One sorry mess of a party

jlmadyson

Platinum Member
Aug 13, 2004
2,201
0
0
One sorry mess of a party

Item 1: Illinois Sen. Barack Obama, the wunderkind of the Democratic Party who, we've been told, not only transcends race, partisanship and personal ambition but actually sails above such concerns like the Winged Victory of Samothrace, received his first shellacking this week by Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.).

McCain says Obama promised to join in a bipartisan lobbying reform effort but reneged in favor of backing the Democrats' more partisan effort. So McCain ? the dashboard saint of bipartisan reform efforts ? turned Obama into epistolary roadkill.

In an archly sarcastic letter, McCain apologized for not realizing that Obama was more interested in "self-interested partisan posturing," adding that "I'm embarrassed to admit that after all these years in politics, I failed to interpret your previous assurances as typical gloss."

Item 2: Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.) returned a campaign contribution from Wal-Mart while gladly pocketing cash from Paul Newman, Reese Witherspoon and other Hollywood liberals. She even took a wad of dough from Jerry Springer, who made his fortune proving that nothing is too vile to broadcast. Clinton served on Wal-Mart's board from 1986 until 1992, and in that time the company was hardly any more "worker-friendly" ? to borrow a liberal term ? than it is today. It's just a bigger company now, with the same policies she oversaw. When asked if she ever fought for "progressive" policies when she was a director of the company, she replied, "Well, you know, I, that was a long time ago, I have to remember?. "

Item 3: The New York Times ran a state-of-the-art Democratic self-recrimination story, highlighting the party's inability to make political hay from such supposedly obvious Republican vulnerabilities as Hurricane Katrina and the National Security Agency wiretapping. The article was festooned like a Christmas tree with baubles of self-doubt and ornaments of denial hanging from every branch: the Democrats are "frustrated" by the party's "tangled" problems and their inability to exploit this "pivotal moment," etc.

Some Democrats are furious that their party doesn't have its own ideas. Other say they do have ideas, they're just keeping them secret for now. That sounds a lot like the high school geek who insists that his girlfriend is really hot but lives in an undisclosed location in Canada.

Others say agendas aren't that useful anyway. "People said, 'You can't beat something with nothing,' " House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-San Francisco) told the Times, even though Democrats did exactly that on Social Security. "I feel very confident about where we are," she assured the paper.

And all this happened by Wednesday ? and leaves out Jimmy Carter's shabby and even mildly ghoulish exploitation of Coretta Scott King's funeral.

"A man may take to drink because he feels himself to be a failure, but then fail all the more completely because he drinks," George Orwell once observed. This seems to capture nicely the dynamic of the Democrats' shame spiral. Success in politics is measured by winning elections. On this score, Democrats have been failures for a while now. In response, they're getting drunk on a brew of partisanship and Bush-hating.

It is amazing how obvious ? OK, even trite ? is the Democratic plight. Democrats need the money and energy of their "progressive," blog-addicted base, but in order to get it, they turn off mainstream voters. In other words, they can't get escape velocity.

Clinton's Wal-Mart refund is a perfect illustration not merely of her hypocrisy but of the quicksand she is now in. She thinks it's a winning message to say she's too good for Wal-Mart's money but not Hollywood's. That's not exactly red-state savvy.

Obama allowed himself to be seduced by the elixir of Democratic self-righteousness at the expense of making real headway on lobbying reform and hitching his wagon to the most popular politician in America.

And Pelosi has become enamored with the idea that one needn't be for anything, as long as one is opposed to Bush. No doubt that's the feedback she's getting in her echo chamber.

In the Senate, Minority Leader Harry Reid has infuriated Republican moderates such as Arlen Specter more than GOP conservatives by obstructing legislation and hurling partisan insults. This is exactly the opposite strategy required for clawing out of the hole the Democrats are in. But anti-Republicanism trumps everything. And that's a roadmap for the Democrats to go ever deeper into the wilderness.

To win elections I think it is pretty clear to say that both Republican and Democrat candidates require more then just the base of the party. Independent voters are a key block of voters in this country and typically the party that can gain the independent voice at the voting booth wins elections. Being that my mother is an independent voter and votes for both Democrats and Republicans I have discussed with her on many occasions the current status of the Democrat party. She has told me multiple times that she feels the Democrat party has not offered her convincing arguments to vote for that side in the last few elections. While my mother is just one of many independents in this nation I'm just wondering overall what independent voters think of the current state of the Democrat party and do you think they offer more then just anti-Republicanism, but more importantly is the party turning off your vote?
 

RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
5,649
0
0
How does any of that make the Dems look like the article tries so poorly to portray them?

