Over protection of women?

[Cuda1447]

Alright. So a recent thread got me thinking. To me, it seems like we over-protect women when it comes to thinks such as harassment etc. Now don't get me wrong, Im sure females are harassed, and I agree that when they are things need to be done about it. However, does it not seem like the rules regarding females have become very... touchy... for lack of a better word.


For example: I work in a retail store. My manager was a male. Now like most males, he likes females. He enjoys to look at them, and will attempt to get a girls number from time to time. At work, I agree that these actions are probably not a good idea. However, he is not an idiot. Awhile back he got fired for some form of sexual harrassment. The two girls that accussed him of it were pretty much making up stories because they did not like him in general. (Everyone knew they didn't like him) The actual event that got him fired is as follows. One day one of the girls was on lunch. X manager happened to be at the same place as the girl (which was right across the street) and wanted to sit down at eat lunch at this place with the girl (fast food joint, not a restaurant). If it were a guy with a guy, clearly there would be no problem. And there had not been any prior complents regarding sexual harrassment or anything of the sort between these two people. The manager did not know that the girl did not like him either. So he just walked into a bad situation basically, and didn't do a whole lot wrong. But many comapnies/places have very strict policies when it comes to women.


Im sure some of you other guys have better examples than the one Ive just shared, and I would really like to here them.


The actual thing that got me thinking about this was the thread where the guy's g/f was having bad dreams. The guy apparently commented that one day he should wake up and punch his g/f in the head (because she punched him, and obviously joking). The mod locked the thread and threatened of a banning because of 'violence against females'. Ok, so if it was just his roomate (another guy) that was sleep walking and punched him in the head, and he commented about punching them back would it be ok? I would hope you're going to say no, because otherwise its a bit of a double standard, ESPECIALLY considering he was joking. However, chances are nobody would have looked twice at it.



I'd just like to hear OT's thoughts on the whole issuee. And I really hope the MOD doesn't lock a simple discussion about females.

 

[BrokenVisage]

first reply reserved for later

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage
first reply reserved for later

Good idea

 

[whistleclient]

what did he say to her?

if he's the manager, he should know that any relationship or any attempt to form a relationship with an employee is forbidden.

 

[n7]

There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

 

[OdiN]

Yeah that thread was crap.

I haven't seen someone threaten violence against a guy in a joking manner and get the thread locked.

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: tangent1138
what did he say to her?

if he's the manager, he should know that any relationship or any attempt to form a relationship with an employee is forbidden.

I have lots of relationships with my managers. I consider almost all of them my friends. I often go over to one of my managers houses to watch football games. The only difference is we are both guys. Nobody knows the intent of the manager in this situation, but I do know he is not an idiot. I also know that he was aware of certain situations so he was careful not to overstep his boundaries. I personally find nothing wrong with being friendly with a co-worker and wanting to eat lunch with them at A FAST FOOD place across the street. Lots of times Im over there eating and someone else comes up and sits down to eat with me.

 

[OdiN]

See...women can play two cards very easily that a man cannot defend himself against very well:

1 - Sexual Harassment

2 - Rape

If all of a sudden after consentual sex a woman cries rape....you're most likely screwed (ignore the pun).

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

 

[jai6638]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

First thing that comes to mind. Being a teacher. Full time teachers require you to be there for your classes. Yet woman who get pregnant often (young teachers) cause many problems for school systems. That school could not hire a male teacher over a female based soley on that though. And even if they male was better they may have issues with sexism had they gone with the male over the female.



Another example would be manual labor where females are not capable of doing the same work, yet you must pay them the same anyways. (I realize there are disputes to this, but Im just giving quick examples).


For instance, here is another situation. How come at many locations (such as grocery stores) females are hired for cashier positions, never bagger positions. Where as a male would be hired most of the time as a bagger first, which is generally less pay? Seems like inequality to me, yet it happens. Nothing is ever said about that though?

 

[JLGatsby]

Originally posted by: kogase
Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

That is a myth. Studies have shown women are actually paid more than men for the same work and effort.

 

[Skunkwourk]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

as long as theres something to be exploited, there will always be people who will take advantage of it...

 

[Flash1969]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: n7
There are many double standards in society.

That's all i'm going to say, & you can interpret that however you want.

