• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

Old Problem, New Headache!

S

superkdogg

Senior member
I've seen the NTLDR missing message before, but this time it's becoming a real pain. The problem is that when I load the recovery console, it doesn't detect my existing installation of WINXP. I go through the song and dance, recovery console looks for an existing installation and .... doesn't find one. Thus, I have no OS log into, and nothing to repair, according to MS! Format is a last-ditch option, I have no idea when I last backed up stuff and imaged that drive - should have thought of that last wk 🙁.

Anybody have any hope for me at this point?

I've also tried creating a boot floppy with boot.ini, ntldr and ntdetect on it. When I do, i get something like this:

BOOT: Couldn't find NTDETECT

I'm open to just about anything ATP.
 
Thanks, guys. I have been trying this recovery for 2 days now. I have tried everything. I think I'll just have to give up.

I even installed another hard drive, loaded XP on it, and then tried to import the other drives to repair the issue in windows, but the "import" operation failed.
 
What I think is the problem is that the two drives in my system were both converted to dynamic so that I could have a volume that spans both drives for video recording/editing. In retrospect I really regret that now. No matter what I do, I can't copy the ntdetect and ntldr files to the root of the first drive (where they should be) because I can't get any application to assign drive letters. Can anybody help?
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
I've seen the NTLDR missing message before, but this time it's becoming a real pain. The problem is that when I load the recovery console, it doesn't detect my existing installation of WINXP. I go through the song and dance, recovery console looks for an existing installation and .... doesn't find one. Thus, I have no OS log into, and nothing to repair, according to MS! Format is a last-ditch option, I have no idea when I last backed up stuff and imaged that drive - should have thought of that last wk 🙁.
Click to expand...

It doesn't detect an existing install --- hmm....are you sure your hard disk drivers are detected? For nearly all serial ATA HDDs and for some SCSI and IDE HDD controllers you'll need to hit F6 while booting in RC for it to see your hard drive. Otherwise, it should find your existing install - does it at least drop you onto the C: drive (or c:\windows) when you go to RC?

Anybody have any hope for me at this point?
I've also tried creating a boot floppy with boot.ini, ntldr and ntdetect on it. When I do, i get something like this:
BOOT: Couldn't find NTDETECT
I'm open to just about anything ATP.
Click to expand...

Can you confirm that's the exact msg you get?
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
Thanks, guys. I have been trying this recovery for 2 days now. I have tried everything. I think I'll just have to give up.

I even installed another hard drive, loaded XP on it, and then tried to import the other drives to repair the issue in windows, but the "import" operation failed.
Click to expand...


How so? What did you do, and what did the GUI respond with?
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
What I think is the problem is that the two drives in my system were both converted to dynamic so that I could have a volume that spans both drives for video recording/editing. In retrospect I really regret that now. No matter what I do, I can't copy the ntdetect and ntldr files to the root of the first drive (where they should be) because I can't get any application to assign drive letters. Can anybody help?
Click to expand...

Please describe your exact drive layout, including how it should be configured, what drive letters belong to what drive sets, and what drive volumes you have on the disks. I need far more information to tell you anything than what you've posted so far. It sounds like you have this:

Disk 1: C and D1
Disk 2: D2

D being a 2 part spanned volume.

Is that right?

What is the interface of Disk 1?
 
Thanks for the interest, dclive. I using your analogy, there would also be an E volume after the D1 and 2. Otherwise you're right.

What I tried so far was copying the first of the XP setup disks, then erasing all the files on it. I then copied the NTLDR and NTDETECT files off of the XP cd and wrote a boot.ini file as intructed to on the MS support article regarding this problem. That's when I got the "BOOT: Cannot find ntdetect" error.

When I installed XP on another drive (I have a Promise chip on the mb, so it was easy to do) I went into the disk manager and both of the hdd's in question were seen under XP, but I couldn't import them.

The recovery console can see the drives, and even the volumes in their correct sizes. It just doesn't offer me the option to repair an existing installation. It scans for one, then it kicks me to a c: prompt.

Lemme know if any of this helps, or what else you need to know.
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
Thanks for the interest, dclive. I using your analogy, there would also be an E volume after the D1 and 2. Otherwise you're right.
Click to expand...

Consider it lesson learned - don't ever use dynamic disks unless you absolutely must. They're riskier than basic disks. LDM database gets hosed, and you're finished without some creative LDM copying.

What I tried so far was copying the first of the XP setup disks, then erasing all the files on it. I then copied the NTLDR and NTDETECT files off of the XP cd and wrote a boot.ini file as intructed to on the MS support article regarding this problem. That's when I got the "BOOT: Cannot find ntdetect" error.

When I installed XP on another drive (I have a Promise chip on the mb, so it was easy to do) I went into the disk manager and both of the hdd's in question were seen under XP, but I couldn't import them.
Click to expand...

Mail a copy of the screen you see in disk manager (widen the window so I can see everything in there - if in doubt, take multiple shots), paste the Alt-Printscreen screenshots into a Word document, and mail to bluescreens@comcast.net.

