Opinions on seatbelt/helmet laws?

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
I don't wear a helmet because I choose not to. I do however wear my seatbelt all the time, and make my passengers do the same. Does that make sense? Probably not, but I don't care. That's the way I like it. I find that helmets are constrictive and diminish my enjoyment of the ride. If you don't ride a bike, you don't understand the difference between wearing a helmet and not, other than your mass media tainted view of how evil bikers are.

Honestly though, I get tired of having these debates every damn summer when bike season rolls around. I'm about to team up with the devil, and become a lobbyist for every law against individual freedoms that I can find. I think that may be the only way to stop the nanny-staters. To give them exactly what they want.

Maybe eventually I can pass enough laws to prohibit every from leaving their home without good reason, and a government approved pass. While at home, we can't use the internet or any other form of media that has not been approved. Things like ATOT are dangerous. Just think of the things that somebody could read here. Do you really think that ATOT is good for society? Food will be eliminated as unhealthy, and we'll all just pop government manufactured protein pills thrice daily. And if by chance we can be monitored during our trip, not allowed to deviate from the government approved path.

After all, we need to think of the children.

I don't think you have any understanding whatsoever of probability. If you ride a motorcycle, you have a high probability of having an accident, and if you don't wear a helmet, the probability of dying is multiplied several times. I'm sick and tired of this "everything is dangerous" argument... maybe you should convince the insurance companies of that, so that everyone can have universally low premiums, since after all everyone does dangerous things every day.

It's stupid people like you who compare the "danger" of going outside with the danger of not wearing a helmet on a motorcycle that NEED the government protecting you.
We put mentally challenged kids in special ed programs not because THEY know they need help, but because WE know they need help

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
If motorcyclists who don't wear helmets value their freedom from the government so much, maybe we should kick them to the curb when they end up in the hospital and unable to pay the medical bills.

Write that into their insurance policies and make them aware of it and I have no issue with it. Or better yet make the rate charged reflect the risk. But if you do that then you better do the same thing for all those folks that build beach houses and get federally subsidized insurance on them as well.

 

[ShockwaveVT]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
I don't wear a helmet because I choose not to. I do however wear my seatbelt all the time, and make my passengers do the same. Does that make sense? Probably not, but I don't care. That's the way I like it. I find that helmets are constrictive and diminish my enjoyment of the ride. If you don't ride a bike, you don't understand the difference between wearing a helmet and not, other than your mass media tainted view of how evil bikers are.

<snipped outlandish "slippery slope" style rant>

After all, we need to think of the children.

You don't need to think of the children, you need to think about other people in general. But since your reason for not wearing a helmet is a selfish one, I find that unlikely to happen. But in keeping with your selfish attitude lets look at this in a way you might understand, something directly, personally connecetd to YOU. You have family and friends right? People that love you and care about you and vice versa?

Do you really place a higher value on your riding enjoyment than on the emotional and financial well-being of your friends family? By not wearing a helmet while biking you are pretty much saying "I care more about enjoying my ride than I do about all the others in my life that I'm going to hurt if I wipe out! !"

Not very cool in my opinion.

 

[vi edit]

The real reason laws like these exist?

Dead people don't pay taxes.

 

[thereaderrabbit]

Originally posted by: zixxer
I personally competely disagree with ANY law that is designed to protect a single individual.. i.e. seatbelt laws - that protect me only. Same for helmet laws, etc.


I think you're RETARDED to not wear a seatbelt or a helmet. However, WTF does it hurt? Insurance companies should only offer policies to people who use these safety devices... bleh


the gene pool is too crowded. Why do us americans try to make it worse? I don't understand.. help people who are mentally ill adapt so they can work - have families, etc...

Congrats on not knowing first hand the financial and personal costs of piecing someone back together that was injured badly just because they didn't wear a seatbelt or a helmet. Why not ask a doctor or therapist what they think? Every one of them I've talked to wants these laws on the books (even if it meant a loss in business). Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about?

I doubt you're retarded... just a little slow.

PS. Americans starts with a capital 'A'. Even if you are a little slow, please take some damn pride in what you are part of.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Originally posted by: DougK62

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
If there is no need for a helmet and no need for a seatbelt, why the need for a driving license? Why should the government decide if I can drive or not? I don't want them to control every aspect of my life!!

Hahahahahahahahah. That's a ridiculous comparison. You're grasping for anything, and it's funny.

No, it's a perfect comparison. It's my right to drive, don't curb my personal freedom.

