On Sequester cuts: "They forget it's faces and families"

[Slew Foot]

Boo Hoo f'n hoo. The government doesnt get money from the sky (well, may be it does), it has to come from other Americans.

 

[Lithium381]

So when government regulations on the coal industry caused massive job losses . ... those people were faceless? When taxes on gas cause truckers to not be able to eat . . they were faceless? I seem to remember people saying something along the lines of "well then they should pick another job"..... but since these are government workers we're supposed to feel sorry for them? Nope.


If we can survive with 20% cut and I think we can, we should cut 20% everywhere.

 

[Nintendesert]

Boo Hoo f'n hoo. The government doesnt get money from the sky (well, may be it does), it has to come from other Americans.

And Americans demand certain services. You think those services are free? :hmm:

 

[Jaskalas]

Meet the Americans who will be hurt by cripling debt.

Debt can't cripple, USA Has 'Infinite Amount of Money'...

Feds agree.

 

[piasabird]

Bernanke has spent $45 Bil a month since september for about 250 Billion. This is welfare for wallstreet and banks. Just bring troops home from Germany and France and Italy, and South Korea and Japan. The object of our military is suppose to be to protect the USA. So either those countries pay us or the troops come home.

 

[Nintendesert]

So when government regulations on the coal industry caused massive job losses . ... those people were faceless? When taxes on gas cause truckers to not be able to eat . . they were faceless? I seem to remember people saying something along the lines of "well then they should pick another job"..... but since these are government workers we're supposed to feel sorry for them? Nope.


If we can survive with 20% cut and I think we can, we should cut 20% everywhere.

So people that work in the government are supposed to work without any time off? Leave has been cancelled for people working in government positions to cover the furloughs. 🙄

 

[cubby1223]

And Americans demand certain services. You think those services are free? :hmm:

Seriously, I don't think you're as dumb as this comment makes you look.

But it's close.

Do you see anyone here saying government should be abolished? That no one should pay any taxes?


Or I'll go with your comment. Americans demand welfare, they demand medicare, they demand disability payouts, they demand food stamps, they demand free cell phones, they demand rent stipends, they demand... Well, I'm not making use of any of these handouts. Makes me think I'm a damn fool for not living a life of sloth.

 

[nehalem256]

So people that work in the government are supposed to work without any time off? Leave has been cancelled for people working in government positions to cover the furloughs. 🙄

Now I am confused. Aren't furloughs time off of work? ^_^

 

[TerryMathews]

Now I am confused. Aren't furloughs time off of work? ^_^

Yes, they are.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Now I am confused. Aren't furloughs time off of work? ^_^

mandatory unpaid leave 😛

 

[Lithium381]

So people that work in the government are supposed to work without any time off? Leave has been cancelled for people working in government positions to cover the furloughs. 🙄

Why are you making it sound like government workers and private workers should be treated differently? Is your question "So people that work are supposed to work without any time off"?

They are getting time off. They're just not getting paid for it. So? If a private company reduced it's vacation policy you wouldn't bat an eye. .

 

[BoomerD]

So...are Congressmen and women...and their staff also going to have to take the mandatory furlough days...and cuts in pay?

If so, maybe it's a good thing. If not...then fuck them...they should have to suffer the same budget cuts as everyone else.

 

[ccbadd]

It's not just Congress that forgets that real human beings are affected. It's all of the dittoheads who drone endlessly about the evils of government spending. They act as if tax dollars are being poured into a shredder. It's an ignorant, even idiotic point of view. The overwhelming majority of tax dollars go right back into the economy, either directly via government employees and beneficiaries, or indirectly into private sector contracts. That doesn't mean spending cuts aren't sometimes necessary, but let's not pretend such cuts don't hurt real people.

Based on my own past government experience, I also agree that across-the-board budget cuts are the least efficient way to cut spending. They are easy and brainless for the politicians, but they are also irresponsible. They invariably result in far more meat being cut than fat because most fat is entrenched within the system. Cutting it requires focus and planning, something you don't get in "Cut x%!!!" fire drills.

