Originally posted by: Czar
so does the US want to join countries like Iraq and others who have waged an illegal war? sure seems so
Originally posted by: shinerburke
Originally posted by: Czar
so does the US want to join countries like Iraq and others who have waged an illegal war? sure seems so
Since the inception of the U.N. there have been 26 "official" wars. Of those 26 only 3 have been backed by the U.N. All three were approved at the request of the United States. Those wars were: Korea, Gulf War, and the war in Afghanistan that is ongoing. The other 23 "wars" were never brought before the U.N. nor approved by that body. The upcoming war in Iraq was approved by the U.N. in Resolution 1441. That's a fact and you cannot deny it. The actions that the French, Germans, etc...are taking now is doing nothing but taking away their credibility and the effectiveness of the U.N. Why? Because they agreed in 1441 that Iraq was already in breech of the resolutions that ended the Gulf War and that if they did not make a full discloser of their WMD then "serious consequences" would occur. Everyone knew at the time what serious consequences meant and the countries that voted for 1441 are now just trying to delay the inevitable and find a way to stop the conflict so that they can cover their ass. France has no real interest in world peace. Remind me again what nation it was that attacked Greenpeace protesters? Remind me again what nation it was that sold Iraq most of their military equipment before the Gulf War. Remind me again what country couldn't wait to do business with Iraq after the Gulf War. Remind me again what country it is that continues to sell parts to the Iraqi Air Force in direct violation of the U.N. ceasefire agreements. Remind me again which country it was that signed multi billion oil contracts with Iraq that can't take effect until the sanctions are lifted. Remind me again which country has pushed hardest for those sanctions to be release "for the good of the Iraqi people" Remind me again which country built and sold Iraq their first nuclear reactor. In case you don't know the answer to all of the above is France. The gamesmanship that is being played out in the U.N. by France, Germany, etc?should be embarrassing to those countries. They have already voted that Iraq was in defiance/breech of the Gulf War ceasefire and that "serious consequences" should take place if they continue to defy the ceasefire. Why is it that now they are trying to stop it? Because of the negative economic impact having their business with Iraq shut off would cause. Because of the international embarrassment that will come when Iraq's WMD are found and they have MADE IN FRANCE or MADE IN GERMANY stamped on their side. Because of the embarrassment that will come when the records of shady business dealings and smuggling that those countries have been doing with Iraq. Think about this for a second. Why was the U.N. created? Short answer?.it was created to promote world peace and human rights. It was also created to help reign in rogue nations and keep them from taking action detrimental to world peace or human rights. Now ask yourself this, in the last 20 years has the U.N. helped or hindered world peace and human rights? What actions did the U.N. take in Rwanda? What actions did the U.N. take in Bosnia? What actions did the U.N. take in Haiti? The answer to all of those in nothing. Now ask yourself if the U.N. has helped control rogue nations? The answer is no. If anything the U.N. has held back the nations that are trying to do something about the rogue nations of the world. Instead of being a roadblock to totalitarianism and human rights abuse the U.N. has been a roadblock to those countries trying to prevent such things. The U.N. like the League of Nations before it has proven to be nothing more than a debating society full of empty promises and rhetoric that never accomplishes anything.
Originally posted by: jahawkin
Yes, an international peace and security organization is a bad idea. International precident that we would like other nations to follow is a bad idea. NPT, CBT, all horrible ideas. The US doesn't have time for such irrelevant treaties and organizations.
Originally posted by: shinerburke
Originally posted by: Czar
so does the US want to join countries like Iraq and others who have waged an illegal war? sure seems so
Since the inception of the U.N. there have been 26 "official" wars. Of those 26 only 3 have been backed by the U.N. All three were approved at the request of the United States. Those wars were: Korea, Gulf War, and the war in Afghanistan that is ongoing. The other 23 "wars" were never brought before the U.N. nor approved by that body. The upcoming war in Iraq was approved by the U.N. in Resolution 1441. That's a fact and you cannot deny it. The actions that the French, Germans, etc...are taking now is doing nothing but taking away their credibility and the effectiveness of the U.N. Why? Because they agreed in 1441 that Iraq was already in breech of the resolutions that ended the Gulf War and that if they did not make a full discloser of their WMD then "serious consequences" would occur. Everyone knew at the time what serious consequences meant and the countries that voted for 1441 are now just trying to delay the inevitable and find a way to stop the conflict so that they can cover their ass. France has no real interest in world peace. Remind me again what nation it was that attacked Greenpeace protesters? Remind me again what nation it was that sold Iraq most of their military equipment before the Gulf War. Remind me again what country couldn't wait to do business with Iraq after the Gulf War. Remind me again what country it is that continues to sell parts to the Iraqi Air Force in direct violation of the U.N. ceasefire agreements. Remind me again which country it was that signed multi billion oil contracts with Iraq that can't take effect until the sanctions are lifted. Remind me again which country has pushed hardest for those sanctions to be release "for the good of the Iraqi people" Remind me again which country built and sold Iraq their first nuclear reactor. In case you don't know the answer to all of the above is France. The gamesmanship that is being played out in the U.N. by France, Germany, etc?should be embarrassing to those countries. They have already voted that Iraq was in defiance/breech of the Gulf War ceasefire and that "serious consequences" should take place if they continue to defy the ceasefire. Why is it that now they are trying to stop it? Because of the negative economic impact having their business with Iraq shut off would cause. Because of the international embarrassment that will come when Iraq's WMD are found and they have MADE IN FRANCE or MADE IN GERMANY stamped on their side. Because of the embarrassment that will come when the records of shady business dealings and smuggling that those countries have been doing with Iraq. Think about this for a second. Why was the U.N. created? Short answer?.it was created to promote world peace and human rights. It was also created to help reign in rogue nations and keep them from taking action detrimental to world peace or human rights. Now ask yourself this, in the last 20 years has the U.N. helped or hindered world peace and human rights? What actions did the U.N. take in Rwanda? What actions did the U.N. take in Bosnia? What actions did the U.N. take in Haiti? The answer to all of those in nothing. Now ask yourself if the U.N. has helped control rogue nations? The answer is no. If anything the U.N. has held back the nations that are trying to do something about the rogue nations of the world. Instead of being a roadblock to totalitarianism and human rights abuse the U.N. has been a roadblock to those countries trying to prevent such things. The U.N. like the League of Nations before it has proven to be nothing more than a debating society full of empty promises and rhetoric that never accomplishes anything.
Originally posted by: KK
Originally posted by: jahawkin
Yes, an international peace and security organization is a bad idea. International precident that we would like other nations to follow is a bad idea. NPT, CBT, all horrible ideas. The US doesn't have time for such irrelevant treaties and organizations.
Not when Libya and Iraq are chairing these commitees. Does that make sense to you? If you say yes, then you are an ignorant fool. If you say no, then it voids your remark, making you sound like somebody who can't back up their words. Either way, you lose. 🙂
KK
