually, the worst performance period I had in W3 was for a few days, because AMD's own software kindly "optimized" the game on a HD7770 by turning the settings to medium with Hairworks on, after I had manually set it to low and hairworks off.

 

[96Firebird]

Bingo, well said. There is way, way too much drama and venom in this forum. Seems like every thread devolves into bashing Gameworks. It may be the most evil software library ever created /sarcasm/ but turn it off, turn down some settings, wait for some patches, etc. These are just games after all, nobody's life is depending on get 60 FPS minimum instead of 45. I have a low end AMD card, and although performance isnt great, I have enjoyed very much Witcher 3 and Fallout 4. I dont really worry if the games would perform better on an nVidia card or if Gameworks is gimping my performance, I just adjust the settings to what I can play and enjoy the games.

Edit: and actually, the worst performance period I had in W3 was for a few days, because AMD's own software kindly "optimized" the game on a HD7770 by turning the settings to medium with Hairworks on, after I had manually set it to low and hairworks off.

A lot of posters here are very emotional, instead of logical like you. Its like when you're girlfriend or wife comes home and complains about work; instead of offering a solution to her problems, she'd rather hear you sympathize with her misery.

 

[zlejedi]

You say this as if everyone uses lower end GPUs and CPUs. Before you respond to this, save me some time and look at the Steam survey yourself.

You think this is limited to just low end ?

Jump to 970/390 and non-oc i5 vs FX8.... and result will be the same

http://www.purepc.pl/karty_graficzn...0_vs_fx_8300_oraz_gtx_970_vs_r9_390?page=0,15


If you go with fastest possible CPU you might get away with using AMD gpu because cpu bottleneck will be located above 60 fps needed for typical monitor but it's still there.

It's also perfectly visible in DF analysis of 970 vs 390

The battle between the GTX 970 and the R9 390 is fascinating. With frame-rates unlocked and settings maxed at 1080p, the Nvidia card provides a 47.5fps average, matched up against 48.8fps on AMD - but it doesn't tell the full story. Some sections of gameplay see the GTX 970 pull ahead by up to 5fps, while interior scenes, cut-scenes and close-ups see the R9 390 dominant.

Interiors and cutscenes where cpu doesn't matter that much - 390 pulls ahead
Outside where cpu has lot more to do - 970 gets ahead.

 

[Techhog]

Bingo, well said. There is way, way too much drama and venom in this forum. Seems like every thread devolves into bashing Gameworks. It may be the most evil software library ever created /sarcasm/ but turn it off, turn down some settings, wait for some patches, etc. These are just games after all, nobody's life is depending on get 60 FPS minimum instead of 45. I have a low end AMD card, and although performance isnt great, I have enjoyed very much Witcher 3 and Fallout 4. I dont really worry if the games would perform better on an nVidia card or if Gameworks is gimping my performance, I just adjust the settings to what I can play and enjoy the games.

Edit: and actually, the worst performance period I had in W3 was for a few days, because AMD's own software kindly "optimized" the game on a HD7770 by turning the settings to medium with Hairworks on, after I had manually set it to low and hairworks off.

I guess you're right. There really isn't anything wrong with this game.

Yep, nothing wrong with needing an overclocked 5960X and at leat two highly overclocked 980 Ti's to get 1080p60 at max settings with FXAA. Nothing at all.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Yep, nothing wrong with needing an overclocked 5960X and at leat two highly overclocked 980 Ti's to get 1080p60 at max settings with FXAA. Nothing at all.

You forgot to mention 970 SLI delivers the same. Its a 60FPS capped game. It runs 30fps on console.

 

[raghu78]

Bingo, well said. There is way, way too much drama and venom in this forum. Seems like every thread devolves into bashing Gameworks. It may be the most evil software library ever created /sarcasm/ but turn it off, turn down some settings, wait for some patches, etc. These are just games after all, nobody's life is depending on get 60 FPS minimum instead of 45. I have a low end AMD card, and although performance isnt great, I have enjoyed very much Witcher 3 and Fallout 4. I dont really worry if the games would perform better on an nVidia card or if Gameworks is gimping my performance, I just adjust the settings to what I can play and enjoy the games.

Edit: and actually, the worst performance period I had in W3 was for a few days, because AMD's own software kindly "optimized" the game on a HD7770 by turning the settings to medium with Hairworks on, after I had manually set it to low and hairworks off.

The point here is Nvidia is intentionally using Gameworks games as a tool to harm the competition's performance. The first game reviews are rarely updated after future game patches and driver updates. Even when a site does it the intial damage has been done and the perception that AMD sucks has been reinforced. Most people look up benchmarks when a game releases and they think ." AMD drivers suck. AMD cards suck." The truth is far from that. Anyway I think AMD needs to work their way to health slowly with a competitive Polaris architecture and then invest a lot more in Gaming Evolved and evangelizing the benefits of GPUOpen to the developer community. What Nvidia is doing with Gimpworks is actually moving more PC gamers to console gaming.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Bingo, well said. There is way, way too much drama and venom in this forum. Seems like every thread devolves into bashing Gameworks. It may be the most evil software library ever created /sarcasm/ but turn it off, turn down some settings, wait for some patches, etc. These are just games after all, nobody's life is depending on get 60 FPS minimum instead of 45. I have a low end AMD card, and although performance isnt great, I have enjoyed very much Witcher 3 and Fallout 4. I dont really worry if the games would perform better on an nVidia card or if Gameworks is gimping my performance, I just adjust the settings to what I can play and enjoy the games.

