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Osama bin Laden planning American Hiroshima

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Originally posted by: IGBT
..but wait. the obama is comming. with his vast experience as a community leader he can save the day.

Weird. So by posting that in this thread, are you inferring that Socio's suitcase bombs are going to be a reality if Obama is president? 😕

Or do you actually have nothing to contribute, and are therefore just thread-crapping for your personal amusement? Every once in a while you have a paranoid and ill-informed nugget to toss into a discussion, but most of the time its just "obama is a dumb" or similar garbage.

This is the kind of mentality that leads to the afore-mentioned blatant contradictions in foreign policy. Obviously most of this war on terror has made the world less safe, but senseless propaganda from people like Socio and IGBT are able to swing the lowest common denominator towards supporting the very people and policies that weaken us. Good job - how patriotic of you. :disgust:
 
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Wow, an alarmist story with absolutely no supporting evidence or widespread reports. THAT sounds pretty believable. :roll:

Socio, you're either trying to spread FUD or you're an idiot, but you're definitely one of the two.


FUD?

Just because there is no ironclad proof the story is accurate does not mean it is not. Like most all news from the news media, this is where your own personal judgment has to decide.
I can literally sh*t pure gold. No, I don't have ironclad proof, but you just need to trust me on it. I can put out up to 10 ounces/day.
The same can be said of the public?s willingness to accept the easiest explanation as the truth which is not good either.
Normally it is the truth.
 
The Mexicans must've carried those nukes over the border

Mexicans working for AQ

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeees, it all makes sense now

/sarcasm
 
Originally posted by: GarfieldtheCat
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Wow, an alarmist story with absolutely no supporting evidence or widespread reports. THAT sounds pretty believable. :roll:

Socio, you're either trying to spread FUD or you're an idiot, but you're definitely one of the two.


FUD?

Just because there is no ironclad proof the story is accurate does not mean it is not. Like most all news from the news media, this is where your own personal judgment has to decide.

And just because an article you post, that has no real proof, no evidence, and isn't mentioned on any creditable news site, doesn't mean that your articles are true.

In fact, your articles, since they have no evidence, no proof, and aren't creditable; they are the ones that sure look like they are FUD.

And quoting articles from "fourwinds" as a news source isn't exactly helping creditability. That story was from May, two months ago? So what happened to this "immediate, credible threat"?

I don't think the mass media would touch this subject for fear of causing mass hysteria. Which means you will probably not hear anything on it from "reputable sources" until after it happens or the White House issues a preemptive warning.

If I recall right, I don't remember the mass media reporting on planes being hijacked by terrorists and flown in to the twin towers before it happened either. But there was plenty of speculation that something was going to happen by less reputable, and unnamed or shadow sources.

Just because your hero Keith Olbermann isn?t saying its happening doesn?t necessarily mean it?s not.
 
Originally posted by: Socio

If I recall right, I don't remember the mass media reporting on planes being hijacked by terrorists and flown in to the twin towers before it happened either.

Sheesh! Exactly what makes you think "the mass media" had anything to report before it happened. If they did, I would have renewed my subscription to Pacific Telephone and Telepath. :roll:

But there was plenty of speculation that something was going to happen by less reputable, and unnamed or shadow sources.

There is always paranoid speculation that "something" is going to happen. That's one of the reasons for supermarket tabloids.

Your Bushwhacko heros are the ones who ignored the REAL warnings of the possiblity of an attack like 9/11, despite explicit warnings from people like Richard Clarke, former terrorisim advisor to Presidents Reagan, Bush Sr. and Clinton. Richard Clarke also warned Bush that Saddam probably was not tied to 9/11.

Just because your hero Keith Olbermann isn?t saying its happening doesn?t necessarily mean it?s not.

Without confirmation, why would Olbemann have anything more to say about it? He doesn't need to prove he's as paranoid as you. 😛
 

Old story

Al Qaeda bluffing about having suitcase nukes, experts say
Russians claim terrorists couldn't have bought them
Anna Badkhen, Chronicle Staff Writer

Tuesday, March 23, 2004

(03-23) 04:00 PDT Moscow -- Ayman al-Zawahri, al Qaeda's No. 2 man, has bragged that the terrorist group bought suitcase nuclear bombs from former Soviet nuclear scientists in Moscow and Central Asia, but experts on Russia's nuclear program dismiss the statements, saying Osama bin Laden's deputy is bluffing.

