Osram Sylvania Silverstar headlamps better the xtravision??

[TechnoKid]

Originally quoted by Slickone

So people (and me) paid more for the SS's that aren't as bright as XT's, just for a white look? The XT's have the normal halogen yellowish look, correct? And the XT's would have a fairly short life too? Are these similar to the Philips HV? Are these all "+30% bulbs"? If so, which are +50%? The higher wattage bulbs maybe? The 30% and 50% thing is a little confusing to me without knowing what brands/models/types these are.
You said there is no 50% Euro bulb, but you also said the Philips Vision Plus is a 50% Euro.(?)
There isn't a Euro crossover # that is a 9004 is there?
BTW, I made a type above, saying XT's were Philips (fixed).
Sorry. I meant to say that there are no +50% bulbs in the US. The european +50% ones aren't availible short of ordering on the web, or finding them in a specialty shop that retails all of osrams or philips products. The +50% bulbs are not a higher wattage bulb. They utilize a different gas mixture and pressure and filament alignment to create the "+50%." Yes, basically the SS bulbs in the US are for a cosmetic white-blue look, they are not brighter in lumens than a similar XT +30% bulb. The XT have the normal halogen look to them because they are not coated bulbs, although, some people, including myself think that compared to a regular halogen bulb, the XT's look "whiter." I should also mention that the +30% and +50% ratings are actually based off lumenoscity, and does not mena that much more lumens. The XT have a shorter life than regular bulbs, but in my opinion its not significantly shorter.

I've read this several times, and it still doesn't make sense to me. You seem to contradict yourself.? What I mean to say is that your stock vehicles headlight harness is most likely not putting out 13.8 volts, so, if you were to use a harness (or make your own) to draw power directly from the battery, then the bulbs would most likely yield a life that of which is rated by the manufacturer. This being said, if your stock harness isn't putting out the 13.8 volts to the bulbs, then they should, hypothetically, last longer than what the manufacturer rated them (keep in mind that the manufacturer usually rates their bulb's brighteness/life/etc at 13.8 volts), although, they may as well last shorter than the manufacturers ratings because of voltage fluctuations in the vehicle's stock harness. Also, having a seperate harness that draws power off the battery instad of the vehicles harness would likely alieviate voltage fluctuations that may be inherent in the stock vehicles wiring.

So I guess without going to HID or using higher wattage bulbs, my choices (not knowing what a 50% bulb is) are a 30% super white (bluish) bulb to look similar to HID, like the SS's, or a 30% clear bulb that is brighter but traditional halogen yellow light, like the XT's (and...?). And it seems the SS's are the best 9004 super white OEM wattage bulbs I can get. Do not get HID for an H3 application. The size of an HID capsule is far from being close to that of an H3 bulb, and the optics are not even close because of the differences in the bulbs' sizes (H3 and HID incompatibility are further explained in the lighting FAQ). Yes, your choices are limited to the SS, the XT, and a yellow/gold bulb (availible on suvlights.com) in stock wattage, that if you wanted to stay stock wattage in the H3 application. Some fog housings can take the additional heat of higer wattage bulb, but you also should make sure the wiring can take it too. The 9004 SS are probably the best (and street legal) "super-white" bulbs (I have not personally done any real life comparisions to other blue bulbs out there.


I doubt I could get HID changeover lenses for my vehicles.
My lenses are basic square flat ones so I don't think I'd get much of the prism effect, as in the first pic MercenaryForHire linked to. I've seen several HID kits installed and the patterns all looked good. But perhaps the kits will be outlawed soon anyway.
BTW, I have a '00 Nissan Frontier, and a '87 300ZX. You can get some clear lensed housings (yours are semi-sealed beam or sealed beam headlights?) and then mount a projector into that. HIDforum.com has some helpful things and ideas on how to go about doing this.

As for the auto on/off my best guess is because of the numerous voltage changes in the bulb's duty, the bulbs probably have a shortened life span.

