- Oct 30, 2000
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Right now Iran has no operational F14s (that are combat ready)
This reduces their ability to project force into the Gulf and threaten the ME.
Should they get operational some A/C then point #2 is moot.
Any A/C that is flyable can generate an opportunity to destroy some type of the opponent military (ground/air/sea). Why take the chance on losing something/body when there is no need to do so.
Ok, now I'm curious: give us a link to one of those military forums where they compare an F-14 and a Mig-29.
ProfJohn
Lifer
- Jul 28, 2006
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I am curious if Iran would even risk an aircraft against Israel in a ?dog fight?
Remember during Gulf War 1 when all the Iraqi jets that took off quickly ran for the hills the second an allied fighter started to head their direction? 38 Iraqi jets were shot down during the first Gulf War without the lose of a single allied jet in air to air combat.
Also remember that in the 1982 war in Lebanon 86 MiGs were shot down in total, all this without the loss of a single Israeli jet in air to air combat.
I suppose Iran will send up jets the second it learns an attack is underway, but not sure that will do any good.
Remember during Gulf War 1 when all the Iraqi jets that took off quickly ran for the hills the second an allied fighter started to head their direction? 38 Iraqi jets were shot down during the first Gulf War without the lose of a single allied jet in air to air combat.
Also remember that in the 1982 war in Lebanon 86 MiGs were shot down in total, all this without the loss of a single Israeli jet in air to air combat.
I suppose Iran will send up jets the second it learns an attack is underway, but not sure that will do any good.
Pens1566
Lifer
- Oct 11, 2005
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If it was a fully functional 14, the 29 or 27 wouldn't get close enough to kill it. You realize that 14s with Phoenix can fire from 70+ km away, right? So how would the Mig or Su kill it while it's trying to get away from the phoenix?
The point is, the 14 is still dangerous. Why give Iran the chance to field any at all?
Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Wrong quote friend, that was Aimster who claimed that
Oh crap sorry dude...
Edited.
Theyve flown F-14s in numerous of their military exercises in the recent months.
The same with all their military equipment, including helicopters that are U.S made.
They have been outfitted with the U.S Hawk missile.
Iran manufactures most of the spare parts (they claim 60-80%) and the rest they get from Russia. Iran provided Russia with an F-14 and a phoenix missile and in return Russia is giving assistance to the Iranians for their F-14 fleet (rumor).
They have not however flown large numbers of any kind of aircraft in any of the shows (including Migs). The last time Iran demonstrated their air power was I believe in the late 1980s maybe early 90s when they flew I believe 12-14 F-14s together to demonstrate that they were operational.
What difference does it make if Iran has our F-14 fleet? We will be attacking them in 6 months. It's not like Iran's pilots will know how to fly our F-14s. Most of their pilots probably never stepped foot inside an F-14.
In February the world has a choice. Sit and watch while Iran builds their nuclear program or attack it.
The U.S can take out Iran's air force in a matter of hours. Send in stealth aircraft launch hundreds of cruise misssiles at all their air bases and BOOM - gone. Bye bye Iranian air force.
They will not even be able to get a single aircraft in the air.
There is a reason Iran is not buying new aircraft from Russia in large numbers. They know they can never beat the U.S air force by having air fights.
If the U.S had no stealth aircraft and no cruise missiles then sure Iran might have a great chance with hundreds of Russian aircraft.
Pens1566
Lifer
- Oct 11, 2005
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How exactly would russia assist Iran with their 14s when in all probability the reason they wanted one from Iran was to reverse engineer it? They're supposed to get their first up close look at one, and immediately be able to supply parts/maintenance/support for it? The russians aren't that competent at that sort of thing to begin with.
Pens1566
Lifer
- Oct 11, 2005
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You're completely contradicting yourself. One post you say they've flown numerous missions blah blah blah. Then the next you say they haven't set foot in one. Which is it?
If the reason they aren't wasting money on new planes is because they wouldn't stand a chance, why are they wasting money on parts for old aircraft?
Are you really a brick wall, or is this thread an abberation?
It's not a recent thing. The deal was done years ago according to the rumors. This took place in the 80s, probably when Iran needed all the help they could get for their war with Iraq.
If you were Russia youd want an F-14. Iran who is a desperate country would have given Russia one in return for assistance. Just like Pakistan gave China an F-16. China basically copied the damn thing,
Major things like engines, etc Iran cannot build. There are rumors that Iran has put Russian engines on some of their F-14s.
Not all of Iran's pilots are F-14 pilots ....... Iran probably has a handful of experienced F-14 pilots.
In order for most of their pilots to be F-14 pilots Iran would need to put a lot of hours into their F-14 fleet. They dont have hours to spare or many spare parts.
That is why they hardly fly them. They only fly them when they want to show-off.
Not true, the Russians reverse engineered a B-29 part by part at the end of WWII, though by the time they got to the point of being able to manufacture them, the design was obsolete.
Pens1566
Lifer
- Oct 11, 2005
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A B-29 60 years ago isn't the same as an F14 today (or 10 years ago). There's been all kinds of reports since the USSR fell apart about their lack of technical abilities in certain areas. While excellent in germ warfare, not so excellent in aerospace or targeting systems.
Look at the russian MIG-31.
Any reverse engineering that came from the F-14 is said to have been found in the Mig-31.
Of course Russia claims none of it is true.
Their radar range is impressive as well as its long-range missiles.
R-33 Missile - Phoenix missile?
Zaslon -M - Range 250 miles - identical to what the F-14 has.
So you can thank mother Russia for helping Iran's air force stay very much alive.
A threat to their neighbors, sure. A threat to the U.S? Not a chance.
Any reverse engineering that came from the F-14 is said to have been found in the Mig-31.
Of course Russia claims none of it is true.
Their radar range is impressive as well as its long-range missiles.
R-33 Missile - Phoenix missile?
Zaslon -M - Range 250 miles - identical to what the F-14 has.
So you can thank mother Russia for helping Iran's air force stay very much alive.
A threat to their neighbors, sure. A threat to the U.S? Not a chance.
- Oct 30, 2000
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Note that in my comments, I mentioned combat ready
Northrup Grumman was responsible for mainting the A/C in such a state until the Shah fell.
Then NG pulled their people back.
After 20+ years, such critical knowledge has been lost.
Iran for years attempted to purchase illegally, F14 info (parts/manuals,etc) in order to maintain their fleet. They have pretty much failed in that attempt.
Also, they do not have a strong combat pilot training system.
However, again, why should we even consider putting our people in any higher risk by allowing them to have F14s that can be maintained in a combat state?
Northrup Grumman was responsible for mainting the A/C in such a state until the Shah fell.
Then NG pulled their people back.
After 20+ years, such critical knowledge has been lost.
Iran for years attempted to purchase illegally, F14 info (parts/manuals,etc) in order to maintain their fleet. They have pretty much failed in that attempt.
Also, they do not have a strong combat pilot training system.
However, again, why should we even consider putting our people in any higher risk by allowing them to have F14s that can be maintained in a combat state?
Originally posted by: Pens1566
How long between intro of the 14 and the Mig31? Loooooong time to turn that puppy out. What F14 missle has a range of 250nm again?
They'd be even less of a threat without F14 spare parts. Whole point of the thread.
Radar range , 250 miles.
What do you mean combat ready? They were used during the Iran-Iraq war.
If they can fly why wouldnt they be combat ready? They have even reverse engineered the Hawk missile to fit on the F-14 and they've shown that it works. They probably have R-33 missiles on them now.
Russia trains Iran's air force and supplies the parts. Not saying Russia is great, but good enough to keep Iran's air force in working condition.
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