One Muslims Apology

[Zebo]

September 12, 2006 -- WELL, here it is, five years late, but here just the same: an apology from an Arab-American for 9/11. No, I didn't help organize the killers or contribute in any way to their terrible cause. However, I was one of millions of Arab-Americans who did the unspeakable on 9/11: nothing.

The only time I raised my voice in protest against these men who killed thousands of innocents in the name of Allah was behind closed doors, among the safety of friends and family. I did at one point write a very vitriolic essay condemning their actions, but fear of becoming another Salman Rushdie kept me from ever trying to publish it.

Well, I'm sick of saying the truth only in private - that Arabs around the world, including Arab-Americans like myself, need to start holding our own culture accountable for the insane, violent actions that our extremists have perpetrated on the world at large.

Yes, our extremists and our culture.

Every single 9/11 hijacker was Arab and a Muslim. The apologists (including President Bush) tried to reassure us that 9/11 had nothing to do with Islam, but was a twisting of a great and noble religion. With all due respect, read the Koran, Mr. President. There's enough there for someone of extreme tendencies to find their way to a global jihad.

There's also enough there for someone of a different mindset to find a path to enlightenment and peace. Still, Rushdie had it right back in 2001: This does have to do with Islam. A Christian who bombs an abortion clinic in the name of God is still a Christian, at least in his interpretation, and saying otherwise doesn't negate the fact that he has spent a goodly amount of time figuring out his version of the one true and right thing to do.

The men who killed 3,000 of our citizens on 9/11 in all likelihood died saying prayers to Allah, and that by itself is one of the most horrific things to me about that day.

And, while my grandparents never waged a jihad, their attitudes toward Jews weren't that much different than Mohammed Atta's. No, they didn't support the Holocaust, but they did believe that Jews were trouble in many different ways, and those sorts of beliefs were passed on to me before I'd ever actually met a Jew...

Read it all.. western applogists should listen to the brave muslims, who risk thier very lives speaking out, such as him, Rushdie , Wafa Sultan, or Walid Shoebat or just read chapter 9 of the Quran islamophobe is a label you will embrace and carry proudly if you value tolerance, justice, freedom of thought and conscience, equality for women and peace.

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedc..._opedcolumnists_emilio_karim_dabul.htm

 

[Alaa]

good. I don't agree with some of it though.

 

[Todd33]

With all due respect, read the Koran, Mr. President. There's enough there for someone of extreme tendencies to find their way to a global jihad.

That's true of the Old Testament too, you can find text to justify just about any atrocity. It good that more moderate Muslims come out and speak up. As soon as the extremist lose sympathy and support they are just a small group of nut-jobs without power or means.

 

[1prophet]

They don't need sympathy or support, all they need to do is make an example of a few and the rest will fall silent

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Todd33

With all due respect, read the Koran, Mr. President. There's enough there for someone of extreme tendencies to find their way to a global jihad.

That's true of the Old Testament too, you can find text to justify just about any atrocity. It good that more moderate Muslims come out and speak up. As soon as the extremist lose sympathy and support they are just a small group of nut-jobs without power or means.

Indeed there are violent passages in the Bible, too. And it's true: People of all religions have done terrible things. But none of these kinds of objections gets to the heart of the matter today in the here and now: Terrorists on a global scale today are using the Quran, not the Bible or the Bhagavad Gita or the Book of Mormon, to justify violence and to convince others that they should act violently or approve of violence. Essentially the other religions are all grown up, had a renaissance an awakening in thier history and practice, Islam never has.

 

[jpeyton]

I can finally rest easy now.

 

[Cutterhead]

Good for him, I can only hope we will see more and more muslim Americans follow suit.

 

[Aisengard]

Good for him. Islam has had a long history of spreading their religion by the sword, so don't expect it to change anytime soon.

Well, it depends on how you define "soon". Judaism was initially spread by the sword. The Jews claimed God gave them the land of the Canaanites after they fled Egypt, so they took it by force. They did some other nasty things after that certainly, but eventually they got over it and don't really do it anymore, save for some fanatical fvcks who no one likes. Christianity, everyone knows, was primarily spread by the sword, and we are still in the midst of getting over it, although we're much better now than we were say 500 years ago. Islam is still in the baby stages of spreading their religion by the sword, and it looks to be peaking again. Maybe in 500 years when they have a little more time to mature, and people like this guy become more prominent, we can hope for relative peace. Just don't expect it in our or our children's children times ten's lifetimes.

