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Parents w/ kids

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there are?

thats news to me

anyway my opinion on the OPs question is that you should introduce them to a lot, see what they like and support them if they want to go further with it

yeap. I agree. And only take it as serious as they take it. However, if they DON'T take it seriously, I don't think the kid should be in that sport/activity. As they may likely just be dragging it down for other kids on the team(s) that DO take it serioulsy in that case.
 
How is sports not learning? There is more to life than a text book and associated knowledge. WAY more.

My family, brothers, sisters, cousins, neices, nephews, dad, grandpa, sons, daughters... ALL OF US have always been very active in sports. It has done nothing but make us closer. Going to eachother's events. Cheering eachother on. Helping eachother up when we fail.... it has made us WAY closer.

Friends? Man... I don't think you can make better friends than ones than you work your ass off with towards a common goal.

Places importance on it? If there's no importance why do it? Not relate to life. Sports teaches you to win and lose with your head up... but not too high up. There's barely any better lesson in life to learn!

Damn, I got to go look out the window at the sky, Homerboy's talking sense again.
 
How is sports not learning? There is more to life than a text book and associated knowledge. WAY more.

My family, brothers, sisters, cousins, neices, nephews, dad, grandpa, sons, daughters... ALL OF US have always been very active in sports. It has done nothing but make us closer. Going to eachother's events. Cheering eachother on. Helping eachother up when we fail.... it has made us WAY closer.

Friends? Man... I don't think you can make better friends than ones than you work your ass off with towards a common goal.

Places importance on it? If there's no importance why do it? Not relate to life. Sports teaches you to win and lose with your head up... but not too high up. There's barely any better lesson in life to learn!

I, and truckloads of psychologists, would largely disagree with you. Many would agree with you too however, since much of it is based on warrant rather than neutral data. In order to reach a mutual understanding we would have to establish a perceived outcome goal. If our goals were incompatible, then obviously our views of the methods to that goal would have to differ as well.

There is more to life than textbooks, true. But there is NOTHING on the field that can't be learned somewhere else. I would also go further to state that many of the things learned on the field are destructive - both individually and in broader society. In other words, you can get the positives someplace else, without the associated negatives, thereby making them preferable instruments of instruction.

Much of my family was active in sports, and didn't get close at all. My friends and close family are totally uninterested in sports, yet are perfectly close. In other words, nothing sports does is exclusive to sports. And also again, it establishes negative paradigms. If your family is actively rooting for you, then they're rooting against the other team...this establishes the idea that everything is 'us versus them'. Moreover, what about the player who has no family to cheer him on? Does it not ostracize him further, reinforcing the isolation he likely already feels? I could go on for hundreds of pages, but you probably see where I'm going already.

Working towards a common goal can build comradarie, but so can many other things. More importantly, once you realize that all the hard work you put in was meaningless, or damaging, you've actually caused more harm. Not only do you feel the guilt for yourself, but you've actively wasted the time and energy of others. Not to mention most people will never reach the goal they strive for, whatever it is. There can only be one state champion each year, but there are dozens or hundreds of teams. One winner, all the rest losers. That's the worst possible lesson that can be focused on. It's the failing of the competitive model.

You place importance on the benefits, not the activity itself. You don't go to school because SCHOOL is important, you go to school because LEARNING is important, and school is just one place you can get that. Likewise, sports don't matter AT ALL, but fitness is good. Sports is nothing but one possible vessel for fitness. If the coach focuses on the benefits, and NOT the process, that's fine. But it's VERY rare to find one that does. They all think there's some kind of religion surrounding the sport, or sports in general. They promote the sport for the sports sake.

Also by focusing on winning or losing it's already a negative tool (depending on your warrant at least). Having your head up win or lose is a false dichotomy. Hold your head up by refusing to compete...now THERE's a valuable lesson.

As you can likely see by now we're essentially polar opposites in outlook. That makes even understanding each other very difficult, never mind reaching compromise. I would be fine to just go our separate ways, except the reality is that we'll both campaign for a society that impacts the other...me by marginalizing sports, you by emphasizing them. Just like the friction between religion or secular government, the truth is the two sides can never live harmoniously.
 
