Papers, Show Me Your Papers

[Patranus]

Lawmakers working to craft a new comprehensive immigration bill have settled on a way to prevent employers from hiring illegal immigrants: a national biometric identification card all American workers would eventually be required to obtain.

Under the potentially controversial plan still taking shape in the Senate, all legal U.S. workers, including citizens and immigrants, would be issued an ID card with embedded information, such as fingerprints, to tie the card to the worker.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/08/id-card-workers-center-immigration-plan/

So instead of actually solving the problem (closing off the border) the federal government would like to invade every legal citizens privacy.

I am sure this will be as unhackable as those RFID chips in the newer passports.

Under what constitutional justification can the federal government give for requiring me to have papers when if I and the work I output never crosses state lines?

 

[UberNeuman]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/08/id-card-workers-center-immigration-plan/

So instead of actually solving the problem (closing off the border) the federal government would like to invade every legal citizens privacy.

I am sure this will be as unhackable as those RFID chips in the newer passports.

Under what constitutional justification can the federal government give for requiring me to have papers when if I and the work I output never crosses state lines?

How would this nation "close off the borders" - and how much of the budget should be applied to it?

 

[palehorse]

I have no issue with the concept of a national ID as long as the only data on the card is the name, address, fingerprints, and retina scan. It's when they begin to add more data that I start questioning the concept... or when they begin demanding the ID without cause, at random times, and at random locations throughout the country.

It's a really tough issue to wrestle with and, IMO, it all depends on where they draw the line on data and who has access to said data.

Your question regarding Constitutionality is certainly the most important, but I don't have an answer for ya... 🙁

 

[First]

Good, the illegals will simply be legalized and we'll be far better off for it like we have been the past 30 years.

 

[palehorse]

How would this nation "close off the borders" - and how much of the budget should be applied to it?

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

 

[First]

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

True, but it's an image issue WRT to tolerance and openness as much as anything else. I mean, China's Great Wall does evoke a lot of good and powerful feelings, but acceptance and openness ain't one of them.

 

[Pocatello]

How would this nation "close off the borders" - and how much of the budget should be applied to it?

We can close the border, but there is no political willingness to close the border, just as there is no willingness to send illegals back.

 

[UberNeuman]

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

It is... now, how much will it be worth to secure it?

\there's a reason why it's not "secure" already...

 

[Sclamoz]

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

Will we be completely encircling the US with this great wall? Because if its just our southern border that we close off people can just use boats and head for the coasts.

 

[StageLeft]

Will we be completely encircling the US with this great wall? Because if its just our southern border that we close off people can just use boats and head for the coasts.

Not really. It's much harder to get to the US on a boat than across the land border. First, the obvious, you need a boat. Second, you'd be coming in from the sides of this wall and much easier to pick up by coast guard as you pop up on radar or are out there a sitting duck for a long time. If the US had a real secure land border it would all but cut off illegal immigration from the south; it would drop to single digit percent of former I'm sure.

 

[Double Trouble]

It is... now, how much will it be worth to secure it?

\there's a reason why it's not "secure" already...

Basically, neither party is particularly interested in actually closing the border, each for their own set of reasons. They all play lip service to the concept because the American people want it, but neither party wants to do it. Corporate interests want the cheap labor, and democrats know the vast majority of the illegals entering will some day vote democrat (after amnesty/legalization), and they don't want to alienate (pun) a large and growing segment of the population.

 

[boomerang]

Schumer wants to keep illegals from coming to this country? Somethings rotten and it's not in Denmark. There has to be another purpose for this legislation but one could only conjecture at this point.

It's immaterial, this legislation is dead at the starting gate.

 

[djmartins]

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

It is far easier to solve the illegal immigration problem.
Enforce the laws we currently have, especially the fines and jail sentences for employers of illegals.
Stop all financial aid to illegals and stop giving them driver's licenses,
bank loans, in state tuition at college, and credit cards.
What I am suggesting is less severe than what Mexico does to illegal immigrants in Mexico.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally Posted by Patranus
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...igration-plan/

So instead of actually solving the problem (closing off the border) the federal government would like to invade every legal citizens privacy.