Look at it his way, with no annual budgets, replaced by continuing resolutions, you get across the board spending increased by way of base line budgeting. This is killing our nations credit and wasting tonnes of real money that could go into the economy. Why have you and you like not railed against it? All money goes into the economy, just how much is used to improve it vs harm it via borrowing? You are using half baked bs logic.,

 

[rudder]

And Americans demand certain services. You think those services are free? :hmm:

I don't demand the government take my money and provide my retirement funds... I can do that on my own. I don't demand that people get $4000 electric scooters for free, and I don't demand that the president play golf with tiger woods. I don't demand the government to continue building c-17 cargo planes for the USAF when generals have said they have more than enough planes.

Fiscal conservatives aren't for dissolving the federal government. But we expect the government to be good stewards of taxpayer money. When the governments taxes an American worker, that is money that is pulled from the economy. The government should provide limited services not be our entire economy and not encourage people to live off the governments teet.

 

[Bowfinger]

Are you fucking out of your mind insane?

No, not at all. What did I say that has you so befuddled?

Welfare, food stamps, disability, medicare, medicaid, rent stipends, free cell phones, the list goes on.

Indeed it does. The largest military in the world (many times over), largely used to extend and protect the financial interests of America's elite; the civil court system (enforces contracts, IP laws, etc.); law enforcement and the criminal court system (theoretically used to keep the haves safe from crime); the banking system; bailing out the banking system; roads, air travel, bridges, reliable power, communications, and other utilities, something all businesses rely on to get raw materials, run their offices and plants, get their employees to work, and sell and distribute their goods and services; education (gives those same businesses the skilled work force they need); public safety and health system; food and safety inspections; basic research; etc., etc. The list is truly endless.

I'm afraid still don't see why you're so befuddled.

Are you trying to tell me that the people who actually are paying for all the free stuff others believe they are entitled to... are the greedy ones who receive all the benefits of America without paying for them?

Ah ha! It's that same reading comprehension issue. I didn't say the have-more takers that cry about taxes are the only greedy Americans. Many of the poor takers are quite greedy as well, milking the system for all they can. Of course many more of the poor are quite proud, and take only what they need to live, but you probably don't hear about them on Fox, or talk radio, or whatever echo chamber you call home.

And you know what's really funny? For all the bitching the have-mores do about how great the poor have it, I just don't see very many of them lining up to be poor. They want to have their cake and eat it too, enjoying the luxuries provided by America while whining about (only partially) paying for them. Strangely enough, those poor people with their purportedly cushy lives would trade places with a average rich guy in a heartbeat. I guess they just don't know how great they have it, right?

Lulz!

 

[Bowfinger]

[ ... ]
When the governments taxes an American worker, that is money that is pulled from the economy. ...

I'm just going to repeat myself here. Although you replied to my earlier post, you apparently did not read it:

"They act as if tax dollars are being poured into a shredder. It's an ignorant, even idiotic point of view. The overwhelming majority of tax dollars go right back into the economy, either directly via government employees and beneficiaries, or indirectly into private sector contracts."
​

The money is simply not "pulled from the economy", no matter how much your masters chant otherwise. It enters the economy through different hands, but it still goes back into the economy. Indeed, in many cases more of it goes into the economy, and more quickly, since middle class workers spend most of their money.

 

[Bowfinger]

Look at it his way, with no annual budgets, replaced by continuing resolutions, you get across the board spending increased by way of base line budgeting. This is killing our nations credit and wasting tonnes of real money that could go into the economy. Why have you and you like not railed against it? All money goes into the economy, just how much is used to improve it vs harm it via borrowing? You are using half baked bs logic.,

You are posting ignorant, and often incoherent gibberish. You seem to be way out of your league, regurgitating little sounds bites without the slightest comprehension of what they might mean or how they might apply.

 

[boomerang]

So...are Congressmen and women...and their staff also going to have to take the mandatory furlough days...and cuts in pay?

If so, maybe it's a good thing. If not...then fuck them...they should have to suffer the same budget cuts as everyone else.

Our Congress critters are all at home now after having flown home on the taxpayers dime. (Something they do every Thursday afternoon.) When they decide to all fly back to D.C. (on the taxpayers dime) to resume the people's business they may consider it.

For an extremely brief and fleeting second before deciding, nah.

 

[nehalem256]

I'm just going to repeat myself here. Although you replied to my earlier post, you apparently did not read it:

"They act as if tax dollars are being poured into a shredder. It's an ignorant, even idiotic point of view. The overwhelming majority of tax dollars go right back into the economy, either directly via government employees and beneficiaries, or indirectly into private sector contracts."
​

The money is simply not "pulled from the economy", no matter how much your masters chant otherwise. It enters the economy through different hands, but it still goes back into the economy. Indeed, in many cases more of it goes into the economy, and more quickly, since middle class workers spend most of their money.