 

[Electric Amish]

Stupid for anyone over 18 years old.

Wear it, don't wear it. It should be up to the person.

 

[raz3000]

Seatbelt Laws are very important for public safety. In recent years the police here in Chicago and nationwide have more aggressively enforced these laws, leading to adoption rates of around 90%, about double the rate from a decade ago.

Seatbelts save lives and their use should be in the lawbooks, and these laws should be enforced. I would even favor a global seatelt law forcing as many vehicles as possible to contain seatbelts. Do you know that in much of the world even many expensive luxury vehicles DON'T contain seatbelts?

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
I don't think you have any understanding whatsoever of probability. If you ride a motorcycle, you have a high probability of having an accident, and if you don't wear a helmet, the probability of dying is multiplied several times. I'm sick and tired of this "everything is dangerous" argument... maybe you should convince the insurance companies of that, so that everyone can have universally low premiums, since after all everyone does dangerous things every day.

What does probability have to do with anything? If you want to talk about probability, let's see what the masters of probability have to say. There is nobody who cares more about probability than the insurance companies. If actuarial tables showed motorcycles to be as dangerous to the public health as some of you claim, then motorcycle insurance would be astronomically high. I pay $20/mo for motorcycle insurance. I pay $100/mo for auto insurance. Which vehicle, according to the insurance companies who pay for accidents daily, costs society more?

It's stupid people like you who compare the "danger" of going outside with the danger of not wearing a helmet on a motorcycle that NEED the government protecting you.
We put mentally challenged kids in special ed programs not because THEY know they need help, but because WE know they need help

I'm stupid? Resorting to name calling means you already know you lost this argument. Thank you, come again.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: Alprazolam
How so? What reason is there to ticket someone for making a choice not to wear their seatbelt? And then be able to search their vehicle? Please Inform me.

Becuase it drives insurance rates uup when these companies have to cover those BOZo`s who don`t wear seatbelts and have to be hospitalized for 6 months due to a cranial injurie....etc

Many additional studies address the increased cost to taxpayers resulting from the increase in injury rates when helmet laws were repealed (14-17). NHTSA estimates that motorcycle helmet use saved $13.2 billion between 1984 and 1999 (1). The United States General Accounting Office estimates that a surviving patient with a critical head injury incurs an average of $171,000 in medical and rehabilitation costs in the first year following the injury (18). Most insurance plans do not cover the complete costs of hospitalization or long-term rehabilitation for motorcycle crash victims, and approximately 22% of the costs of inpatient care alone are paid with public funds (19).

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: ShockwaveVT
You don't need to think of the children, you need to think about other people in general. But since your reason for not wearing a helmet is a selfish one, I find that unlikely to happen. But in keeping with your selfish attitude lets look at this in a way you might understand, something directly, personally connecetd to YOU. You have family and friends right? People that love you and care about you and vice versa?

Do you really place a higher value on your riding enjoyment than on the emotional and financial well-being of your friends family? By not wearing a helmet while biking you are pretty much saying "I care more about enjoying my ride than I do about all the others in my life that I'm going to hurt if I wipe out! !"

Not very cool in my opinion.

When did the burden of ensuring nobody around me ever feels discomfort fall on my shoulders? I don't tell my family how to live, I expect the same courtesy. If tragedy befalls a friend or relative, I'll feel sorrow the same as anybody would. But I'm not going to insist that they change their life to meet my needs. Just because insecure people like you have to control others behavior to find happiness doesn't mean we all do.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: thereaderrabbit
Congrats on not knowing first hand the financial and personal costs of piecing someone back together that was injured badly just because they didn't wear a seatbelt or a helmet. Why not ask a doctor or therapist what they think? Every one of them I've talked to wants these laws on the books (even if it meant a loss in business). Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about?

I doubt you're retarded... just a little slow.

PS. Americans starts with a capital 'A'. Even if you are a little slow, please take some damn pride in what you are part of.

The real problem is that insurance companies pay for medical expenses when somebody was stupid enough to drive without a helmet/seatbelt....that's what's driving the cost up. That is the fix...not the government mandating protect-you-from-yourself BS laws.

We keep trying to idiot proof society...so society keeps inventing better idiots. Let natural selection take its place. Let people who make poor, selfish, decisions that lead to personal destruction have that right. We can't keep wasting time and money on that.

 

[Electric Amish]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: thereaderrabbit
Congrats on not knowing first hand the financial and personal costs of piecing someone back together that was injured badly just because they didn't wear a seatbelt or a helmet. Why not ask a doctor or therapist what they think? Every one of them I've talked to wants these laws on the books (even if it meant a loss in business). Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about?

