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Once the death penalty is gone...

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Government can't be trusted with a double ended toothpick except when it comes to death penalty cases. The death penalty isn't wrong because the convicted doesn't deserve the death penalty. The death penalty is wrong because governments (us, really) are incapable of consistently crafting and applying laws in a fair, impartial, and reasonable manner.

That line of reasoning does not work in cases where the evidence is completely overwhelming and guilt has been proven well beyond a reasonable doubt of which there are many examples of such cases. In other words scum like Richard Allen Davis shouldn't be outliving his victim from the point of time his original death sentence was issue to the point were he is actually executed.
 
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To the semi rational law abiding mind, the death penalty is the ultimate deterrent.

But the flaw in that reasoning is in assuming violent criminals are rational. And sit there with calculators and play expected gain and against possible losses calculations. And then conclude, if a penalty is high enough, no expected gain is great enough to risk the death penalty.

After all, Psychological study after study has concluded the death penalty is not a deterrent to such crimes. Especially when many violent and senseless murders are committed for miniscule economic gain.

After the fact of a murder, and convicting the the one to blame in a court of law, society is face with three slippery slope problems. (1) We can maybe all agree, get such people off the street, put them in iron cages, because its not safe for the rest of us to have them still running around loose.(2) After that, it gets down to costs, especially with the legal system of the USA. And the fact is and remains, its always cheaper to jail them for life even after housing and feeding is factored in, rather than to try to seek the death penalty. (3) Then we have another factor, our legal system does not always work, and we find we killed the wrong man of woman after they are dead---when new evidence comes in.

Then there is another factor not often considered, because of a defect in prosecution funding. Most murders are State offensives, which means the county in the State where the murder was committed has to bear all the expense of the trial. And since nearly every county in every state has minimal funding for its prosecutors and investigators, will soak up their budget for an entire year if they seek a death penalty trial. Meanwhile lesser criminals get a free pass, because there are no resources left in their budget to prosecute them. So they have a field day while their victims get screwed.
 
The people that are against the death penalty, probably never had a family murdered by a repeat offender.

I think the people that oppose stiff penalties, should be required to live next to a half-way house. Or better yet, become a foster parent to a serial killer.


I had my entire family murdered by someone who was on their first offence.
 
Lemon law:

The death penalty isn't meant to be a deterrent. It is about justice, and making the worst of the worst pay a terrible price for what they did.

Re: the DP = murder. No it doesn't, that's like saying that incarceration is the moral equivalent of kidnapping.
 
I am for the death penalty but not the way we have it now. The way we do it now is cruel. A person should not have to sit on death row for years thinking about it. I realize there are appeals and such but there should be the option for the accused to decide to forego all that and have sentence carried out immediately. To put someone in a cell , make them wait 10 years , each day thinking about the final day amounts to a double sentence in my view. You are penalizing them twice. I know if it were me I would prefer they just took me outside the courtroom and shot me.
 
The people that are against the death penalty, probably never had a family murdered by a repeat offender.

I think the people that oppose stiff penalties, should be required to live next to a half-way house. Or better yet, become a foster parent to a serial killer.

Yeah I'm gonna go out on a limb and say the majority of Americans have never had a family member murdered by a repeat offender.

Quite a stretch there.
 
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everyone should be given flowers and a cash reward for comiting a crime..... that's where we're headed anyway
You should see what Canada is like. I could break into your house, hurt myself, then I can sue you because your house was not safe to break into. I hear California is just as bad.

But the flaw in that reasoning is in assuming violent criminals are rational. And sit there with calculators and play expected gain and against possible losses calculations. And then conclude, if a penalty is high enough, no expected gain is great enough to risk the death penalty.
Death doesn't scare me. Pain scares me. Being beaten scares me. Jails in third world countries scare me. Death is not a very good deterrent for that reason.
 
We talking about this BS again?

What if's?

I see it this way: The DP is a faulty system that wastes human life. Until we get a PERFECT method of determining guilt, it is a flawed system that kills more innocents.

The system we have now cannot be Ivory Pure w/o undue cost, so it is a lose/lose situation that does not merit further debate.

Now life w/o parole? I have no problem with that, but I still see it as a waste. I am not for slave labor, but there HAS to be something we can use these human space heaters for in this technical age.

Any ideas for what guys like this could be used for (besides fry cooks) when put into storage for life?
 
Maybe we can just change the laws so the death penalty only applies to criminals who are caught red handed or are on video doing it or admit to the murder. I am pro death penalty and want to see it used a lot more. I dont like paying my tax dollars for someone to rot away in jail for the rest of their life for murder. I could care less why they did what they did. They did it and now have to pay the consequences.

I think they should have one year to appeal any sentence. That should be plenty of time to prove your innocence assuming you are actually innocent in the first place. And as for the cost arguement of the death penalty. Please..get a rope and hang em. Rope is cheap and can last many hangings before needing replacement. I dont believe in humanly killing someone who inhumanly killed someone themselves.

That is all...carry on.

I'm kinda with you.
I think any caught red handed, on tape, confession, DNA evidence, ect, send em to the firing squad.
As far as apeals, anyone pleading appeals, should get 5 years tops to appeal and get judgment.
Though I also think repeat sexual offenders, ie rapists, and such, not 18 year olds that have consentual sex with their 16 year old GF or BF, should be put down too. They've proven they can not be re-habilitated.
 
Liars, lie.

I'm googling this right now. Second result on google is a story from Britain 😀
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/jun/14/tonymartin.ukcrime
The career criminal shot and injured by Tony Martin as he led the raid on his remote farmhouse was yesterday given the go-ahead to sue the jailed farmer for damages.
.....
Conservative home affairs spokesman Dominic Grieve said: "There is clearly an imbalance in the law between householders and burglars. We strongly disagree with the fact that burglars can sue for damage done to them in the course of committing a crime."
lol UK. Will Hal get in here and defend this silliness?

Third result is from Australia:
http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...lERAAAAIBAJ&sjid=UJUDAAAAIBAJ&pg=2860,1952623
Guy breaks into house. Owner's dog bites guy. Guy sues owner. Guy is awarded damages. Yes he actually won that lawsuit.


Fourth google result comes from good ol USA
http://www.gazette.com/articles/jury-123946-burglar-lot.html
An El Paso County jury on Friday awarded nearly $300,000 to the daughter of a burglar who was fatally shot in 2009 while breaking into an auto lot.
....
Fox, 20, was shot after he and a friend scaled a fence to get inside Southwest Auto Sales at 2444 Platte Place in the city’s Knob Hill neighborhood. According to the accomplice, Brian Corbin, they had smoked methamphetamine and were looking to steal anything to buy more drugs.
Shoot a meth head breaking into your business = you go to jail. If meth heads start hassling you, remember to be a good citizen and let them take anything they want. I'm sure the police will recover 100% of the stolen property and none of it will be damaged.


I guess it's not just Canada. USA probably has it the worst because USA doesn't have the "loser pays" law where the person filing suit can be forced to pay for the defendant's legal fees if the lawsuit is too stupid.
 
Too much money is spent on both sides of the death penalty debate. If it is gone then the focus will be lost. There just isnt the same fervor about life without parole sentences and there never will be. How can you get into a heated debate about parole?
 
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