Pakistani journalist Hamid Mir, who is writing bin Laden's biography, told the Australian Broadcasting Corp. last week that al-Zawahri made the boast during a 2001 interview when he was asked whether the terror network really had nuclear weapons.

Al-Zawahri, the Egyptian doctor believed to be a mastermind of the Sept. 11, attacks, laughed and said: "If you have $30 million, go to the black market in central Asia, contact any disgruntled Soviet scientist and a lot of . .. dozens of smart briefcase bombs are available," Mir reported. "They have contacted us, we sent our people to Moscow, to Tashkent (the capital of Uzbekistan), to other Central Asian states, and they negotiated, and we purchased some suitcase bombs.''

The idea of al Qaeda's acquiring suitcase nuclear bombs -- compact, easily portable bombs shaped like briefcases or backpacks that can be detonated by timers -- is the sum of all fears for Washington.

A suitcase nuclear bomb detonated in the center of a metropolitan area can instantly kill tens of thousands of people and expose hundreds of thousands more to levels of radiation that would kill them within 24 months; millions of others would suffer from radiation poisoning.

But Russian nuclear officials and experts on the Russian and post-Soviet nuclear programs adamantly deny that al Qaeda or any other terrorist group could have bought Soviet-made suitcase nukes, which were built in the 1960s for use against NATO and U.S. targets by special Soviet military intelligence agents.

"(Al-Zawahri) is bluffing," an unnamed official at the Russian Federal Nuclear Energy Agency told the official Ria-Novosti news agency Monday. "It is practically impossible not only to buy nuclear weapons but even their components in Russia."

U.S. security experts have also said it is unlikely that bin Laden is close to acquiring nuclear weapons technology, although he clearly wants it. A U.S. federal indictment handed down in 1998 charges that beginning in 1993 al Qaeda members "made efforts to procure enriched uranium for the purpose of developing nuclear weapons.''

Maxim Shingarkin, a former major in the Russian military's secretive 12th Department, which is in charge of strategic weapons, said suitcase nuclear bombs, if they are still in Russia's arsenal, were too difficult to maintain and had too short a lifespan to make them feasible as terrorist weapons. He said Russia only had built about 100 suitcase bombs and had not produced any new ones since the 1991 breakup of the Soviet Union.

Shingarkin said Russian suitcase nukes consisted of a bag measuring about 24 by 16 by 8 inches fitted with three coffee can-size aluminum canisters filled with plutonium or uranium. A 6-inch-long detonator is connected to the canisters, and a battery line keeps it powered during storage.

He said the suitcase nukes have a lifespan of only one to three years because some of the materials, such as the battery and the conventional explosives that produce the charge that sets off the nuclear reaction, deteriorate over time and must be replaced. Otherwise, he said, they become radioactive scrap metal.

Shingarkin said the Soviet Union kept some of the bombs near Moscow, where it trained about 30 to 50 military spies to transport and detonate them abroad. More deadly portable devices were kept in the Baltic republics and, possibly, Ukraine, he said -- close to the Soviet borders with its NATO neighbors. There were never any suitcase nukes in Uzbekistan or in any other Central Asian republic, Shingarkin said, because the Soviet Union did not perceive any acute threat from its southern flank.

He said the Soviet Union had taken its suitcase nukes back from the Baltics to Moscow in the 1980s. After the breakup of the Soviet Union, some portable nuclear bombs may have remained in Ukraine, but "three years after they got there, they wouldn't be nuclear bombs anymore," he said.

Charles Digges, an expert on Russia's nuclear program with the Bellona environmental group in Norway who is usually critical of the claims of Russian nuclear officials, agreed, saying "these things have been more or less accounted for."

However, Digges cautioned that al Qaeda might have access to non-fissile radioactive material that could allow it to build so-called dirty bombs -- devices that combine conventional explosives and radioactive material. Although they would not produce a nuclear reaction, they would still create an enormous blast and long-lasting, but less widespread, radiation.

Analysts say large quantities of such radioactive material -- such as cobalt 60, iodine 131 and strontium 90 -- have disappeared from the former Soviet Union.

Digges said al-Zawahri may have mistakenly called dirty bombs suitcase bombs in his interview with Mir.

