PCI EXPRESS question

[bX510]

Are all the new vid cards pci express now? Is it faster? Comepared to agp, how much better is PCI EXPRESSS?

 

[dBTelos]

For a technical description of PCI-E and AGP buses you can always look it up on wiki. In short, PCI-E x16 is faster then the AGP bus. It seems that manufacturer are only making PCI-E video cards now, and the 7800GS was the last blast on AGP's way out. For the last question, it all depends.

 

[DaveSimmons]

AGP cards now usually cost more for the same performance, and the fastest cards are PCI-E only, so there is no good reason to buy a new system with AGP instead of PCI-E.

PCI-E is just more future-proof and is the slot that most motherboards are shipped with now.

PCI-E is 27.1894% better than AGP.

 

[Twsmit]

Originally posted by: bX510
Are all the new vid cards pci express now? Is it faster? Comepared to agp, how much better is PCI EXPRESSS?

Almost all new cards are PCIe. It is faster but only on the theoretical field. If there was an AGP x1900 card it would probably be just as fast as an PCIe.

PCIe is better because it allows for SLI and Crossfire, and its what the board manufacturers are designing and shipping. I'm not sure anyone thought PCIe would get adopted as swiftly as it did, or as broadly, but there is no reason to go AGP right now, your only hurting your current and future video card options.

PCIe doesnt offer much over AGP, but its what the suppliers are making and what the market is willing to buy.

 

[zagood]

PCI-e has the possibility of better bandwidth than AGP, afaik it hasn't been used yet (and AGP never reached its bandwidth limit in the first place).

Regardless of that, all the new tech is made in PCI-e.

AGP mobos useless? No. Will you be able to buy the latest video card and install it? No. But for a mid-level (lower mid-level in some people's eyes) gaming machine, AGP is fine for now. Limited in upgradeability, but for an inexpensive one-off addition to an existing system a 6600GT - 6800nu - x800 etc. will do you right.

-z

 

[bX510]

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

EDIT: Whats ULi and whats SLi? I am guessing ULi = AGP and SLi = PCI express

 

[secretanchitman]

Originally posted by: bX510

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

crossfire is ATi's version of multi-GPU technology. its pretty good when it works, but otherwise SLI is still hard to beat as its more mature and plenty of games work with it.

crossfire is a bit more complicated, as you need "crossfire ready" ati cards, crossfire mobo (a given), and a "crossfire master" card. while in SLI, all you need is 2 of the same gpu (2x6600GT, 2x7900GTX - doesnt matter which brand, they can be different) and you are set. most of nvidias PCI-E line of video cards support SLI out of the box.

yes, it may look like im agreeing for SLI, but thats just because i havent seen crossfire in action that much, and ive seen mostly more problems than solutions. crossfire isnt bad though. its darn good once it works thats all.

 

[bX510]

So wat is SLI actually for (i guess i am asking, wats the definition)? SLI for Nvidia and Crossfire for ATI? I like ATI better because I was told that their TV capture is much better then nVidia, but the crossfire seems to cahnge me mind because of it complexity.


I was looking at some PCI express mobos on newegg... Correct me if i am wrong, but it seems like all their boards are for socket 939? That means iw ould have to get sell my cpu too and get a new one.

 

[stevty2889]

Originally posted by: bX510

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

EDIT: Whats ULi and whats SLi? I am guessing ULi = AGP and SLi = PCI express

ULi=a chipset maker, that was recently bought out by Nvidia has nothing to do with SLI or Crossfire

SLI=Nvidia Dual graphics cards

Crossfire= ATI Dual graphics cards

You don't need to use SLI or Crossfire, only if you want to use dual video cards linked together. You don't need a motherboard that supports either if you plan to use a single video card like most people do. Only if you want to spend obscene amounts of money to have the highest possible performance would you need either.

EDIT: P.S. you also don't need an SLI ready power supply unless you are using dual graphics cards.

 

[Gagan]

http://www.pureoverclock.com/article22.html

Go here. This is living proof you can get the latest 7 series chipset on AGP for as much as the PCI e cards, you just need to look harder

 

[McRhea]

Yeah, I agree with what Stevty2889 said.