1. Obama looks like the bigger man. McCain's little "I'm going to take my ball and go home" letter makes it appear as if he is a spoiled little punk.
2. Do I need to remind you that the leader of your party KEPT 100 large from Jack Abramhoff?
3. Why should the Dems care what the press is saying right now? Come September, you will start to hear about the incompetencies and corruption of this administration and the rest of the Republican party.
4. Nice try using an OPINION piece as a news story.
 

jlmadyson

Platinum Member
Aug 13, 2004
2,201
0
0
Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
How does any of that make the Dems look like the article tries so poorly to portray them?

1. Obama looks like the bigger man. McCain's little "I'm going to take my ball and go home" letter makes it appear as if he is a spoiled little punk.
2. Do I need to remind you that the leader of your party KEPT 100 large from Jack Abramhoff?
3. Why should the Dems care what the press is saying right now? Come September, you will start to hear about the incompetencies and corruption of this administration and the rest of the Republican party.
4. Nice try using an OPINION piece as a news story.

It is a political opinion piece but more importantly I'm more interested in what the independent voter thinks not necessarily what the left or right thinks. I believe the author offers some serious questions such as the ones I pointed out in the OP.
 

RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
5,649
0
0
I have been registered as an Independant voter for almost 20 years and have voted for almost as many Rs as I have Ds.

This administration and a fair amount of the Rs in Congress have left a bitter taste in my mouth as far as the Rs party as a whole on the national level. I will still support a lot of the Rs on the local level as I have in the past and a few on the national. But my take is that there is a massive Repub PR machine that is putting out pieces like this to further an agenda that is bad for the country.

The article lays out it's side of the story without any mention of what those in it's own party are doing with regards to scandal, coersion and lobbying. I merely gave what I believe to be the other side of the coin. I believe that it is better to leave the Repub party to it's own demise or, at the very least, let them get over confident and think that all of the current events are not going to be an issue and slam them upside the head with them come full campaign season.
 

catnap1972

Platinum Member
Aug 10, 2000
2,607
0
76
Originally posted by: jlmadyson
Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
How does any of that make the Dems look like the article tries so poorly to portray them?

1. Obama looks like the bigger man. McCain's little "I'm going to take my ball and go home" letter makes it appear as if he is a spoiled little punk.
2. Do I need to remind you that the leader of your party KEPT 100 large from Jack Abramhoff?
3. Why should the Dems care what the press is saying right now? Come September, you will start to hear about the incompetencies and corruption of this administration and the rest of the Republican party.
4. Nice try using an OPINION piece as a news story.

It is a political opinion piece but more importantly I'm more interested in what the independent voter thinks not necessarily what the left or right thinks. I believe the author offers some serious questions such as the ones I pointed out in the OP.

Here's a question for YOU Mr. Smartguy...give me (the "independant voter" whose opinion you're looking for) some convincing reasons why I should vote Republican.

And no "the dems suck so there's your answer" or "King Georgie is turning America into a police state in order to keep you safe" type responses please.
 

jlmadyson

Platinum Member
Aug 13, 2004
2,201
0
0
Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
I have been registered as an Independant voter for almost 20 years and have voted for almost as many Rs as I have Ds.

This administration and a fair amount of the Rs in Congress have left a bitter taste in my mouth as far as the Rs party as a whole on the national level. I will still support a lot of the Rs on the local level as I have in the past and a few on the national. But my take is that there is a massive Repub PR machine that is putting out pieces like this to further an agenda that is bad for the country.

The article lays out it's side of the story without any mention of what those in it's own party are doing with regards to scandal, coersion and lobbying. I merely gave what I believe to be the other side of the coin. I believe that it is better to leave the Repub party to it's own demise or, at the very least, let them get over confident and think that all of the current events are not going to be an issue and slam them upside the head with them come full campaign season.

Thank you for your insight and I certainly respect your opinion on the issues. I believe the 06 elections will be decided once again by the independent voice and I think it is important to hear that voice on the issues.
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
I was registered R most of my life but am now registered as a D and I think the Repug's have ****** in their nest one time too many. All the op-ed pieces in the world aren't going to change my mind about what needs to happen. We need to end the one party domination.

If the shift doesn't happen this election, it will the next.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Unlike the Republicans the Democrats are party with a broad range of ideas and positions. It is more difficult to get the addicted to the 20 second sound bite Americans to understand the complexity of Democratic policies and the world in general.
Hence the Republicans tend to look smooth and polished and the Democrats in turmoil.
But it doesn't change the fact that the Democrats are right on very many issues and the Republicans wrong.
Just a matter of educating a moribund public.
 

jimkyser

Senior member
Nov 13, 2004
547
0
0
I vote for both Dems and Reoubs. I have a lot of respect for John McCain and he is the likely candidate that I would most want to vote for as our next president, but I think this article tries real hard to make Obama look bad for saying he wanted to follow the published procedures. See, that's what the squabble between him and McCain is about. McCain wants to somehow bypass much of the process and Obama doesn't. It's that simple. I think McCain needs to take a pill and realize what's important to call people out about, like the whole torture issue, and what's not, like procedural questions.
 

