overclocking my CPU

[riflefighter]

hello,

I wanted to know if I should try overclocking my CPU
AMD Athlon 64 X2 dual core Processor 5200+ 2.8GHz

if yes can you give me a guide for this because there are so many bad guids (where you can see that the instructor does not know what he's talking about)

thank you very much
RF

 

[jvroig]

I wanted to know if I should try overclocking my CPU

Depends on your needs and what you have. Does your board even support overclocking? (Not all boards do. I had a cheap MSI board that I paired with my old X2 5000+ 3 years ago, it had no overclocking options at all). If it does, why try to overclock? Is there a specific app you are using that needs a faster processor, or a game you want to play?

The old X2 chips are a bit slow by today's standards, so if you are wanting more performance for gaming, it may not be worth the trouble at all. You might be better served by springing for a cheap Athlon II X3 or X4 cpu+mobo combo, especially if modern gaming performance is what you are after.

As for overclocking guides, I can't seem to remember much changes at all from K8 to K10.5 in terms of overclocking (you've still got HT ref clock, CPU-NB freq, CPU-NB voltage, etc), so all current guides should work. The procedures would be the same, but the values would be different - like max clocks to expect, acceptable voltage, etc. I'm not sure what guide to dig up, but let's try to establish first if you do want to OC.

 

[riflefighter]

thank you for your answer. I want to OC because some games that I run need it (some sims). so I thought that OC is a cheap and if done right a good way to sqeeze some more FPS from my mechine as I will go to university in few mounths there is almost no point in buying new matherboard+ CPU.

but can I buy today a CPU only or CPU+mainboard in cheap enough price. I have the MSI MS 7310.

thank you

 

[DrMrLordX]

The problem is that a chip like that may not be good for any more than 3-3.2 ghz, depending on your cooling. That might not be worth the trouble unless you know what you're doing, or have already OCed the chip and know what it can do.

I have an x2-3600+ downstairs that I run OCed just because it has a ton of headroom over stock, but with your chip . . .

Anyway, if you want to try overclocking your x2, we have/had a pretty good guide to it stickied in this forum. Well, had it appears . . . if you really want to know how to OC it, I can get you started, as can many other posters here.

Basically, you raise your HTT a bit, until your computer starts to crash. Then you back your HTT off by about 5-10 mhz, and run a stability testing program like Prime95 or LinX to determine stability. If that crashes, back off another 5 mhz on the HTT and re-run the stability program. Repeat this until you have a stable overclock. It will probably not be worth your time to increase vcore or any other voltage.

What you should be shooting for here is about 3.2 ghz, maybe less. Your 5200+ has a default CPU multiplier of 14x, which gives you 2.8 ghz at the default HTT speed of 200 mhz. To get 3.2 ghz, you need an HTT of about 229, so try an HTT speed of around 220 at first, and work your way up from there. It would help if you told us what kind of RAM you have.

And just an FYI, but you may also want to lower your HT multiplier from 5x to 4x before you do this. I doubt that you will need to mess with your RAM.

 

[riflefighter]

I have `corsiar CM2X1024 -6400 800Mhz

 

[riflefighter]

ok I've checked my bios and here is what I got:

under Frequendcy/voltage control
FSB Multiplier X13
CPU Vcore 1.344V
Cool 'n' quiet disabled (shell I enable it?)
& I can change CPU frequency,
CPU ratio now-auto
cpu voltage-auto
Processor FSB-200.0Mhz(i can change that)

under memeory
memory clk 800Mhz
Memclock mode auto
adjust DDR voltage now 1.95 (it's safe looks like optimized performance [marked with yellow] is 2.0 shell I change?)

I also can run the fans in order to achive certian temp (40 C/50 C/55C).BTW what is the max temp for AMD processers?

and I've found another option which maybe I shell try which says load optimized defaults (I did not enabled it when first constructing and using this PC)

THANK YOU AGAIN!!!

 

[DrMrLordX]

Okay, first of all, set your fans to achieve 40C. It may make your system noisier, but whatever. Max temp varies from chip to chip though you want to avoid temps higher than about 65C, typically. Do not enable Cool n' Quiet for overclocking.

Secondly, FSB multiplier looks like your CPU multi (argh, why must they use the term FSB on a k8 system). I think you have a Windsor 5200+ which has a default clockspeed of 2.6 ghz, not 2.8 ghz, which is why your CPU multi is 13x rather than 14x.

Don't mess with your DDR voltage, you probably won't need to mess with that.