 

[Slickone]

Originally posted by: TechnoKid

Do not get HID for an H3 application. The size of an HID capsule is far from being close to that of an H3 bulb, and the optics are not even close because of the differences in the bulbs' sizes (H3 and HID incompatibility are further explained in the lighting FAQ). Yes, your choices are limited to the SS, the XT, and a yellow/gold bulb (availible on suvlights.com) in stock wattage, that if you wanted to stay stock wattage in the H3 application. Some fog housings can take the additional heat of higer wattage bulb, but you also should make sure the wiring can take it too. The 9004 SS are probably the best (and street legal) "super-white" bulbs (I have not personally done any real life comparisions to other blue bulbs out there.
Oops, sorry. I was talking about bulbs in general (headlight and foglight), not just foglight. I didn't mean HID for H3. I was referring to what headlight/foglight choices I had, when I replace the SS's I have, and since I have another car that uses 9004 that I want to upgrade the bulbs in it too. So the only 30% bulbs available here in the US are SS's and XT's?

You can get some clear lensed housings (yours are semi-sealed beam or sealed beam headlights?) and then mount a projector into that. HIDforum.com has some helpful things and ideas on how to go about doing this.
Housings from another type of car? Why not use mine? Sounds like too much work regardless. I really dont have time to try to find what lense from another car will work and modify it & rig up a system, etc.
Mine are whatever type 9004 bulbs go into.


BTW, again, I need 9004 bulbs. There is no Euro 50% bulb I can use, correct?
Also I was in the store and noticed the Phillips HV bulbs said 30% more light, and the Sylvania Xtravision's say 20%. Yet I think above you or someone says the XT's are brighter than the HV's?

 

[TechnoKid]

Originally posted by: Slickone


Oops, sorry. I was talking about bulbs in general (headlight and foglight), not just foglight. I didn't mean HID for H3. I was referring to what headlight/foglight choices I had, when I replace the SS's I have, and since I have another car that uses 9004 that I want to upgrade the bulbs in it too. So the only 30% bulbs available here in the US are SS's and XT's?Yes. Thats correct (as far as I know of). But remember, since the SS in the US have a coating on them, they willl have a reduced output.


Housings from another type of car? Why not use mine? Sounds like too much work regardless. I really dont have time to try to find what lense from another car will work and modify it & rig up a system, etc.
Mine are whatever type 9004 bulbs go into. I understand that your headlights take a 9004 bulb, but what I'm saying is if you ever wanted to do a projector swap, you'd have a hard time doing it if your housings have a fluted lense. It in this case is where I'd reccomend getting some clear lensed housings that are oem equivalent and then modding from there. Just because a headlight uses the same bulb doesn't mean it has the same housing (shape, size etc). I hope you get what I'm trying to say here. If you were ever to get into this hobby of doing retros of car headlights etc, yes it becomes a lot of work, but thats what a hobby is, 90% work, 10% enjoying it for what it is(or something like that, I suck at analogies)


BTW, again, I need 9004 bulbs. There is no Euro 50% bulb I can use, correct?
Also I was in the store and noticed the Phillips HV bulbs said 30% more light, and the Sylvania Xtravision's say 20%. Yet I think above you or someone says the XT's are brighter than the HV's?As far as I know, there is no 50% euro bulb. The Philips and the Sylvania are actually equivalent. Both are good bulbs, but I'd rather get a philips bulb over a sylvnia/osram (not just because it has a better claim). Real world tests by end users have shown that the 30% claim by philips and sylvania/osram is closer to 20%. In any case, even with variations of measuring equipment and human error (human error? what that??? heheh), you can be certain that the "plus percent bulbs" are better than the regular counterparts.