If I were to see blatant favoritism (against or for my kid to be honest), that would be discussed with the coach and if not resolved my child would be moved onto a different team or league. Simple as that.

As far as "not being able to play", as in maybe my kid wasn't "good enough" to play a certain position or something, that's life. Simple as that. Lesson learned. Little Billy has to learn that he won't always win and won't always get to do what he wants. HOWEVER, if he works hard he just might get that shot.

we ran into the favoritism and sexism in my daughters T-all team. there was 2 girls on the team.

my daughter was the best batter and ok in the field. she was not bad at it. the other girl? well she was more interested in the flowers near teh school.

but the coach would rarely put the 2 girls in. its a fricken 5-9 yr old team (was supposed to be 5-6 yr olds but didnt have enough to fill out either team) the rules say ALL kids play as close to equal amount. yet he would not put them in.

it also didn't help his son (8) would always pick on and abuse my daughter. when we talked to him he sat my daughter 2 weeks straight and said that if she can't handle it she shouldn't play (i wanted to kick his ass.) and had us taken off the mailing list and our check for next year was lost so she couldn't play.

she learned that some guys take sports far to seriously and ended up in gymnastics which she loves. but she got a life lesson she will remember..sadly.

but to use that as a excuse to not let her do something is insane. she wanted to do soccer, gymnastics, a dance class, football (yeah not going to happen..) and softball.

though i think 2 sports is enough but right now gymnastics is enough.
 
My kids are 7 and 6 and just started organized activities (outside of swimming lessons) for the first time this summer.

My son played baseball and my daughter is in gymnastics.

We don't take it especially seriously. I want them both to do their best and have fun. That's it.

Same here. Our 8 year old son (well, he'll be 8 in a few weeks) has been taking basketball lessons at the YMCA near our house. He enjoys it and he's actually pretty good at it.
 
yeap. I agree. And only take it as serious as they take it. However, if they DON'T take it seriously, I don't think the kid should be in that sport/activity. As they may likely just be dragging it down for other kids on the team(s) that DO take it serioulsy in that case.

exactly. you have expose them to everything. My rule is you have to stick with it for the time you signed up for and try your best. She has done that.

has she liked every sport? no. she loved tball and gymnastics though. the short soccer camp she was in she hated.
 
I, and truckloads of psychologists, would largely disagree with you. Many would agree with you too however, since much of it is based on warrant rather than neutral data. In order to reach a mutual understanding we would have to establish a perceived outcome goal. If our goals were incompatible, then obviously our views of the methods to that goal would have to differ as well.

There is more to life than textbooks, true. But there is NOTHING on the field that can't be learned somewhere else. I would also go further to state that many of the things learned on the field are destructive - both individually and in broader society. In other words, you can get the positives someplace else, without the associated negatives, thereby making them preferable instruments of instruction.

Much of my family was active in sports, and didn't get close at all. My friends and close family are totally uninterested in sports, yet are perfectly close. In other words, nothing sports does is exclusive to sports. And also again, it establishes negative paradigms. If your family is actively rooting for you, then they're rooting against the other team...this establishes the idea that everything is 'us versus them'. Moreover, what about the player who has no family to cheer him on? Does it not ostracize him further, reinforcing the isolation he likely already feels? I could go on for hundreds of pages, but you probably see where I'm going already.

Working towards a common goal can build comradarie, but so can many other things. More importantly, once you realize that all the hard work you put in was meaningless, or damaging, you've actually caused more harm. Not only do you feel the guilt for yourself, but you've actively wasted the time and energy of others. Not to mention most people will never reach the goal they strive for, whatever it is. There can only be one state champion each year, but there are dozens or hundreds of teams. One winner, all the rest losers. That's the worst possible lesson that can be focused on. It's the failing of the competitive model.

You place importance on the benefits, not the activity itself. You don't go to school because SCHOOL is important, you go to school because LEARNING is important, and school is just one place you can get that. Likewise, sports don't matter AT ALL, but fitness is good. Sports is nothing but one possible vessel for fitness. If the coach focuses on the benefits, and NOT the process, that's fine. But it's VERY rare to find one that does. They all think there's some kind of religion surrounding the sport, or sports in general. They promote the sport for the sports sake.