 

[ProfJohn]

Aparently there is a lot of this going on now in the Islamic world.
There was an article by an arab writer about how people in Lebanon were really pissed of at Hezbollah for starting the war with Israel.
We may be getting close to the point where the average Muslim decides they have had enough and start taking actions to put an end to this 'holy war'
We know that the recent plot to blow up airlines was uncovered by a muslim who told the British that his roomate or friend or whatever was acting strange and had strange beliefes.

 

[Aisengard]

There was also an article in the Boston Globe about how Palestinians are getting REALLY pissed at Hamas, probably leading to the news about Hamas dissolving the government and joining up with Fatah...and also renouncing their stance on Israel.

See what good can come out of people laying the blame where it belongs.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Aisengard
There was also an article in the Boston Globe about how Palestinians are getting REALLY pissed at Hamas, probably leading to the news about Hamas dissolving the government and joining up with Fatah...and also renouncing their stance on Israel.

See what good can come out of people laying the blame where it belongs.

take away the $ and the citizens must look to alternatives... no longer can they sit idle in Mosques and Madrass' plotting thier hatred for the USA.. that's why I think the first thing to rid the world of terrorits cut off oil importation, a boon to idle thought for the fundi's... Also cutting off all aid to every islamic country would be a great step..

 

[Alaa]

Islamic rule was spread by sword but Islam itself as a religion was not spread by sword as everyone could choose to convert or not! there is difference and please take care of this when you talk next time.Thanks. >>Aisengard

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Alaa
Islamic rule was spread by sword but Islam itself as a religion was not spread by sword as everyone could choose to convert or not! there is difference and please take care of this when you talk next time.Thanks. >>Aisengard

Please take care to mention Islam and Dhimmitude where for centuries jews and christians had to pay a xtra tax 25% to remain so, had no legal rights, were essentially slaves to thier muslim overlords.

if anyone is interested, Bat Yeor's: "Islam and Dhimmitude" , about half of which is annotated with proof goes into painful detail of what life is like under islamic rule for the Dhimmi.

http://www.amazon.com/Islam-Dhimmitude-Where-Civilizations-Collide/dp/0838639437


If you would like a more realistic and up-to-date example go to Palestine and break out your Bible or Book of Morman. You will be dead in seconds but it will be very educational.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Alaa
Islamic rule was spread by sword but Islam itself as a religion was not spread by sword as everyone could choose to convert or not! there is difference and please take care of this when you talk next time.Thanks. >>Aisengard

Please take care to mention Islam and Dhimmitude where for centuries jews and christians had to pay a xtra tax 25% to remain so, had no legal rights, were essentially slaves to thier muslim overlords.

if anyone is interested, Bat Yeor's: "Islam and Dhimmitude" , about half of which is annotated with proof goes into painful detail of what life is like under islamic rule for the Dhimmi.

http://www.amazon.com/Islam-Dhimmitude-Where-Civilizations-Collide/dp/0838639437


If you would like a more realistic and up-to-date example go to Palestine and break out your Bible or Book of Morman. You will be dead in seconds but it will be very educational.

Nice :thumbsup:

 

[blackllotus]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Essentially the other religions are all grown up, had a renaissance an awakening in thier history and practice, Islam never has.

This is exactly right, however kicking their ass (as you seem to advocate) is not the right way to bring about such a renaissance. Attacking them will only cause even more of them to support the radical leaders (you have to remember that what we view as liberating, most of them view as attacking).

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
people in Lebanon were really pissed of at Hezbollah for starting the war with Israel.

Lol.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: Zebo
Essentially the other religions are all grown up, had a renaissance an awakening in thier history and practice, Islam never has.

This is exactly right, however kicking their ass (as you seem to advocate) is not the right way to bring about such a renaissance. Attacking them will only cause even more of them to support the radical leaders (you have to remember that what we view as liberating, most of them view as attacking).

