Pawing forward with more Settlements away from possible peace

[Czar]

Dont even know why I still bother, but Soultrape making an apperance gave me some energy to keep this going.

First there is the oh so great prisoner release that happened yesterday, which is just so people know it is obviosly a smart political move on behalf of Israel. Creates a smoke screen for what is to come a fake good will. But if you do check it out deeper then these are the rest of the prisoners which Israel said it would release back in February when it released about half of those they promised to release. The PA have been pushing for Israel to finish the deal which finaly came through yesterday. Take notice that all of those prisoners had nothing to do with terror activities against Israel, so why were they in Israeli prisons in the first place?

Belive it or not, settlement activities seem to have been growing lately regardless of the Gaza pullout. And btw, support within Israel for the gaza pullout is dwindling, about 50% support it now, down from 59% two weeks ago.

In april Israel issued a tender for 3500 new homes in settlements in the West Bank, today they showed plans to add 22 homes. ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4605877.stm ). Even after Bush and Abbas met where Bush demanded Israel to stop all settlement buildups, yet again.

All this around the Jerusalem area, which Sharon said on Sunday

Sharon said that his government "will not negotiate Jerusalem" and will not make any concessions over "the Israeli capital, which is united and indivisible for eternity." He added that previous governments had agreed to Palestinian soldiers guarding the walls of the capital, "but those times are behind us. It will not happen."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/579474.html

Then take a look at this map of Jerusalem and the surrounding area.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/p.../middle_east_enl_1113312374/html/1.stm
Those 3500 homes are for the Maale Adumim settlment, which is to the right of Jerusalem, expanding its size. Also take notice of the route of the wall, which Israel has stated so often will not declare the final border of Israel after a settlement, hard to belive.

On a smaller scale it is much more hidden but just as devistating. In april Israel said it would start to dump waste from Israel to a place in the west bank. The effect it will have on ground water remains to be seen, but the sociological effect it haves on the population happens right away. The whole thing is ofcorse a breach of international laws and treaties concerning occupational powers. (http://www.smh.com.au/news/Middle-East-...04/05/1112489490692.html?oneclick=true / http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=560433)

The latest issue is conserning plans to demolish 88 palestinian homes in Eastern Jerusalem which house around 1000 people, and what to do with the land, ofcorse to build a archaeological park. The end result is connecting settlements in the area as well as driving 1000 people possibly away from Jerusalem.

The methood used is quite, interestint to say the least. No compensations will be offered to the owners, but instead obscure laws will be used. One of those regards that Palestinians require permits from Israel if they want to build homes, those are often nearly impossible to get so people are forced to build where they can. But there is hope, in a way, all homes built before 1967 are safe from that law, except that Israel can bar people from entering their own homes.

?The building offense runs out, but there?s no statute of limitations on using the illegal house, so we can bar residents from entering their homes even if we can?t destroy them,? he said, noting that it would be easier to destroy an abandoned house later on.

Attorney Sami Arshid, who represents some residents, says that demolition proceedings have also begun against pre-1967 houses by utilizing an unusual clause that permits a building to be razed without convicting the owners of code violations. "You convict the stone, not the man," Arshid said.

( http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/582340.html / http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4597401.stm )

So how does this look, Israel building illegal settlements in the West Bank, pulling away from Gaza and providing homes and money to the settlers while at the same time razing homes of palestinians in Jerusalem by force and providing nothing instead. Clear discrimination? hard to see it any other way.

 

[Czar]

^

 

[Forsythe]

*Bump*

Too tired to comment.

 

[Infohawk]

Israel wants violence. They want strife. Why? It gives them an excuse to grab more land. It's becoming increasingly likely that there will be no more Palestians at some point that actually live in Palestine. I just hope we won't forget that they were there at one point and that Israel pulled some 21st century ethnic cleansing on them.

 

[JackStorm]

It became painfully obvious to me long ago that neither side of the issue can be trusted to keep their word. Each side says one thing and does another. Quite frankly, I'm tired of listening to their doublespeak and lame excuses for doing what they do.