Okay, lets think about this a minute. If raising taxes doesn't pull money from the economy why was everyone talking about the negative impact that letting the payroll tax cut would have on the economy? 😕

 

[Matt1970]

The money is simply not "pulled from the economy", no matter how much your masters chant otherwise. It enters the economy through different hands, but it still goes back into the economy. Indeed, in many cases more of it goes into the economy, and more quickly, since middle class workers spend most of their money.

So there it is. It's better to take from the rich and give to the poor because the poor will spend it and the rich just stuff it into mattresses. Just like the other thread the government knows better how to spend your money than you do.

 

[marvdmartian]

This. And am I the only one who realizes that if the government can get by on a 20% furlow, that they are probably overstaffed by a similar amount?

Or, gosh, that 20% less work will be done, because they'll be sitting home one day a week, NOT getting paid?? 🙄

The bottom line to this whole thing is that BOTH sides are at fault. The elected officials in DC are the most dysfunctional group this country has EVER seen, and might as well just go home, for all they're accomplishing! They don't CARE about the very people who have elected them, because they're wrapped up either in their own delusional idea of how the country should be run, or they're so beholden to special interests that their hands are tied......or BOTH!!

Meanwhile, the very people who work for them continue to suffer, while the politicians drag their feet, and do NOTHING. To add insult to injury, while the folks that keep government working from day to day have to put up with a 20% pre-tax drop in pay (probably a higher percentage in their take-home pay, depending on their deductions), the very people who have caused all of this will continue getting their full pay and benefits! Not only that, but the workers have found out that, due to the stupid LWOP (leave without pay) rules, after 5 pay periods of living with less money, they'll also get hit with a double-whammy gotcha, by not getting any vacation time accrued to that pay period! This can add a day or two MORE time they won't get paid, since they won't get that vacation time!! 😵

Meanwhile, Obama, the Congress and the Senate continue to fiddle, while Washington DC burns. I say fire the whole lot of them, and put some normal people back in those positions! 😡

 

[Bowfinger]

So there it is. It's better to take from the rich and give to the poor because the poor will spend it and the rich just stuff it into mattresses. Just like the other thread the government knows better how to spend your money than you do.

When you're done huffing and puffing at straw men, what part of my comment (i.e., my actual words) was inaccurate?

 

[Bowfinger]

Okay, lets think about this a minute. If raising taxes doesn't pull money from the economy why was everyone talking about the negative impact that letting the payroll tax cut would have on the economy? 😕

Doh! Because there was no corresponding increase in government spending. It is the spending that helps the economy.

 

[Nintendesert]

I don't demand the government take my money and provide my retirement funds... I can do that on my own. I don't demand that people get $4000 electric scooters for free, and I don't demand that the president play golf with tiger woods. I don't demand the government to continue building c-17 cargo planes for the USAF when generals have said they have more than enough planes.

Fiscal conservatives aren't for dissolving the federal government. But we expect the government to be good stewards of taxpayer money. When the governments taxes an American worker, that is money that is pulled from the economy. The government should provide limited services not be our entire economy and not encourage people to live off the governments teet.

Of course. However people do demand that the government kick out all those dirty illegals. Manage the countries resources etc. That's why this sequester is bullshit and shouldn't be supported. It isn't a targeted cut on programs that aren't needed, it's sending middle class people home with a 20% paycut while we quibble over whether rich people should be paying a few % points more in taxes.

As for the leave portion mentioned earlier, sending people home without pay is not the same as allowing someone to take their earned leave off to spend however they like. Many in the government already work through holidays and work double and triples shifts to secure the borders and bring cargo into this country due to being understaffed. There are other jobs in the government field that are similar and people not being able to take time off until the end of the fiscal year means they are going to lose a lot of leave they have earned.

Why are some of you so vehement in fucking over other middle class workers in this country while we give banks/oil companies passes and more tax payer money than is being saved by these sequesters year over year?

 

[Theb]

Explaining the jobs people performed, and why federal tax dollars are needed for those jobs would be a better approach for convincing me this is important than telling me what they bought and what they won't be able to buy now.