I am in the process of building a new computer from scratch, and I decided against getting a SLI or Crossfire system. The performance gained from having two video cards just didn't outweigh the cost of getting all the SLI or Crossfire components for me. *shrug*

So in other words, just because it's there doesn't mean you HAVE to get it to have a kick ass system. You'll save a lot of money by not going SLI/Crossfire.

 

[Madwand1]

It's not as if you really have a choice. The market's moved to PCIe; many of the good AGP boards can no longer be found; availability of AGP cards has shrunk. It wouldn't make much sense to spend a lot of money on a new expensive AGP video card when you'd get better value and life out of a PCIe card.

(I'm still using a MSI Neo2 AGP with a 6800 GT atm, but when I have a strong wish to upgrade, it'll certainly be to a new MB + PCIe video; at that time I hope to find a PCIe MB which still supports my CPU, so I won't have to change that and the RAM as well.)

 

[zagood]

Originally posted by: Gagan
http://www.pureoverclock.com/article22.html

Go here. This is living proof you can get the latest 7 series chipset on AGP for as much as the PCI e cards, you just need to look harder

Find a Gainward 7800GT AGP for sale. They made something like 1500 models and they're not even on the website anymore. The 7800GS AGP is a slower card...still damn fast, but that's about the limit of where companies are going to go with AGP.

-z

 

[pkme2]

PCI-e cards are gamers favorites now and AGP seems to be falling in popularity. I use both and with the newer mobos, pci-e seems to be the clear choice. I just built a new graphic workstation. My mobo was recommended by an AT regular and that why I went PCI-e.
My AGP cards are in my video rig and Linux 64, but it was practical for those machines.

 

[bX510]

Originally posted by: stevty2889

Originally posted by: bX510

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

EDIT: Whats ULi and whats SLi? I am guessing ULi = AGP and SLi = PCI express

ULi=a chipset maker, that was recently bought out by Nvidia has nothing to do with SLI or Crossfire

SLI=Nvidia Dual graphics cards

Crossfire= ATI Dual graphics cards

You don't need to use SLI or Crossfire, only if you want to use dual video cards linked together. You don't need a motherboard that supports either if you plan to use a single video card like most people do. Only if you want to spend obscene amounts of money to have the highest possible performance would you need either.

EDIT: P.S. you also don't need an SLI ready power supply unless you are using dual graphics cards.

Okay, let me get this straight. So... SLI means DUEL GRAPHIC cards. If the Video card doesn't say SLI or power supply or mobo, then it wont' work together. I am guessing that SLI vid cards dont work with crossfire mobo. Also, so wat do i look for in a mobo? I just want a mobo that can handle a ATI PCI EXPRESS video card and in the future, maybe i can add 2. A lot of the mobos i see on newegg are SLI ready. SLI is from nVidia right?

 

[amiyume]

PCI-E is superiority,AGP is the pastform...

 

[KayKay]

Originally posted by: bX510

Originally posted by: stevty2889

Originally posted by: bX510

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

EDIT: Whats ULi and whats SLi? I am guessing ULi = AGP and SLi = PCI express

ULi=a chipset maker, that was recently bought out by Nvidia has nothing to do with SLI or Crossfire

SLI=Nvidia Dual graphics cards

Crossfire= ATI Dual graphics cards

You don't need to use SLI or Crossfire, only if you want to use dual video cards linked together. You don't need a motherboard that supports either if you plan to use a single video card like most people do. Only if you want to spend obscene amounts of money to have the highest possible performance would you need either.

EDIT: P.S. you also don't need an SLI ready power supply unless you are using dual graphics cards.

Okay, let me get this straight. So... SLI means DUEL GRAPHIC cards. If the Video card doesn't say SLI or power supply or mobo, then it wont' work together. I am guessing that SLI vid cards dont work with crossfire mobo. Also, so wat do i look for in a mobo? I just want a mobo that can handle a ATI PCI EXPRESS video card and in the future, maybe i can add 2. A lot of the mobos i see on newegg are SLI ready. SLI is from nVidia right?