Both sides get two thumbs down from me for their phony effort to bring about peace.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Both sides get two thumbs down from me for their phony effort to bring about peace.

Only one side has ANY say. Israel dictates what goes on 100%.

And expecting Palestians to role over and die is ridiculous. What do you expect the Palestians to do? Get their land taken away without any resistance? Most Americans would be blowing a whole lot of stuff up if Israeli settlers were claiming their land.

 

[JackStorm]

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Both sides get two thumbs down from me for their phony effort to bring about peace.

Only one side has ANY say. Israel dictates what goes on 100%.

And expecting Palestians to role over and die is ridiculous. What do you expect the Palestians to do? Get their land taken away without any resistance? Most Americans would be blowing a whole lot of stuff up if Israeli settlers were claiming their land.

That's the thing. Neither side gives a flying fvck about peace. It's all about the land. I'd have infinitely more respect for a side that gives up some land in order to secure the rest for themselves (And hopefully peace), than one which continues enflame the issue and make it worse by trying to get everything. Which neither side is getting anyway, no matter how much they continue to blow things up or slowly grab land that isn't theirs.

It's like watching two kids going "It's mine!" "No, it's mine!" in an endless loop. It's not getting them anywhere.

Personally, if I was a Palestinian, I'd just say "Fine, keep the damn land you've already grabbed, asshole. But I'm keeping the rest." At least that'd be better than living in this endless cycle of violence.

Basically, both need to learn how to compromise. It would do them a world of good.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Personally, if I was a Palestinian, I'd just say "Fine, keep the damn land you've already grabbed, asshole. But I'm keeping the rest." At least that'd be better than living in this endless cycle of violence.

They tried that when they recognized the existence of Israel (which from an objective standpoint is quite an insult when it comes at your expense). I don't think there can be compromise when one side has all the power. Heck, this article is about an attempt to compromise but the Israelis aren't letting it happen. They could just give up the West Bank and Gaza, but they don't want to! They want it all.

 

[NJDevil]

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Personally, if I was a Palestinian, I'd just say "Fine, keep the damn land you've already grabbed, asshole. But I'm keeping the rest." At least that'd be better than living in this endless cycle of violence.

They tried that when they recognized the existence of Israel (which from an objective standpoint is quite an insult when it comes at your expense). I don't think there can be compromise when one side has all the power. Heck, this article is about an attempt to compromise but the Israelis aren't letting it happen. They could just give up the West Bank and Gaza, but they don't want to! They want it all.

And what about when Arafat rejected the offer for a Palestinian state? Do the Israelis get no credit for that offer? Or was that part of their plan to continue violence.

If you think Israelis like having their discos blown up, you live in a bizarre world

 

[JackStorm]

Originally posted by: Infohawk
Heck, this article is about an attempt to compromise but the Israelis aren't letting it happen. They could just give up the West Bank and Gaza, but they don't want to! They want it all.

Indeed they could give it up, and I would respect them if they did. But this piece of news just reinforces my opinion that the Israeli government is just as bad as their Palestinian counterpart when it comes to doublespeak.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: NJDevil

Frankly, I'm tired of dealing with Israeli apologists right now. Most people who aren't Muslim, Jewish, or Protestants understand that Israel is at ultimately at fault (at the very least they think both are at fault). Jews and evangelicals just don't want to recognize that not everyone shares their religious beliefs about who controls the holy land.

 

[JackStorm]

Originally posted by: NJDevil
And what about when Arafat rejected the offer for a Palestinian state? Do the Israelis get no credit for that offer? Or was that part of their plan to continue violence.

Yeah, Arafat had the chance to bring about a Palestinian state, but because he couldn't get everything, he didn't. That, however, doesn't excuse Israels continuous landgrab, which continues till this day. They need to stop and stop NOW, if they EVER hope to live in peace with the Palestinians.