Todd33

Diamond Member
Oct 16, 2003
7,842
2
81
A conservative take McCain's side in an op-ed. Wow, that's news. *yawn* You can find just as many or people who think this whole mess was McCain's fault and we have had threads on it already. I guess you just wanted to make another flame bait topic and this guy's title is right up your ally.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!

Gee, you think she was on it to try and get walmart to do a better job of treating its employees?
Or maybe it was because at that time walmart was pushing its American made merchandise and hadn't begun the big push to outsource?
Duh.
Now I am lmfao at you.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: techs
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!

Gee, you think she was on it to try and get walmart to do a better job of treating its employees?
Or maybe it was because at that time walmart was pushing its American made merchandise and hadn't begun the big push to outsource?
Duh.
Now I am lmfao at you.

Highly unlikely, but nice spin.
 

raildogg

Lifer
Aug 24, 2004
12,892
572
126
Wow, LMAO at the people in this thread. Oh the loyal faithful.

Republican bad.

Democrat good.

2 legs bad, 4 legs good.


Baaaaaahhhhhhh.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.

Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.

Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
Hey, educating right wing neo-cons one brainwashed person at a time. Its a difficult job but someone has to do it.;)


 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.
Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
Grow up.
 

RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
5,649
0
0
Originally posted by: raildogg
Wow, LMAO at the people in this thread. Oh the loyal faithful.

Republican bad.

Democrat good.

2 legs bad, 4 legs good.


Baaaaaahhhhhhh.

This is starting to seem like you standard reply. How about you just save us all the trouble of having to have to scroll down past it next time?

OR....actually try to add something that is relevant to the topic.
 

3chordcharlie

Diamond Member
Mar 30, 2004
9,859
1
81
Originally posted by: raildogg
Wow, LMAO at the people in this thread. Oh the loyal faithful.

Republican bad.

Democrat good.

2 legs bad, 4 legs good.


Baaaaaahhhhhhh.

?

There's nothing remotely like that in this thread.. did you click the wrong thread?
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.
Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
Grow up.

I am not sorry if my response showed how utterly ridiculous your theory sounded.

But I am sure if you try hard enough you can probably get Bush involved somewhere in the plot to turn Walmart into the most evil corporation ever to have existed. 1992 and the death of Sam walton is just way to coincidental.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.
Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
Grow up.
I am not sorry if my response showed how utterly ridiculous your theory sounded.

But I am sure if you try hard enough you can probably get Bush involved somewhere in the plot to turn Walmart into the most evil corporation ever to have existed. 1992 and the death of Sam walton is just way to coincidental.
Fluff off, troll. You're obviously too young to remember Wal-Mart's high-profile "Buy American" program, where Sam Walton made a point of stocking American-made goods, even when they had to pay more for them. That program died with Sam; the rest is history. I suggest you educate yourself before sticking your feet in your mouth again.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
15,776
392
126
Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
Originally posted by: raildogg
Wow, LMAO at the people in this thread. Oh the loyal faithful.

Republican bad.

Democrat good.

2 legs bad, 4 legs good.


Baaaaaahhhhhhh.

?

There's nothing remotely like that in this thread.. did you click the wrong thread?
I think it's a bug in the raildogg-troller-v2.bat script.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: Genx87
Clinton was on the board of Walmart?

lmfao!
Ignorance is bliss. Wal-Mart was a different company while Sam Walton was alive. Walton died in 1992, the same year Clinton left her director position. I suspect that's not a coincidence.
Oh of course, I knew there had to some kind of explanation why Walmart was good when Clinton was on the board, but evil now.

Thank you so much!

btw I think you may have a great idea for a book. How to take a great American company and turn it into an evil empire in under a decade!
Grow up.
I am not sorry if my response showed how utterly ridiculous your theory sounded.

But I am sure if you try hard enough you can probably get Bush involved somewhere in the plot to turn Walmart into the most evil corporation ever to have existed. 1992 and the death of Sam walton is just way to coincidental.
Fluff off, troll. You're obviously too young to remember Wal-Mart's high-profile "Buy American" program, where Sam Walton made a point of stocking American-made goods, even when they had to pay more for them. That program died with Sam; the rest is history. I suggest you educate yourself before sticking your feet in your mouth again.

Write a book

 

arsbanned

Banned
Dec 12, 2003
4,853
0
0
Isn't this the second attack on Obama by this poster this week? Regarding the same issue no less? Despite the fact that McCain has been contrite over his melodramatic outburst.
The Repugs seem to be good at melodrama.
We stopped an attack on LA!
It would be funny if it weren't so sad.