And on a side note: I really think that the 9004 (and some 9007) bulb is one of the most poorly designed light bulb applications out there. I have not yet seen any photos [or in real life] of a 9004 application (no matter the housing or manufacturer) that has a good, well defined beam pattern. I gripe when I still see domestic car manufcturers still sticking these bulbs into newer cars when there are better bulbs to design the lights optics off of. H4, 9006, H1, and H7 are loads better than any 9004 or 9007 app I've ever seen. Sometimes this makes me want to become an optical engineer for an automobile manufacturer just so I can change the industry (in a small way of course) into providing better lighting for the millions of vehicles [we have bought and] we will continue to buy. Also, I think europe has much better standards regarding vehicle lighting than the US has or will have for a while. Current DOT standards regarding vehicle lighting are outdated and seriously need to be looked at and revised. It is chaging, but slowly at that.

 

[Slickone]

Originally posted by: TechnoKid

BTW, again, I need 9004 bulbs. There is no Euro 50% bulb I can use, correct?
Also I was in the store and noticed the Phillips HV bulbs said 30% more light, and the Sylvania Xtravision's say 20%. Yet I think above you or someone says the XT's are brighter than the HV's?As far as I know, there is no 50% euro bulb.
You've confused me then (again). Above, you said:
Sorry. I meant to say that there are no +50% bulbs in the US. The european +50% ones aren't availible short of ordering on the web, or finding them in a specialty shop that retails all of osrams or philips products.
But you also said above, and here, there is no 50% Euro bulb.


The Philips and the Sylvania are actually equivalent. Both are good bulbs, but I'd rather get a philips bulb over a sylvnia/osram (not just because it has a better claim). Real world tests by end users have shown that the 30% claim by philips and sylvania/osram is closer to 20%. In any case, even with variations of measuring equipment and human error (human error? what that??? heheh), you can be certain that the "plus percent bulbs" are better than the regular counterparts.
Then considering the SS's are coated, and the HV's are brighter than the XT's, I guess the Phillips HV bulbs are the best we in the US can buy in the store, without going to HID. Next to that, the only better one would be the Phillips VisionPlus, if it is a 50% bulb available in the US (see above).
Which also means the following isn't really correct, since the HV's are also 30% (and the XT's are marked as 20%):

So the only 30% bulbs available here in the US are SS's and XT's?Yes. Thats correct (as far as I know of). But remember, since the SS in the US have a coating on them, they willl have a reduced output.


It in this case is where I'd reccomend getting some clear lensed housings that are oem equivalent and then modding from there. Just because a headlight uses the same bulb doesn't mean it has the same housing (shape, size etc). I hope you get what I'm trying to say here.
Yeah, I'll say again, it seems like it'd be a nightmare trying to 1. find one 2. get it modded in.


Curious, as far as your side note, 9003 bulbs would be similar to 9004 and 9007, correct?

 

[TechnoKid]

Originally posted by: Slickone

Originally posted by: TechnoKid

There is no 50% euro 9004 or 9007 bulbs. Of course there are 50% bulbs in other bulbs sizes, but not in 9004 or 9007 (as far as I know). And, as I said before, the 50% bulbs are euro bulbs, and not availible in the US short of orderiing them in a specialty shop or on the internet.


Then considering the SS's are coated, and the HV's are brighter than the XT's, I guess the Phillips HV bulbs are the best we in the US can buy in the store, without going to HID. Next to that, the only better one would be the Phillips VisionPlus, if it is a 50% bulb available in the US (see above).
Which also means the following isn't really correct, since the HV's are also 30% (and the XT's are marked as 20%): The Philips HV 9004 and 9007 are the best bulbs you can get in those sizes. There is no 50% (euro or otherwise) 9004 or 9007 bulbs as far as I know. Either the XT or the HV would be a better choice than the US Silverstars because they are not a coated bulb.

So the only 30% bulbs available here in the US are SS's and XT's?Yes. Thats correct (as far as I know of). But remember, since the SS in the US have a coating on them, they willl have a reduced output.



Yeah, I'll say again, it seems like it'd be a nightmare trying to 1. find one 2. get it modded in.It wouldn't be too hard to find a spare oem headlight. They're all over ebay, and you can try your local junk yard. But then again, it is a lot and lots of work once you get all the parts.