Processor FSB looks like your HTT setting.

I would highly recommend downloading a tool called CPU-Z:

http://www.cpuid.com/downloads/cpu-z/1.55-setup-en.exe <-- click here to download

Install that and then run it; that will tell us a lot about what your system is currently doing.

There are two more things for you to do here:

1). Please tell me what settings are available under "CPU Ratio". I'm curious as to what that really is . . .

2). Raise your "Processor FSB" from 200 mhz to about 230 mhz. 230 mhz HTT * CPU multi of 13x = 2990 mhz CPU speed (up from 2600 mhz). Try to boot with that, and then run CPU-Z and show us the main CPU tab in a screenshot.

Then try running Prime95 which you can download here:

http://mersenneforum.org/gimps/p95v2511.zip <-- get this if you have winXP, Vista 32-bit, or Win7 32-bit
http://mersenneforum.org/gimps/p64v2511.zip <-- get this if you have Vista 64-bit or Win7 64-bit

Select the torture test, then run Small FFTs, and tell us how long it runs before it crashes. You might want to set it up to run overnight. Prime95 should give you the option to run a benchmark/torture test straight off after you run it.

edit: also, download Memtest HCI here:

http://hcidesign.com/memtest/MemTest.zip

Just install that for now . . . we'll use it later if we think your memory is a problem. If I'm right, the OC I recommended will set your RAM to DDR2-920 which should not be a major cause for instability, but you never know.

 

[riflefighter]

ok I'll do that' shell I try putting the BIOS on optimized settings?

as about fan I'll try to achive that.

here is my current CPUz screen I did not find any cpu ratio here

I'll try to do as you said and see what's going on

thanks again!

edit: I opened prime95 which option to test there? small FFTs? (I did not try to overclock yet)

 

[killster1]

what cpu cooler did you have again? if its stock i wouldnt oc much. Also what power supply?

With that said i prefer to run OCCT but if you do run prime Run 2 instances of it since you have 2 cores. Ive never overclocked or ran a 940 socket but i always ran cpu freqency high and lowered the HT to like 3x and ram lowered so that with the multiplier it will be about same as stock. If not you will have to raise your ram voltages etc. What motherboard you have and then google it with the term overclock or review and it will usually give you great settings.

id say most importantly to lock your pci bus and disable spread spectrum. stuff like that but should be in review.

 

[riflefighter]

wow... too many stuff I don't know. is OCCT a program for testing CPU?
what shell I do exactly, maybe i don't look for the best resualts but for something that will work and not ruin my hardware 300-400 mhz improvment is still good.

and I have MSI MS-7310

thanks
RF

edit:
shell I disable only CPU spread spectrum?

 

[riflefighter]

I found that I can disable PCI autoclock or something like that. what to look for when trying to lock PCI?

 

[heyheybooboo]

_Drop the HT to x4
_Drop the memory ratio from 400 to 333
_Set the clock to 220MHz (x13 CPU multiplier = 2.86MHz)

Check you temps and test for stability. If you are satisfied:

_Bump the clock in 5MHz increments; continue to monitor and test at each step.

If the system hangs, you have to re-set the CMOS (see your motherboard manual). At this point you must bump the volts to the CPU. You have 89w F2 stepping, and as long as you are comfortable with your temps (I would not stray too far above 50c), I'd guess you could push up to 1.425v ---- some folks go 1.45-1.5v but with fancy cooling. High temps are your enemy, and more volts means higher temps.

I'll guess you will max at 234x13. Good luck.

I found that I can disable PCI autoclock or something like that. what to look for when trying to lock PCI?

Should be a BIOS setting which will allow you to lock at 100MHz (you may have to adjust the setting from 'Auto' to 'Manual' and set at 100.

...
edit:
shell I disable only CPU spread spectrum?

Yes. Only enable if you have electronic interference (EFI) with other electronic devices.





--

 

[DrMrLordX]

ok I'll do that' shell I try putting the BIOS on optimized settings?

No, don't bother with optimized settings.

here is my current CPUz screen I did not find any cpu ratio here

Your CPU-Z readout looks normal. The "cpu ratio" I was talking about was the one you mentioned from your BIOS.

You said it was set to auto. What other settings are available for that setting in your BIOS?

edit: I opened prime95 which option to test there? small FFTs? (I did not try to overclock yet)

Yes, small FFTs, though you should already be "prime stable" before overclocking. Can't hurt to run it to get a feel for how it operates, though.

what cpu cooler did you have again? if its stock i wouldnt oc much. Also what power supply?