I am sure this will be as unhackable as those RFID chips in the newer passports.

Under what constitutional justification can the federal government give for requiring me to have papers when if I and the work I output never crosses state lines?

How would this nation "close off the borders" - and how much of the budget should be applied to it?

If it tracks the every movement of Republicans then it's worth every penny.

 

[CycloWizard]

We could just get rid of the minimum wage, thereby removing the artificial price floor which has artificially inflated our labor costs, thereby creating a vacuum for cheaper labor at the actual market price. Of course, this only holds if you believe in cause and effect.

 

[Jaskalas]

Enacting one Soviet policy after another....

Some day we will all be North Koreans.

 

[Linflas]

Enacting one Soviet policy after another....

Some day we will all be North Koreans.

I'm looking forward to the 1 frequency fits all radios.

 

[Moonbeam]

We could just get rid of the minimum wage, thereby removing the artificial price floor which has artificially inflated our labor costs, thereby creating a vacuum for cheaper labor at the actual market price. Of course, this only holds if you believe in cause and effect.

It won't work. They'll just unionize and demand even higher wages. Much easier just to lower the price of stuff people buy so they don't have to earn so much to buy it. 😉

 

[Moonbeam]

I'm looking forward to the 1 frequency fits all radios.

You don't have Rush dialed in? Come on, tell the truth.

 

[WHAMPOM]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/08/id-card-workers-center-immigration-plan/

So instead of actually solving the problem (closing off the border) the federal government would like to invade every legal citizens privacy.

I am sure this will be as unhackable as those RFID chips in the newer passports.

Under what constitutional justification can the federal government give for requiring me to have papers when if I and the work I output never crosses state lines?

Your whinning?

 

[Linflas]

You don't have Rush dialed in? Come on, tell the truth.

Whether I have Rush dialed in or Rachel Maddow dialed in it is my choice. That is the only truth worth noting.

 

[WHAMPOM]

The Great Wall of China comes to mind, and I'm damn sure the U.S. is quite capable of a 21st Century version if/when we actually commit to solving the problem.

The fact that our border is still wide open is actually pretty disgusting...

The guards were bribed, the gates were opened and China fell to the barbarians. So, just what is your point?

 

[Linflas]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/08/id-card-workers-center-immigration-plan/

So instead of actually solving the problem (closing off the border) the federal government would like to invade every legal citizens privacy.

I am sure this will be as unhackable as those RFID chips in the newer passports.

Under what constitutional justification can the federal government give for requiring me to have papers when if I and the work I output never crosses state lines?

They won't have to deal with that since they will attempt to force the states to do it for them by denying funding for something like Medicare or transportation.

 

[Schadenfroh]

Good, we need a national ID. This can also be used when one goes to vote to verify the person's identity. Eventually, maybe we can link an electronic currency system to the national IDs to eliminate hard currency. Transaction logs could only be started / viewed by law enforcement once a search warrant has been obtained (protect privacy) to assist in criminal investigations.

I also would have no problem with a DNA sample taken at birth to be logged into CODIS. A copy of the profile could be stored in the national ID to better tie it to the person.


Is it sarcasm or is it fascism? You decide...

 

[MotF Bane]

Basically, neither party is particularly interested in actually closing the border, each for their own set of reasons. They all play lip service to the concept because the American people want it, but neither party wants to do it. Corporate interests want the cheap labor, and democrats know the vast majority of the illegals entering will some day vote democrat (after amnesty/legalization), and they don't want to alienate (pun) a large and growing segment of the population.

This. We have the technology, and certainly can spend enough, to secure the border, the politicians lack the will.

Good, we need a national ID. This can also be used when one goes to vote to verify the person's identity. Eventually, maybe we can link an electronic currency system to the national IDs to eliminate hard currency. Transaction logs could only be started / viewed by law enforcement once a search warrant has been obtained to assist in criminal investigations.

I also would have no problem with a DNA sample taken at birth or during emergency room visits to be logged into CODIS. A copy of the profile could be stored in the national ID to better tie it to the person.

*checks sarcasm meter*