The recovery console can see the drives, and even the volumes in their correct sizes. It just doesn't offer me the option to repair an existing installation. It scans for one, then it kicks me to a c: prompt.

Lemme know if any of this helps, or what else you need to know.
Click to expand...

You can boot a valid XP system by doing the following:
Under another XP system, do a *full* format of a disk:
1. Format a: (do NOT use /q option)
2. Copy that working system's boot.ini, ntdetect, ntldr to a:
3. Edit boot.ini to suit your installation.

Try that and let me know if it boots.

It's kicking you to a C: prompt because it cannot find your c:\windows\system32\config directory, which contains your system, software, SAM, and security (ie the registry) files, so it doesn't know how to authenticate you as a valid user.

With that secondary install of XP, can you see that folder (on your original install, naturally) and confirm the files are there and reasonably similarly sized compared to your second install's folder at that same location?

What exactly is "the Promise chip on the motherboard" - are you using that to RAID your drives? How does that figure into this? Is that natively supported by XP, or are you using F6 at the boot of the recovery console to specify drivers?
 
I'll follow your other suggestions, but to answer your questions:
With the secondary installation, I cannot do anything with the drives in question. Nothing at all, except for format them, which I do not want to do.

My mobo is a K7NXP-R. The RAID controller was disabled, because I had no use for it. I was using XP's 'raid' capabilities to do the spanning. I just enabled it and used it to be able to install windows without messing with the other two drives.

BTW, consider it lesson learned. Dynamic disks suck when something goes wrong. Oh well, I guess live and learn.

I'll see if I can get some screenshots and send them. I'll also try your step by step of the floppy boot and maybe that'll work for me. Thanks.
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
I'll follow your other suggestions, but to answer your questions:
With the secondary installation, I cannot do anything with the drives in question. Nothing at all, except for format them, which I do not want to do.

My mobo is a K7NXP-R. The RAID controller was disabled, because I had no use for it. I was using XP's 'raid' capabilities to do the spanning. I just enabled it and used it to be able to install windows without messing with the other two drives.

BTW, consider it lesson learned. Dynamic disks suck when something goes wrong. Oh well, I guess live and learn.

I'll see if I can get some screenshots and send them. I'll also try your step by step of the floppy boot and maybe that'll work for me. Thanks.
Click to expand...

If you cannot do anything, that suggests that the LDM database cannot be read, so XP doesn't know what to do with the drives or how they associate with one another. For a dynamic disk, you can freely move them from machine to machine and then, once imported, they should reassociated as a RAID set. Are you spanning or using RAID0? The two are completely different.
 
I'm spanning. One non-RAID volume that uses the space on both drives.

I tried to import the two drives in question when I installed onto the 3rd disk (the one that is not normally part of this machine). That's when I knew I had a real problem, because I couldn't import them. I know you probably need the screenshot or a word-for-word description of the error message I got when failing to import, but I am not at home. I'll post one or the other later. Thanks.

Is there any easy way to restore the LDM database?

Since both disks were dynamic and the LDM seems to be missing or corrupt, would that explain why typical means of fixing the ntldr missing issue are not working? Maybe the LDR is just the first file that turns up missing because the LDM is screwed. Could it be it's just a symptom, not the real problem?
 
Originally posted by: superkdogg
I'm spanning. One non-RAID volume that uses the space on both drives.

I tried to import the two drives in question when I installed onto the 3rd disk (the one that is not normally part of this machine). That's when I knew I had a real problem, because I couldn't import them. I know you probably need the screenshot or a word-for-word description of the error message I got when failing to import, but I am not at home. I'll post one or the other later. Thanks.

Is there any easy way to restore the LDM database?

Since both disks were dynamic and the LDM seems to be missing or corrupt, would that explain why typical means of fixing the ntldr missing issue are not working? Maybe the LDR is just the first file that turns up missing because the LDM is screwed. Could it be it's just a symptom, not the real problem?
Click to expand...

Let's start with the pictures. 🙂 How about MPSREPORTS on the box too - http://download.microsoft.com/download/b/b/1/bb139fcb-4aac-4fe5-a579-30b0bd915706/MPSRPT_SETUPPerf.EXE

(on one line)
 
dclive-I really appreciate the help, but....

I found a utility called Disk Scavenger that will let me get a few key files off of the messed up hdd's. Then it's format city. No more dynamic disks for me and more frequent Data DVD's!

I honestly appreciate the help, but I'm not savvy enough to get this figured out right, I'm just cutting my losses and reinstalling once I grab some key stuff.

Thanks again
 
Dynamic disk will not prevent Recovery Console from detecting the installation. The MBR is still in place and the boot sector for your active partition is hard-linked there (since you can't install to a dynamic disk, you ALWAYS know this is true).

A corrupt LDM or LDM header will prevent you from importing an existing disk into a working OS, but will not prevent the RC from seeing the disk.

Honestly, the only two files I"d be interested in seeing from the MPS Reports are the sector inspector output and the dmdiag output.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top