Also by focusing on winning or losing it's already a negative tool (depending on your warrant at least). Having your head up win or lose is a false dichotomy. Hold your head up by refusing to compete...now THERE's a valuable lesson.

As you can likely see by now we're essentially polar opposites in outlook. That makes even understanding each other very difficult, never mind reaching compromise. I would be fine to just go our separate ways, except the reality is that we'll both campaign for a society that impacts the other...me by marginalizing sports, you by emphasizing them. Just like the friction between religion or secular government, the truth is the two sides can never live harmoniously.

Most of your counterpoints are assuming that when I argued such examples as "sports brought my family close" I meant that it was the ONLY way to do it. Hardly so. I have a sister that NEVER played sports, and she is more or less the glue of the family at this point; the central hub.

I never meant to imply that sports is/was the end all and be all of life and learning. Not in the slightest. But to argue that it is not beneficial, let alone that it is possibly harmful and negative, I just find completely insane. Yes insane.

I'm talking using a healthy approach to sports. Not a "win at all costs" mentality. If kids are interested in the sports, and have a healthy attitude towards the sports and the parents are involved, then I simply do not see any harm... only growth that can come out if it.
 
I, and truckloads of psychologists, would largely disagree with you. Many would agree with you too however, since much of it is based on warrant rather than neutral data. In order to reach a mutual understanding we would have to establish a perceived outcome goal. If our goals were incompatible, then obviously our views of the methods to that goal would have to differ as well.

There is more to life than textbooks, true. But there is NOTHING on the field that can't be learned somewhere else. I would also go further to state that many of the things learned on the field are destructive - both individually and in broader society. In other words, you can get the positives someplace else, without the associated negatives, thereby making them preferable instruments of instruction.

Much of my family was active in sports, and didn't get close at all. My friends and close family are totally uninterested in sports, yet are perfectly close. In other words, nothing sports does is exclusive to sports. And also again, it establishes negative paradigms. If your family is actively rooting for you, then they're rooting against the other team...this establishes the idea that everything is 'us versus them'. Moreover, what about the player who has no family to cheer him on? Does it not ostracize him further, reinforcing the isolation he likely already feels? I could go on for hundreds of pages, but you probably see where I'm going already.

Working towards a common goal can build comradarie, but so can many other things. More importantly, once you realize that all the hard work you put in was meaningless, or damaging, you've actually caused more harm. Not only do you feel the guilt for yourself, but you've actively wasted the time and energy of others. Not to mention most people will never reach the goal they strive for, whatever it is. There can only be one state champion each year, but there are dozens or hundreds of teams. One winner, all the rest losers. That's the worst possible lesson that can be focused on. It's the failing of the competitive model.

You place importance on the benefits, not the activity itself. You don't go to school because SCHOOL is important, you go to school because LEARNING is important, and school is just one place you can get that. Likewise, sports don't matter AT ALL, but fitness is good. Sports is nothing but one possible vessel for fitness. If the coach focuses on the benefits, and NOT the process, that's fine. But it's VERY rare to find one that does. They all think there's some kind of religion surrounding the sport, or sports in general. They promote the sport for the sports sake.

Also by focusing on winning or losing it's already a negative tool (depending on your warrant at least). Having your head up win or lose is a false dichotomy. Hold your head up by refusing to compete...now THERE's a valuable lesson.

As you can likely see by now we're essentially polar opposites in outlook. That makes even understanding each other very difficult, never mind reaching compromise. I would be fine to just go our separate ways, except the reality is that we'll both campaign for a society that impacts the other...me by marginalizing sports, you by emphasizing them. Just like the friction between religion or secular government, the truth is the two sides can never live harmoniously.

Have I told you lately how much of a loon I think you are?
 
Most of your counterpoints are assuming that when I argued such examples as "sports brought my family close" I meant that it was the ONLY way to do it. Hardly so. I have a sister that NEVER played sports, and she is more or less the glue of the family at this point; the central hub.