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
people in Lebanon were really pissed of at Hezbollah for starting the war with Israel.

Lol.

I never advocated kicking thier ass.. but if you are going to start a fight you damn well better finish it not do it half-assed like our execution in last two wars has been. My plan for sucess would'nt even have troops in afghanistan nor remove taliban.

1. Oil and all trade. Cut muslims off finanacially so they must turn to within to access thier problems. How many nuclear power stations and electric car recharge stations could we have built for $480 Billion pissed away in Iraq and Afghanistan? Lots and Lots of R&D into cars making it a reality...In effect cutting off the terrorist life-line, what's been called the largest transfer of wealth in human history to these fanatics. Since we don't know how to fight wars anymore, aka scorched earth, that's really where we need to be. Starve the beast and make them realise a policy of peace is more profitable.

2. Not just oil either - We should include no more aid for any ME country with thier abominable human rights records. (search Saudi Arabia and human rights it's discusting) No more aid until woman have rights. No more aid until infidels can testify in court against muslims... etc etc etc. Incredibly we still give aid to Saudi Arabia, Egypt and even Hammas.

3. Let the radicals come to power, no more supporting these despot regimes. They will fail and the people there will look to other institutions for thier safty and prosperity. Namley representative democracy and then we we support you.

4. No more immigration of saudis, egyptians etc or any other muslim to the west who does not renouce idealogy of terror, slavery, chattled women etc.. Could they Lie? Sure but when we see them at a rally chanting "Death to America" it will be easy to deport them.

5. Mass Deportations of those who chant such slogans or found to harbor hostility for the west and it's values.

6. air strikes on suspected terrorist training camps would be ok. it's cheap and effective. Also I would'nt object to funneling arms on the down low to freedom fighters which we failed to do for the Kurds, Shia, Lebnanese etc etc etc.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Zebo

1) That would be Russia and China's dream come true, but the oil barons in our government, the petroleum lobby, and the most profitable US corporation would never let that happen.

2) That's a great idea; we should implement this to all countries that receive our aid, Israel included.

3) Fine by me.

4) Most immigrants will happily sign whatever piece of paper you put in front of them.

5) Have you been to an anti-war rally? Most of those people were born here. Where exactly would they be deported to?

6) Great idea.

Not bad Zebo; only 50% BS this round.

 

[alchemize]

Kudos to him. :thumbsup:

1 down, 1,499,999,999 to go

 

[Alaa]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Alaa
Islamic rule was spread by sword but Islam itself as a religion was not spread by sword as everyone could choose to convert or not! there is difference and please take care of this when you talk next time.Thanks. >>Aisengard

Please take care to mention Islam and Dhimmitude where for centuries jews and christians had to pay a xtra tax 25% to remain so, had no legal rights, were essentially slaves to thier muslim overlords.

if anyone is interested, Bat Yeor's: "Islam and Dhimmitude" , about half of which is annotated with proof goes into painful detail of what life is like under islamic rule for the Dhimmi.

http://www.amazon.com/Islam-Dhimmitude-Where-Civilizations-Collide/dp/0838639437


If you would like a more realistic and up-to-date example go to Palestine and break out your Bible or Book of Morman. You will be dead in seconds but it will be very educational.

This number IS: 2.5% do you know the difference? between 2.5 & 25??
besides that it was taken from the rich only not from ladies, old men, children, the poor and anyone who couldn't pay and most of it was being returned to the poor people of this country!!
You are talking as if you are telling a story that you are the only one who knows about it!!
The didn't treat anyone as slaves they even didn't make them fight for their own country!!
plus that amount of 2.5% will not be valid if you joined the army!!

 

[Skyclad1uhm1]

If you really want you can interpret the phonebook as the word of god calling upon you to kill people. And if you really want you can interpret it as the word of god calling upon you to live in peace with the rest of humanity.

If you pick up the Qu'ran with the desire to find an evil interpretation you will be as succesful as when picking up the Bible with that purpose (or indeed simply the phonebook).

Interpretation has always been the weakness of organised religion. Everyone wants to interpret it their way.

 

[sandorski]

meh