Curious, as far as your side note, 9003 bulbs would be similar to 9004 and 9007, correct? No, 9003 bulbs are not similar to 9004 and 9007 bulbs except for the fact that there is two fiaments in one capsule. 9003 bulbs are the same thing as an H4 bulb. Keep in mind that headlight optics are often created around the bulb, not the other way around. Alsmost every H4 design I've seen outperformed any 9004 or 9007 design I've seen. You can't just stick different bulbs into different headlights, as the optics behind each bulb are different (filament placement, etc).

 

[EF9]

HID converstions are BRIGHT, but cost a lot. You might also want to consider the Xtreme white plus. Any aftermarket "white" bulbs will be brighter than stock. How much brighter depends on what the buld is rate at:Kelvin scale Also the PIAA's have a lifetime warranty whereas the Sylvania has 1yr warranty(1 or 2yrs, i forgot).

 

[TechnoKid]

Originally posted by: EF9
HID converstions are BRIGHT, but cost a lot. You might also want to consider the Xtreme white plus. Any aftermarket "white" bulbs will be brighter than stock. How much brighter depends on what the buld is rate at:Kelvin scale Also the PIAA's have a lifetime warranty whereas the Sylvania has 1yr warranty(1 or 2yrs, i forgot).

Not true. Why? Any coating on a bulb will reduce the lumens [on which a bulb is measured for it brightness] (the light from the filament has to go through another medium (besides the glass of the capsule) and therefore reduces the amount of light passing through). This is referring to stock wattage bulbs. Higher wattage bulbs (rally bulbs) shouldn't be compared to stock wattage bulbs for obvious reasons.

The rating on Piaa's site refers to what wattage the bulb "looks" as if its running at. For example, to make a regular halogen H4 bulb look as if it running at the color the Xtreme whites are, it'd have to run at 135 watts. But this does not mean that the xtreme whites are running anywhere near 135 watts. In fact, the Xtreme whites actual wattage is 55/60. It's the coating (which reduces lumens) that makes it appear to be running at 135w.

Kelvin has to do with the color of the light, not the brightness of the light. Lumens is what determines the brightness and intensity of a bulb.

If you took some of the aftermarket "white" bulbs and took off the coating, it could be brighter than some regular halogen bulbs. This is because the manufacturers often put a different gas mixture and pressure in the bulb to compensate for the lost light of the coating.

Also, whereas the Sylvania/Osram and Philips bulbs are DOT compliant (road legal), the Piaa are an "auxilary" lighting, not road legal.

H1 Bulb Test

 

[Viperoni]

As TechnoKid mentioned, any bulb with a coating takes away from available brightness. The NA SilverStar's, with their coating, forces Sylvania to overdrive the filament in order to produce a legal MINIMUM amount of light.

Bluish light (such as the kind created by blue coated bulbs) is also harder on your eyes, AND it's harder to differentiate stuff that's lit up with blue as opposed to white/yellow.
The blue coating strips the "white" of it's natural yellow and other colours (since white is defined as all colours mixed together), creating a very bluish-white light that causes your pupils to NOT close as much as they normally would if the white contained the yellows, etc. That can definetely cause some eyestrain.

So in the end, we conclude that blue-coated bulbs do provide a whiter appearing light, but due to the bluish nature of said light, actually decrease usable light and can increase eyestrain compared to a non-coated bulb.


Finally, I got a set of Sylvania XtraVisions, and whenever it warms up a bit, I'll be taking some locked-exposure pics to compare them to regular bulbs.

 

[EF9]

but they are still brighter

 

[TechnoKid]

Originally posted by: EF9
but they are still brighter

If you mean that the coated bulbs have a higher kelvin rating, then yes they are.

But they do not put out as many lumens as the same bulb without a coating on it, so, coated bulbs are not as "bright" as an uncoated counterpart. Simple as that. Bulbs Read that.