I never meant to imply that sports is/was the end all and be all of life and learning. Not in the slightest. But to argue that it is not beneficial, let alone that it is possibly harmful and negative, I just find completely insane. Yes insane.

I'm talking using a healthy approach to sports. Not a "win at all costs" mentality. If kids are interested in the sports, and have a healthy attitude towards the sports and the parents are involved, then I simply do not see any harm... only growth that can come out if it.

Then you should sit down and read a few thousand pages on the psychology and societal impact of competitiveness, groupthink, fans, etc. It's all out there...people just don't want to see it because it challenges the pillars of their life and understanding. Or they simply have a polar opposite moral/ethical outlook, meaning the information reinforces their feelings and opinions. *shrug*
 
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Have I told you lately how much of a loon I think you are?

I'm sure all the international award winning academics who have studied the phenomenon and led me to my outlook will be just crushed to hear of your disdain for their work.

Oh wait, I forgot, you don't matter a diddler's shit so no one gives a fuck. Of course neither do I, but I was presented a direct confrontation/invitation to a previous post, so I felt obligated to respond. You, on the other hand, were merely an onlooker. 😎
 
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Then you should sit down and read a few thousand pages on the psychology and societal impact of competitiveness, groupthink, fans, etc. It's all out there...people just don't want to see it because it challenges the pillars of their life and understanding.

And you should see and feel the utter joy and accomplishment of winning and/or succedding as a team or individual. There is nothing like it in the world.

Quite honestly, I don't care what a couple dozen, or hundered psycologists say. I never am going to put much bank into a lot of their applied theories and ideas. If you go back in history and look, a lot of their ideals and conjunctures change over time... yet, as far as I can tell, people have always, since the dawn of time seemed to enojy healthy competition.

I hope you at least allow your kids to play card games and the occassional game of checkers.
 
Then you should sit down and read a few thousand pages on the psychology and societal impact of competitiveness, groupthink, fans, etc. It's all out there...people just don't want to see it because it challenges the pillars of their life and understanding.

And I'm sure there are about 5,000 other things that have similar studies behind them that people do all the time too. It probably burns you to your core that I say this but...most of us aren't going to amount to anything (significant) in our lives. We are just going to be simple people who want to fit in and have some fun along the way. Sports give us something to do, something to enjoy, some thing learn from, and something to talk about the next day at work/school/whatever.

Athletics teach competition (which is an absolutely desirable virtue in moderation), teamwork, coping with loss and success and makes you a stronger (physically and emotionally) person. In one activity. Not a half dozen others. Most of us just want to fit in and cary on with our lives. Athletics fill that niche for many.
 
And I'm sure there are about 5,000 other things that have similar studies behind them that people do all the time too. It probably burns you to your core that I say this but...most of us aren't going to amount to anything (significant) in our lives. We are just going to be simple people who want to fit in and have some fun along the way. Sports give us something to do, something to enjoy, some thing learn from, and something to talk about the next day at work/school/whatever.

Athletics teach competition (which is an absolutely desirable virtue in moderation), teamwork, coping with loss and success and makes you a stronger (physically and emotionally) person. In one activity. Not a half dozen others. Most of us just want to fit in and cary on with our lives. Athletics fill that niche for many.


Ummm no. I told my son already to work his ass off. I called dibs on his signing bonus!!!!
 
And you should see and feel the utter joy and accomplishment of winning and/or succedding as a team or individual. There is nothing like it in the world.

Quite honestly, I don't care what a couple dozen, or hundered psycologists say. I never am going to put much bank into a lot of their applied theories and ideas. If you go back in history and look, a lot of their ideals and conjunctures change over time... yet, as far as I can tell, people have always, since the dawn of time seemed to enojy healthy competition.

I hope you at least allow your kids to play card games and the occassional game of checkers.

Nope, because I know the incredible damage that event can cause.

Obviously you're an absolute neanderthal by your casual dismissing of intellectual pursuits. So, exactly as I originally commented, there's no possible way we can have meaningful discourse. We have polar opposite beliefs and fundamental makeup.