Not everything is double standard, men and women are different.

Thats not what equal rights always fights for. Woman want equal pay, equal opportunity etc.. etc... but then if you mention there are differences feminists will call you a sexist etc. Yet now you are going to say that there are differences? Well you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

The issue here is that in many jobs females DO NOT do the same work and are paid the same. A couple of examples off the top of my head....

I used to work in a liquor store part time and there was a female working there as well. Well, when a customer purchased a keg of beer guess who had to take it to the customers car? Me, the male.... after working the 4th of July my back was killing me. She was paid the same as I was. That is BS

Another time I was in Wal-Mart and I hear over the speaker "We need a male associate to the front please" Well guess what this young man got to take a huge TV to a customers car. We wouldn't want a female to do that would we?

If a woman does the same work a man does she should be paid the same, but if she doesn't, she shouldn't be paid as much or better yet she shouldn't be hired if she can't perform the job.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: JLGatsby

Originally posted by: kogase
Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

That is a myth. Studies have shown women are actually paid more than men for the same work and effort.

I'm not even going to get into "studies". My question is hypothetical.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Double standards suck, I agree.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: Flash1969
The issue here is that in many jobs females DO NOT do the same work and are paid the same. A couple of examples off the top of my head....

I used to work in a liquor store part time and there was a female working there as well. Well, when a customer purchased a keg of beer guess who had to take it to the customers car? Me, the male.... after working the 4th of July my back was killing me. She was paid the same as I was. That is BS

Another time I was in Wal-Mart and I hear over the speaker "We need a male associate to the front please" Well guess what this young man got to take a huge TV to a customers car. We wouldn't want a female to do that would we?

If a woman does the same work a man does she should be paid the same, but if she doesn't, she shouldn't be paid as much or better yet she shouldn't be hired if she can't perform the job.

Right, I'm sure you have plenty of perfectly pertinent (to your agenda) anecdotes to throw at this, but that doesn't change the fact of the matter: Cuda1447 was railing about "Woman want equal pay", but women are in fact entitled to equal pay for equal work. Simply because you have experienced inconsistencies within the system does not change this basic underlying fact.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: JLGatsby

Originally posted by: kogase
Which differences in men and women would account for paying women less money than men for the same work?

That is a myth. Studies have shown women are actually paid more than men for the same work and effort.

I'm not even going to get into "studies". My question is hypothetical.

That makes no sense. Assuming that JL is truthful, you can't ask that question because it presumes upon something that is false.

 

[kogase]

I suppose I should also make a point more relevant to the OP. When I say men and women are different, I mean their sexuality is different. Their sexual identity and experience is different, and therefore sexual harrasment situations are not always comparable between men and women. Of course, the situation you described sounds like some unethical exploitation of the system and a person, but that doesn't change the distinct dynamics of the sexes.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: TitanDiddly
That makes no sense. Assuming that JL is truthful, you can't ask that question because it presumes upon something that is false.

Let me rephrase my original statement, as both you and him seem to have misunderstood me.

Which differences in men and women would make it justified to pay a woman less than a man for the same work?

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: kogase

Right, I'm sure you have plenty of perfectly pertinent (to your agenda) anecdotes to throw at this, but that doesn't change the fact of the matter: Cuda1447 was railing about "Woman want equal pay", but women are in fact entitled to equal pay for equal work. Simply because you have experienced inconsistencies within the system does not change this basic underlying fact.

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: TitanDiddly
That makes no sense. Assuming that JL is truthful, you can't ask that question because it presumes upon something that is false.

Let me rephrase my original statement, as both you and him seem to have misunderstood me.

Which differences in men and women would make it justified to pay a woman less than a man for the same work?

What he was railing about was women wanting equal pay for unequal work.

 

[Legend]

Absolutely.

If you're a man, and you go to trial with a woman accusing you of something, you're fvcked, even without any evidence.

Just look at the news...25+ year old teacher has sex with 15 year old student, no jail time.

18 year old boy gets a consensual blow job from a girl that's 1 month away from 16, 10 years in prison.

 

[kogase]

Originally posted by: BigJ
What he was railing about was women wanting equal pay for unequal work.

Yeah, he started going on about that in a post he made after the one I quoted. I only just saw that post.