I doubt you're retarded... just a little slow.

PS. Americans starts with a capital 'A'. Even if you are a little slow, please take some damn pride in what you are part of.

The real problem is that insurance companies pay for medical expenses when somebody was stupid enough to drive without a helmet/seatbelt....that's what's driving the cost up. That is the fix...not the government mandating protect-you-from-yourself BS laws.

We keep trying to idiot proof society...so society keeps inventing better idiots. Let natural selection take its place. Let people who make poor, selfish, decisions that lead to personal destruction have that right. We can't keep wasting time and money on that.

You are totally correct, Blanco.

The government is trying to fix a flat tire by not driving the car versus changing the tire.

 

[CrazyDe1]

Originally posted by: ShockwaveVT

Originally posted by: BoberFett
I don't wear a helmet because I choose not to. I do however wear my seatbelt all the time, and make my passengers do the same. Does that make sense? Probably not, but I don't care. That's the way I like it. I find that helmets are constrictive and diminish my enjoyment of the ride. If you don't ride a bike, you don't understand the difference between wearing a helmet and not, other than your mass media tainted view of how evil bikers are.

<snipped outlandish "slippery slope" style rant>

After all, we need to think of the children.

You don't need to think of the children, you need to think about other people in general. But since your reason for not wearing a helmet is a selfish one, I find that unlikely to happen. But in keeping with your selfish attitude lets look at this in a way you might understand, something directly, personally connecetd to YOU. You have family and friends right? People that love you and care about you and vice versa?

Do you really place a higher value on your riding enjoyment than on the emotional and financial well-being of your friends family? By not wearing a helmet while biking you are pretty much saying "I care more about enjoying my ride than I do about all the others in my life that I'm going to hurt if I wipe out! !"

Not very cool in my opinion.

I hate this argument. It's your life you have a right to be selfish. Your family and friends being sad because of your injury is no excuse to restrict personal freedom.

The difference is if you have a family that depends on you (wife and kids).

For all of you who are for mandatory helmet and seat belt laws where do you draw the line? Mandatory helmets for mountain bikers? What's next? Mandatory helmets for pedestrians?

 

[SlitheryDee]

Originally posted by: ShockwaveVT
You don't need to think of the children, you need to think about other people in general. But since your reason for not wearing a helmet is a selfish one, I find that unlikely to happen. But in keeping with your selfish attitude lets look at this in a way you might understand, something directly, personally connecetd to YOU. You have family and friends right? People that love you and care about you and vice versa?

Do you really place a higher value on your riding enjoyment than on the emotional and financial well-being of your friends family? By not wearing a helmet while biking you are pretty much saying "I care more about enjoying my ride than I do about all the others in my life that I'm going to hurt if I wipe out! !"

Not very cool in my opinion.

I can't believe you took the time to make this post when you know damn well you should be somewhere else making sure that your family and friends aren't sad.

 

[opticalmace]

I can't believe some of you have so many problems with a damn seatbelt law.

Imagine your mom's head was caved in because she didn't feel like wearing a seatbelt, and someone T-boned her car. Can't you see it's for everyone's safety? You really think wearing seatbelts is a gateway to video cameras in everybody's living room? Paranoia is rampant here.

If anything, complain about the lack of seatbelts on buses. This is ridiculous.

 

[Electric Amish]

Originally posted by: opticalmace
I can't believe some of you have so many problems with a damn seatbelt law.

Imagine your mom's head was caved in because she didn't feel like wearing a seatbelt, and someone T-boned her car. Can't you see it's for everyone's safety? You really think wearing seatbelts is a gateway to video cameras in everybody's living room? Paranoia is rampant here.

If anything, complain about the lack of seatbelts on buses. This is ridiculous.

I don't care if my mother died in a car accident or not. It was her choice and that's what I respect for everyone...the freedom to make the choice.

Same thing goes for the stupid drug laws.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: opticalmace
I can't believe some of you have so many problems with a damn seatbelt law.

Imagine your mom's head was caved in because she didn't feel like wearing a seatbelt, and someone T-boned her car. Can't you see it's for everyone's safety? You really think wearing seatbelts is a gateway to video cameras in everybody's living room? Paranoia is rampant here.

If anything, complain about the lack of seatbelts on buses. This is ridiculous.

None of us have that problem because our friends and family are smart enough to wear a seatbelt when they drive.