You also demonstrate clearly that you didn't really read any of my posts, since I clearly explained preparing her for participation in various endeavors, and the carefully considered (and supported) reasons for directing or limiting that participation to healthy avenues. Like most of your ilk you're wearing immense blinders to keep from having your delicate (and largely unsupportable) world view questioned. You are forced (by your extremely weakly developed psyche) to submit to logical fallacies and tactics to ignore or discredit others, embrace stereotypes, or act in any manner which protects your self assurance. In short, you're closing your eyes, covering your ears, stomping your feet, and screaming that things are the way you believe them to be, regardless of the mountain of reality looming down over you. It's common, and quite pathetic.
 
Why the hate for competition? It's rewarding to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.
 
Nope, because I know the incredible damage that event can cause.

Obviously you're an absolute neanderthal by your casual dismissing of intellectual pursuits. So, exactly as I originally commented, there's no possible way we can have meaningful discourse. We have polar opposite beliefs and fundamental makeup.

You also demonstrate clearly that you didn't really read any of my posts, since I clearly explained preparing her for participation in various endeavors, and the carefully considered (and supported) reasons for directing or limiting that participation to healthy avenues. Like most of your ilk you're wearing immense blinders to keep from having your delicate (and largely unsupportable) world view questioned. You are forced (by your extremely weakly developed psyche) to submit to logical fallacies and tactics to ignore or discredit others, embrace stereotypes, or act in any manner which protects your self assurance. In short, you're closing your eyes, covering your ears, stomping your feet, and screaming that things are the way you believe them to be, regardless of the mountain of reality looming down over you. It's common, and quite pathetic.

I see I simply can not compete with your imense wealth of knowledge. You are obviously WAY more evolved and intellectual than I could ever dream to be.

The world must be a horribly shitty place for you to live in. Really it must be. I feel sorry for you and your child(ren). Truly sad that you can't enjoy your life and only look at it through shit colored glasses.
 
Nope, because I know the incredible damage that event can cause.

Obviously you're an absolute neanderthal by your casual dismissing of intellectual pursuits. So, exactly as I originally commented, there's no possible way we can have meaningful discourse. We have polar opposite beliefs and fundamental makeup.

You also demonstrate clearly that you didn't really read any of my posts, since I clearly explained preparing her for participation in various endeavors, and the carefully considered (and supported) reasons for directing or limiting that participation to healthy avenues. Like most of your ilk you're wearing immense blinders to keep from having your delicate (and largely unsupportable) world view questioned. You are forced (by your extremely weakly developed psyche) to submit to logical fallacies and tactics to ignore or discredit others, embrace stereotypes, or act in any manner which protects your self assurance. In short, you're closing your eyes, covering your ears, stomping your feet, and screaming that things are the way you believe them to be, regardless of the mountain of reality looming down over you. It's common, and quite pathetic.

Ooh, nerd rage! Sometimes, learning that life can't always be 'clearly' or 'carefully' explained or, even 'prepared' for is a lesson you haven't learned. I believe in balance. Intellectual pursuits are neither limited or, inhibited by, sports activities. I was in the chess club, physics club and, started as left tackle on my HS football team which took city championship 3 years running.
 
And I'm sure there are about 5,000 other things that have similar studies behind them that people do all the time too. It probably burns you to your core that I say this but...most of us aren't going to amount to anything (significant) in our lives. We are just going to be simple people who want to fit in and have some fun along the way. Sports give us something to do, something to enjoy, some thing learn from, and something to talk about the next day at work/school/whatever.

Athletics teach competition (which is an absolutely desirable virtue in moderation), teamwork, coping with loss and success and makes you a stronger (physically and emotionally) person. In one activity. Not a half dozen others. Most of us just want to fit in and cary on with our lives. Athletics fill that niche for many.

It doesn't burn me at all, it's what I was saying. I also agreed that pursued purely for fun, or the benefits, there was NOTHING wrong with sports. I still play for fun with friends and family. It's the institution of sports which is corrupted and dangerous, especially when people refuse to acknowledge the potential harms.