Actually he should be good for about 2.8-3.0 ghz on the stock cooler. If I'm right, he has the AVC unit with quad heatpipes which is a good, albeit loud, cooler.

With that said i prefer to run OCCT but if you do run prime Run 2 instances of it since you have 2 cores.

Just an FYI, but Prime95 now loads multiple cores from one instance. He doesn't have to run multiple copies of Prime95 like in the old days.

id say most importantly to lock your pci bus and disable spread spectrum. stuff like that but should be in review.

Unless his motherboard is absolutely terrible (which it might be), his PCI and PCI-e speeds should be locked by default. Disabling spread spectrum IS a good idea, though.

wow... too many stuff I don't know. is OCCT a program for testing CPU?

Yes, OCCT is a program that lets you test your CPU for stability. You don't have to mess with it just now, though . . . Prime95 should do the trick.

shell I disable only CPU spread spectrum?

Yes.

As far as what you should do, I'm thinking you should aim for a CPU clock speed of around 2.8 to 3.0 ghz. You remember that Processor FSB thing in your BIOS? If you raise that to 230 mhz from 200 mhz, you'll be at 2990 mhz, or around 3 ghz, for your CPU speed. It might not be stable, so if it isn't (use Prime95 to test for that), lower your Processor FSB setting until your system is stable while running Prime95 Small FFTs.

Ideally your system should be able to run Prime95 Small FFTs for 24 hours straight without crashing.

I found that I can disable PCI autoclock or something like that. what to look for when trying to lock PCI?

Hmm . . . good question. You may have to play with this to see what settings are available. PCI autoclock sounds like it should force your PCI/PCI-e to standard speeds while it's enabled, but I could be wrong. If you disable it, it may cause your PCI and PCI-e speeds to go out of spec as you raise HTT. It might be better to leave it enabled. How many different settings are available under PCI autoclock?

_Drop the HT to x4
_Drop the memory ratio from 400 to 333
_Set the clock to 220MHz (x13 CPU multiplier = 2.86MHz)

Keep in mind that everything in his BIOS is mis-labeled. We haven't even figured out where the HT multi and memory ratios are yet.

If the system hangs, you have to re-set the CMOS (see your motherboard manual).

He might not have to do that. Most K8 boards will attempt a recovery in which the board will temporarily boot with an HTT of 200, but only to let you go back into the BIOS and change settings. Even my old Chaintech vnf3-250 did that. Unless he chooses some kind of setting that will make his system hang on boot at 200 mhz HTT, he shouldn't need to clear the CMOS.

It would help for him to learn how, mind you, but still . . .

At this point you must bump the volts to the CPU.

I don't know that asking him to overvolt anything just yet would be a good idea.

Should be a BIOS setting which will allow you to lock at 100MHz (you may have to adjust the setting from 'Auto' to 'Manual' and set at 100.

Actually, default behavior should be a lock to 100 mhz PCI-e/33 mhz PCI. Disabling the autoclock may let PCI/PCI-e speeds trend upwards as HTT rises; he makes it sound like there are only two settings, Enable and Disable. It would be good for him to tell us how many settings are available.

 

[riflefighter]

ok I tried to put the FSB on 230 it did not continue after bios and crashed each time but I changed just the FSB, what is all that HT ratio?

the problem is that everyone says something else and it confuses me so how shell I act. abviusly the try to OC to 230MHz didn't work so what to do now?

edit:
check out reply #6 I said there exactly what I get in my BIOS options

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

HT is hypertransport, the AMD version of the FSB/QPI. You want to drop the multiplier (and probably RAM multiplier, if you can, as well) so that you know that if your system is unstable it's due to the chip itself, not the other stuff working around it.

If 230MHz isn't working, then drop it. Try running it again at 220. If that doesn't work, 210. If 210 isn't stable, then you probably shouldn't bother. A <5 percent overclock is pittance.

Also, I agree that I don't think that overvolting would be so good an idea; it's probably better to just keep it simpler for now.

 

[DrMrLordX]

ok I tried to put the FSB on 230 it did not continue after bios and crashed each time but I changed just the FSB, what is all that HT ratio?

Okay, try 220 instead of 230 like Mr. Pedantic said.

edit:
check out reply #6 I said there exactly what I get in my BIOS options

The main thing I wanted to know about from reply #6 was "Cpu ratio". All you said was that it was set to auto. Can you change CPU ratio, and if so, what does it say when you try to change it?