SLI = nvidia dual graphics cards
Crossfire = ATI dual graphics cards

If you would like two ATI video cards to work together, you will need a crossfire motherboard. There is a catch: You will need a "crossfire edition" video card from ATI to be your "master card".

an ATI video card will work on an SLI board, but not in SLI mode. And similarly for an nvidia card in crossfire

 

[stevty2889]

Originally posted by: bX510

Originally posted by: stevty2889

Originally posted by: bX510

Now i need more money to ugprade...

So might i ask, what is crossfire? If i upgrade mobo + video card, does that mean i have to get a SLI ready power supply?

EDIT: Whats ULi and whats SLi? I am guessing ULi = AGP and SLi = PCI express

ULi=a chipset maker, that was recently bought out by Nvidia has nothing to do with SLI or Crossfire

SLI=Nvidia Dual graphics cards

Crossfire= ATI Dual graphics cards

You don't need to use SLI or Crossfire, only if you want to use dual video cards linked together. You don't need a motherboard that supports either if you plan to use a single video card like most people do. Only if you want to spend obscene amounts of money to have the highest possible performance would you need either.

EDIT: P.S. you also don't need an SLI ready power supply unless you are using dual graphics cards.

Okay, let me get this straight. So... SLI means DUEL GRAPHIC cards. If the Video card doesn't say SLI or power supply or mobo, then it wont' work together. I am guessing that SLI vid cards dont work with crossfire mobo. Also, so wat do i look for in a mobo? I just want a mobo that can handle a ATI PCI EXPRESS video card and in the future, maybe i can add 2. A lot of the mobos i see on newegg are SLI ready. SLI is from nVidia right?

SLI is 2 Nvidia graphics cards, connected together, and you need an SLI compatible motherboard to use them.

Crossfire is for 2 ATI cards linked together, and you need a crossfire compatible motherboard.

An SLI ready power supply just means it's has good amperage on the 12v rail, and has 2 PCIe power connectors so it can power both video cards. An SLI ready power supply works with both Crossfire and SLI. It was just called SLI ready, because Nvidias SLI was out way before ATI released Crossfire.

If you are just using a single video card, it doesn't matter what you get. ATI an Nvidia cards will both work. You only need to get SLI or Crossfire specific motherboards if you are going to use SLI or Crossfire.

 

[bX510]

THANKS!!! Okay, now to pick out motherboards... hmmm any suggestions?

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: dBTelos
For a technical description of PCI-E and AGP buses you can always look it up on wiki. In short, PCI-E x16 is faster then the AGP bus. It seems that manufacturer are only making PCI-E video cards now, and the 7800GS was the last blast on AGP's way out. For the last question, it all depends.

But that does not mean the card will work any better. Curent testing shows that PCI-e x4 graphics give roughly the same frame rate as a full PCI-e x16 or AGP 4/8x.

Your best bet if you cannot decide when to upgrade is to buy a ULi M1695 based motherboard and keep your old but still very good AGP graphics card. When the time comes for a PCI-e card, just drop it right in and keep the AGP installed for some good 'ol triple or quad monitor action.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: bX510
THANKS!!! Okay, now to pick out motherboards... hmmm any suggestions?

This one with PCI-e x16, AGP 8X, and it is socket M2 upgradeable. Why not get the best of both worlds?

 

[bX510]

Originally posted by: Googer

Originally posted by: dBTelos
For a technical description of PCI-E and AGP buses you can always look it up on wiki. In short, PCI-E x16 is faster then the AGP bus. It seems that manufacturer are only making PCI-E video cards now, and the 7800GS was the last blast on AGP's way out. For the last question, it all depends.

But that does not mean the card will work any better. Curent testing shows that PCI-e x4 graphics give roughly the same frame rate as a full PCI-e x16 or AGP 4/8x.

Your best bet if you cannot decide when to upgrade is to buy a ULi M1695 based motherboard and keep your old but still very good AGP graphics card. When the time comes for a PCI-e card, just drop it right in and keep the AGP installed for some good 'ol triple or quad monitor action.

Sounds like a very good idea. I'll look into this too. Also, what is the difference between these two
PCI Express x16
PCI Express x1

So, googer... i can use my agp + my pci express for duel monitors right? If i use two montiors, will it be 1 big one or just a copy of the other screen.

EDIT: Is socket 939 more common ? I want a pci express board for 754... and i am picky, so when i choose all the stuff i want, its for socket 939.