"Either they have some sort of a dirty nuke the size of a steamer trunk in which they put a bunch of uranium and TNT," he said, "or they're simply lying
 
The small suitcase bombs built by the Russians all the way back in the early 80's were very portable but use a lighter nuclear precursor to trigger the atomic detonation. You don't slam a wedge of plutonium with the precursor, you mix them violently in a perfectly timed crush of explosives; which makes them extremely unreliable. With the precursor you need less than two pounds of a specialized uranium. The Isrealis are supposed to be very good at making them and there were rumors during the first gulf war that they actually did in western Iraq. It would be naive to think that you cannot shrink bombs down to a suitcase; the w54 was literally a big shoebox. (Google the "Davy Crockett mortar" or "nuclear Falcon aam".) It is just that the precursor has a very short half-life of months and it has to be basically near pure to work. Its not uranium you have to worry about them smuggling in, its the lighter nuclear materials. The idea that they can collect these materials, purify, and get the device to work perfectly is highly unlikely. Its not going to happen unless they have help.
 
Originally posted by: MadRat
The small suitcase bombs built by the Russians all the way back in the early 80's were very portable but use a lighter nuclear precursor to trigger the atomic detonation. You don't slam a wedge of plutonium with the precursor, you mix them violently in a perfectly timed crush of explosives; which makes them extremely unreliable. With the precursor you need less than two pounds of a specialized uranium. The Isrealis are supposed to be very good at making them and there were rumors during the first gulf war that they actually did in western Iraq. It would be naive to think that you cannot shrink bombs down to a suitcase; the w54 was literally a big shoebox. (Google the "Davy Crockett mortar" or "nuclear Falcon aam".) It is just that the precursor has a very short half-life of months and it has to be basically near pure to work. Its not uranium you have to worry about them smuggling in, its the lighter nuclear materials. The idea that they can collect these materials, purify, and get the device to work perfectly is highly unlikely. Its not going to happen unless they have help.



hmmm... u mean like maybe from the guy who gave pakistan the bomb or someone like that??? i wonder what he does to pass the time whilst under house arrest???
 
Originally posted by: 1prophet

Old story

He said the suitcase nukes have a lifespan of only one to three years because some of the materials, such as the battery and the conventional explosives that produce the charge that sets off the nuclear reaction, deteriorate over time and must be replaced.< Otherwise, he said, they become radioactive scrap metal.

So what is to stop them from just replacing the old explosives with semtex which seems to be redily available to them and does not deteroriate. Smuggle them in, a slap in a new battery when they are ready to use them so they at the very least have a dirty bomb if not a nuclear one?
 
The batteries are not a problem. The explosives are much less of a problem. Its the materials that mix that consume themselves in a short time.

And so what if they have a team of rocket scientists working on it. They cannot purify the materials without emitting something that can be detected. As soon as the feds find the traces they would be looking for it won't take them long to backtrack to the equipment. Its not everyday kitchen variety equipment.
 
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: 1prophet

Old story

He said the suitcase nukes have a lifespan of only one to three years because some of the materials, such as the battery and the conventional explosives that produce the charge that sets off the nuclear reaction, deteriorate over time and must be replaced.<< Otherwise, he said, they become radioactive scrap metal.

So what is to stop them from just replacing the old explosives with semtex which seems to be redily available to them and does not deteroriate. Smuggle them in, a slap in a new battery when they are ready to use them so they at the very least have a dirty bomb if not a nuclear one?

Maybe in fantasy tv land where the show is over in an hour and the people who watch can believe it to be true since their favorite actor was able to do it.
 
If this is true which I doubt, this would awaken the sleeping giant that is America. We would crush all in our path, forget politically correct wars and appeasement
 
Originally posted by: Skoorb
Originally posted by: Socio
Just because there is no ironclad proof the story is accurate does not mean it is not. Like most all news from the news media, this is where your own personal judgment has to decide.
I can literally sh*t pure gold. No, I don't have ironclad proof, but you just need to trust me on it. I can put out up to 10 ounces/day.
You're sitting on a gold mine!
 
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Wow, an alarmist story with absolutely no supporting evidence or widespread reports. THAT sounds pretty believable. :roll:

Socio, you're either trying to spread FUD or you're an idiot, but you're definitely one of the two.


FUD?

Just because there is no ironclad proof the story is accurate does not mean it is not. Like most all news from the news media, this is where your own personal judgment has to decide.

We faced a similar situation a few years ago...had something to do with WMD, ahh I can't remember now, it was so long ago!
 
Originally posted by: Sawyer
If this is true which I doubt, this would awaken the sleeping giant that is America. We would crush all in our path, forget politically correct wars and appeasement

You got a little drool on the right side of your face.
 
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