Edit: and actually, the worst performance period I had in W3 was for a few days, because AMD's own software kindly "optimized" the game on a HD7770 by turning the settings to medium with Hairworks on, after I had manually set it to low and hairworks off.

+1 :thumbsup:

 

[ShintaiDK]

The point here is Nvidia is intentionally using Gameworks games as a tool to harm the competition's performance. The first game reviews are rarely updated after future game patches and driver updates. Even when a site does it the intial damage has been done and the perception that AMD sucks has been reinforced. Most people look up benchmarks when a game releases and they think ." AMD drivers suck. AMD cards suck." The truth is far from that. Anyway I think AMD needs to work their way to health slowly with a competitive Polaris architecture and then invest a lot more in Gaming Evolved and evangelizing the benefits of GPUOpen to the developer community. What Nvidia is doing with Gimpworks is actually moving more PC gamers to console gaming.

Always some ones else fault. I think we got that after so many years of repeat. :thumbsdown:

PC gaming is growing in case you missed it.

 

[Techhog]

A lot of posters here are very emotional, instead of logical like you. Its like when you're girlfriend or wife comes home and complains about work; instead of offering a solution to her problems, she'd rather hear you sympathize with her misery.

These games are getting worse and worse to the point that you need an enthusiast system to get a benefit over consoles a all just to keep Nvidia's wallet full by abusing their monopoly to force people to upgrade every 6 months. Can you really say with a straight face that the pros of GameWorks outweigh the cons?


I'm calling it now: single card 4k will not be any better in 5 years than it is now thanks to GameWorks.

 

[moonbogg]

You forgot to mention 970 SLI delivers the same. Its a 60FPS capped game. It runs 30fps on console.

60fps capped? Jesus Christ screw this game. I almost considered buying it.

 

[Techhog]

Always some ones else fault. I think we got that after so many years of repeat. :thumbsdown:

PC gaming is growing in case you missed it.

I love how here you're saying that PC gaming is growing, yet you're always the first to say that desktops and dGPUs are on the way out. Whatever is convenient for your agenda I suppose. 🙂

 

[Techhog]

You forgot to mention 970 SLI delivers the same. Its a 60FPS capped game. It runs 30fps on console.

There you go again, stating assumptions as fact. Even if that were the case, it still means that you need SLI to run the game at 1080p. That's only acceptable to fanboys.

 

[Techhog]

60fps capped? Jesus Christ screw this game. I almost considered buying it.

Actually, it looks more like Nvidia capped it for their testing.

Still, the game isn't worth more than $5 on PC, like all GimpWorks games. I really should have learned my lesson about preordering after Arkham Knight. I have now, though I'm turned off to gaming in general at this point. I'm 24 now, and maybe it's time to grow up...

 

[Azix]

Richard Huddy, now there is an objective source.

huddy is legit, and that statement does not require that much objectivity. Its just saying what happened. They were working with cdp, then gameworks code came and messed things up. end of story.

You think this is limited to just low end ?

Jump to 970/390 and non-oc i5 vs FX8.... and result will be the same

http://www.purepc.pl/karty_graficzn...0_vs_fx_8300_oraz_gtx_970_vs_r9_390?page=0,15


If you go with fastest possible CPU you might get away with using AMD gpu because cpu bottleneck will be located above 60 fps needed for typical monitor but it's still there.

Results a little low for 1080p but yes you are better off making sure the CPU is adequate.

It's also perfectly visible in DF analysis of 970 vs 390


Interiors and cutscenes where cpu doesn't matter that much - 390 pulls ahead
Outside where cpu has lot more to do - 970 gets ahead.

you should watch the video. when he says interiors and cutscenes it seems to not matter, but the scenes he's talking about actually had the most going on. the 970 was faster in regular exploration scenes with no action iirc. It might be drawcall related or some effect they have on during those areas. The FPS is generally higher in action scenes compared to exploring open spaces. I think I see something similar in rainbow six when it comes to snow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHhPOvlnLGM

You are better off with the 390 though since it pulls ahead in action scenes where you are doing more than walking around.

 

[Headfoot]

The first Tomb Raider was really a lot of fun, I plan on getting this one but I'm going to wait for a sale and the performance to shake out

 

[Rvenger]

If I hear one more person bashing Gameworks this thread will be acted upon. Its not the appropriate topic.


-Rvenger

 

[ShintaiDK]

I love how here you're saying that PC gaming is growing, yet you're always the first to say that desktops and dGPUs are on the way out. Whatever is convenient for your agenda I suppose. 🙂

PC is used for a lot more than gaming. GTX and K models had sales record. Steam got user records. PC gaming have never been more healthy.