There are an infinite number of things to enjoy, learn from, and talk about the next day. Several don't have the associated negatives.

I don't agree that competition is particularly desirable...though I suppose in very carefully controlled amounts and done with full understanding it's ok. I likewise don't agree that the manner in which the other benefits you list are taught through sports is necessarily positive...at least not without negatives which outweigh the benefits.

Fitting in I will object to with my very life. It's quite possibly the worst thing that can EVER be indulged in. While the human instinct to be a part of something is natural, it's INCREDIBLY harmful unless done with eyes fully opened to the possibilities. Far better to form a society inherently inclusive of all, than form sub-cultures which require adherence to divisionary traits.

I have also already agreed that for many, sports works for them. It's partially that they are seeking a different outcome, and partially because they choose to ignore the negatives. That's fine, for them, but again it leads us to a place where the two portions of society are acting against each other, and cannot ever reach an amicable compromise.
 
I see I simply can not compete with your imense wealth of knowledge. You are obviously WAY more evolved and intellectual than I could ever dream to be.

The world must be a horribly shitty place for you to live in. Really it must be. I feel sorry for you and your child(ren). Truly sad that you can't enjoy your life and only look at it through shit colored glasses.

No, like I said, we have two different warrants. We have opposite foundations and understandings of morality, importance, etc. We're just...different.

Life has its ups and downs. Society, for certain, is pretty tough to stomach. *shrug* but that's just the way it is. I work to change it, of course, but I hold no illusions about succeeding.
 
Don't all parents have kids?

Anyways ... What is the real question being asked? I think that activites, nto jsut sports are important. It's improtant to get your kids to try everything. If they don't like soemthing, fine. They don't have to do it. But they have to atleast try.

FWIW: My son seems most interested in the sports I have played. Like Hockey, baseball and soccer. He'll try them because of this. not necessarily love them though. He loves playing soccer though. Has no clue at the age of 5, but he loves running around the field.

In terms of social aspect. Your kids needs interests. They don't have to be sports. It can be music, drama or chess. They need to do soemthing with their time and in their youth, they don't have to work. It is the best and maybe only time in their life where they can get enriched with a diverse mix of activities.

Just don't pretend that your kids is getting a scholarship for anything.
 
Ooh, nerd rage! Sometimes, learning that life can't always be 'clearly' or 'carefully' explained or, even 'prepared' for is a lesson you haven't learned. I believe in balance. Intellectual pursuits are neither limited or, inhibited by, sports activities. I was in the chess club, physics club and, started as left tackle on my HS football team which took city championship 3 years running.

Participation in things doesn't necessarily infer understanding in them. 😎

Again, I have no problem with the activities, just the institutions. I also played most sports at some point in my life. However, I recognized the pitfalls, and went in with my eyes open. That's all I've asked for.

The problem is that others (Homerboy specifically and by his own admission) doesn't care at all about truth. He has no interest in information or facts, only living in his self-biased reality. That conscious dedication to ignorance is ENTIRELY different than simply choosing to be an auto mechanic instead of a theoretical physicist.
 
Participation in things doesn't necessarily infer understanding in them. 😎

Again, I have no problem with the activities, just the institutions. I also played most sports at some point in my life. However, I recognized the pitfalls, and went in with my eyes open. That's all I've asked for.

The problem is that others (Homerboy specifically and by his own admission) doesn't care at all about truth. He has no interest in information or facts, only living in his self-biased reality. That conscious dedication to ignorance is ENTIRELY different than simply choosing to be an auto mechanic instead of a theoretical physicist.

Something tells me you believe in truth with a capital 'T.' What makes the world go round is in the eye of the believer and following the concept that there is only one 'right' answer is a larger fallacy than any Homerboy has espoused.
 
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Princeofwands,

What would you say is the yardstick that you use for measuring your quality of life?

I wish I had the knowledge of psycology that you have, but in terms of a mental lattice work, one needs more than psycology.

For example, the health benefits of sport.

Of course, there are also social ramifications for kids that doesn't know what a deck of playing cards are. I'd hate for my kids to have depression issues over something so stupid.
 
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