 

[riflefighter]

the CPU ratio is the multipliar as I see it I can lower it X13-X1.. as about the RAM multiplyar I did not see it over there.. do you have an idea about how they call it? as about spread spectrum shell I disable it just for the CPU?

addition: so what to do next lower the CPU multipliar AKA CPU ratio to? and to put the FSB to 220 and see what it gives me?

 

[jvroig]

addition: so what to do next lower the CPU multipliar AKA CPU ratio to? and to put the FSB to 220 and see what it gives me?

No, that's counter productive, lowering the multiplier will mean lowering your CPU frequency. That's how it works, the GHz you see is the product in the equation: CPU multiplier x FSB. For example, if your CPU Mul is 13, and FSB of 200 means: 13 x 200 = 2.6 GHz CPU Frequency.

Let your CPU ratio stay at the biggest number (shouldn't you have x14 or x13.5 if your CPU is a 5200+?), then just lower the FSB bit by bit until you can boot.

For RAM Multiplier, try looking for something called DDR Freq or similar. Normally, it has options such as "1:1", "1:1.33", "1:1.66", or sometimes the options may appear as a multiplier instead of a ratio : "x1", "x1.33" .x "x1.66". When you find this, set it to the lowest option, 1:1. By default it would most likely be at 1:1.66

 

[riflefighter]

I can't seem to find RAM multplier. anyway I managed to turn the FSB to 210 and it runs I will try to get the FSB up more. shell I find the frequency in which it crashes and then lower the CPU ratio (Multipliar?)

 

[jvroig]

. anyway I managed to turn the FSB to 210 and it runs I will try to get the FSB up more.

Great, find your max FSB.

shell I find the frequency in which it crashes and then lower the CPU ratio (Multipliar?)

No. Did you read my explanation in my previous post? If you lower the CPU ratio, you will end up lowering your clockspeed. You don't want to lower your clockspeed right? So don't lower it.

When you find the FSB that it crashes (say 217, while 216 boots fine), then the max FSB will net you your max overclock. For example, if you do find 216 to be the max working FSB, and your cpu ratio is x14, then you will end up with a clockspeed of 3.024GHz.

By the way, what is the max cpu ratio you have? Is it 13.5 or 14?

 

[riflefighter]

X13.0

 

[jvroig]

Ah, that means you have the X2 5200+ that has a stock clock of 2.6 (not 2.7, and not 2.8 as you stated in your opening post).

If you are failing 220 FSB, that might be because of your RAM multiplier, so until you find your RAM multiplier, you might be stuck at a lousy overclock.

Anyway, just continue looking for the max FSB, then get back to us here and let's take it from there.

Also, if you've got a digital camera, next time you are in the BIOS you can take a picture of it so we can help you look for the settings, if possible.

 

[riflefighter]

as about max FSB I managed to get it up with 211 but it had VERY high temp with OCCT so I stopped it.. maybe it's because of the RAM multiplyar. I have DRAM timing settings though. anyway I don't think that we will get very much out this cpu unless you got other ideas and yes I have the X2 5200+

and maybe it's better to OC my Vcard since it's better Radeon HD 4670 I just don't remember who produced it but i think it's capable of OC since it has HUGE fan on it not like all the other versions of the card (I'll update it's type soon) do you think I can get some improvment in FPS by overcloacking my Vcard?

 

[jvroig]

anyway I don't think that we will get very much out this cpu unless you got other ideas and yes I have the X2 5200+

Right, that's what I tried to tell you during my first post in your thread. Frankly, there's little life left in the original Athlon 64 X2 chips. If you want to play modern games, you really need a better chip.

nd maybe it's better to OC my Vcard since it's better Radeon HD 4670 I just don't remember who produced it but i think it's capable of OC since it has HUGE fan on it not like all the other versions of the card (I'll update it's type soon) do you think I can get some improvment in FPS by overcloacking my Vcard?

What resolution do you play in? 1366x768? 1280x1024? My brother has a 4670, it has respectable performance at low ress (1366x768, he can max out Fallout 3, I believe). Some games may give you a few more FPS if you overclock that card, but some games will absolutely need a faster CPU than you have right now (for example, StarCraft II), so overclocking your card in that case won't be of much help.

 

[riflefighter]

1280X1024, so you say that overclocking my GPU won't help much? anyway thank you VERY MUCH for your help. many people told me to try and I thought I should give it a shot. it's a good card the problem with Simulators which are the main gametype I play that they're CPU eaters.. =[

RF