Why can't you admit that the people who choose not to (whether it is law or not) are extremely dumb, and probably shouldn't be adding anything to the gene pool?

 

[TheSlamma]

Oh God look out seatbelt laws are the gateway to fascism!!! :roll:

It's not about freedom morons, it's about lower insurance rates, emergency people not showing up to a bloodbath and overflowing emergency rooms because you guys think it's some freedom.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: thereaderrabbit
Congrats on not knowing first hand the financial and personal costs of piecing someone back together that was injured badly just because they didn't wear a seatbelt or a helmet. Why not ask a doctor or therapist what they think? Every one of them I've talked to wants these laws on the books (even if it meant a loss in business). Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about?

I doubt you're retarded... just a little slow.

PS. Americans starts with a capital 'A'. Even if you are a little slow, please take some damn pride in what you are part of.

The real problem is that insurance companies pay for medical expenses when somebody was stupid enough to drive without a helmet/seatbelt....that's what's driving the cost up. That is the fix...not the government mandating protect-you-from-yourself BS laws.

We keep trying to idiot proof society...so society keeps inventing better idiots. Let natural selection take its place. Let people who make poor, selfish, decisions that lead to personal destruction have that right. We can't keep wasting time and money on that.

Or we could make 100 dollars with fines and not have highways closed for hours cleaning up brain matter. I think this is a much better way to handle idiots.

 

[TheSlamma]

Originally posted by: Electric Amish

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: thereaderrabbit
Congrats on not knowing first hand the financial and personal costs of piecing someone back together that was injured badly just because they didn't wear a seatbelt or a helmet. Why not ask a doctor or therapist what they think? Every one of them I've talked to wants these laws on the books (even if it meant a loss in business). Perhaps you don't know what you're talking about?

I doubt you're retarded... just a little slow.

PS. Americans starts with a capital 'A'. Even if you are a little slow, please take some damn pride in what you are part of.

The real problem is that insurance companies pay for medical expenses when somebody was stupid enough to drive without a helmet/seatbelt....that's what's driving the cost up. That is the fix...not the government mandating protect-you-from-yourself BS laws.

We keep trying to idiot proof society...so society keeps inventing better idiots. Let natural selection take its place. Let people who make poor, selfish, decisions that lead to personal destruction have that right. We can't keep wasting time and money on that.

You are totally correct, Blanco.

The government is trying to fix a flat tire by not driving the car versus changing the tire.

Sorry but his part about decisions that lead to personal destruction have that right

Obviously you guys never travel out of your little "Zone" seatbelts also keep people from flying out of their car. If someone doesn't wear their belt and they get hit, roll and fly out their window into oncoming traffic and land on someones windshield then it's not so "Personal" anymore now is it kids?

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Or we could make 100 dollars with fines and not have highways closed for hours cleaning up brain matter. I think this is a much better way to handle idiots.

Wrecks close the highways down for a long period of time regardless of whether there were any injuries or not.

The fact that there is brain matter should draw the simple conclusion that the moron driver who wasn't wearing his seatbelt is dead...thus deserving what he got and won't be doing it again. We all win that way.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: TheSlamma
Obviously you guys never travel out of your little "Zone" seatbelts also keep people from flying out of their car. If someone doesn't wear their belt and they get hit, roll and fly out their window into oncoming traffic and land on someones windshield then it's not so "Personal" anymore now is it kids?

And then the guy who gets hit with the flying body will think "boy, if we only had seatbelt laws, that guy would be getting a 100 dollar ticket. He deserves that after what he just did!"

haha.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: TheSlamma
Obviously you guys never travel out of your little "Zone" seatbelts also keep people from flying out of their car. If someone doesn't wear their belt and they get hit, roll and fly out their window into oncoming traffic and land on someones windshield then it's not so "Personal" anymore now is it kids?

And then the guy who gets hit with the flying body will think "boy, if we only had seatbelt laws, that guy would be getting a 100 dollar ticket. He deserves that after what he just did!"

haha.

:laugh:

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: smack Down

Or we could make 100 dollars with fines and not have highways closed for hours cleaning up brain matter. I think this is a much better way to handle idiots.

Wrecks close the highways down for a long period of time regardless of whether there were any injuries or not.

The fact that there is brain matter should draw the simple conclusion that the moron driver who wasn't wearing his seatbelt is dead...thus deserving what he got and won't be doing it again. We all win that way.

Injuries close highways for much longer time periods then no or minor injuries.