Ok guys. I need your advice. (Quick info at the bottom) I am working on making this easier to understand since I guess I did not. So let me see what I can do here. Please bear with me on it.
Also from below:
THIS IS NOT A NIGERIA CHECK I AM IN COURT FOR!!! I did get a check from Nigeria back when Ebay and Paypal were different companies, quite some time ago. That was handled and when reported the police told me tough (And then all the info about the Nigeria Check thing became well know also this was on eBay that the Nigerian scam happened to me and again SOME TIME AGO!)
The other checks in question ARE NOT FROM NIGERIA!!!! (Just to make sure that?s clear)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First lets cover the "Your a freaking dumb A**" and so forth posts. I took the steps needed to make sure I thought I was not scammed. I went to the proper places, scanned and emailed them the check front and back before even going in because I did not believe it was real. Then they told me everything was great so I believed them (I mean they are a check cashing place, who else can verify faster, and yes I tried the bank before I ended up getting that check cashed and they pulled it back on me. Luckily it was handled) and cashed the check. After 30 days the come back after me, like it took that long.
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Anyway here?s the deal. I sold 3 Apple Powerbook G4 Ti 800mhz's to a gentleman named Michael Wayen. He told me they were for his business. He wanted to pay with a Cashiers Check. Since I knew of the Nigeria check scam (THIS WAS NOT ASSOCIATED WITH THAT THESE CHECKS WERE NOT FROM NIGERIA) and I had gotten one of those MO's and gone through a ton of crap with my bank once I was careful and told him that I would only accept it if it cleared.
After a month I got a Cashiers Check. I took the check and scanned it. I then called a local check cashing place called Checkmate. They asked me to email them the check; I told them I wanted them to verify the check for me. I sent the email (I have this email with the scan on a backup HD, I had to figure out where outlook stored messages but I should have them on CDR today) and got a reply and phone call back saying the check was great and they wanted to cash it for me.
---I figured that if a check cashing place verified it then it had to be good because all a bank does is check and see if the account exists. Check places call and verify the account, names, amounts, everything. ---
Well I cashed the Cashiers Check with them and sent the three laptops off (They were out of state which was another reason it had thrown up caution flags). Then 29-30 days later I get a call from Phoenix. I am told by the company that they said the check bounced (It took this long?) and that they need information from me. So I told them everything, offered all the info I had, everything.
-------------WHILE THIS WAS GOING ON I SOLD ANOTHER LAPTOP--------------
Now in the mean time I had another laptop for sale and had gotten another request for me to take a Cashiers Check (I still have this one along with another one from Nigeria and the original one from Nigeria?s envelope, the one I have now from Nigeria is unopened) so I went through the same steps. ---This was 1 day before I got the phone call.--- Well this time they told me they could not cash the check until a manager was in the next day. I said that?s fine.
Now when I got the above call the next day I found the number for the bank on the check, called and found out myself that this Cashiers Check was a fraud. I wrote everything down.
Now back on the call, after we spoke he told me they were going to go after the issuer of the check. I told them I would do everything I could to help. Within 1 hour I got a call back saying that the other check I tried to pass was bad and that they were charging me with the check. I again told them what happened and it was the same guy. He told me to pay back the other check in full or they would press charges. I told him I could not do that. I asked him why the view had changed and he mentioned the other check and that I knew it was bad. I said no, I brought it in to be verified. He started yelling at me and that was it.
Now about 2 weeks later the police show up at my house while I am at work. My roommate tells them that I am at work and calls me to let me know they are looking for me. I of course freak out call the cops and we speak about the check issue.
They asked me about both checks and I told them everything. The officer says he is making a phone report and that should be fine. He told me not to accept any further checks I told him I had already stopped entirely. He said if he had anything further he would talk to me on it.
Now I heard nothing for another week then while going into work with my wife a cop was waiting for me at work! They got behind me when I parked, arrested me, called in other units and searched my car!!! They then took out a bag of change and asked if it was mine or my wife?s (At the time I was a server as was my wife we worked at the same place, Texas Roadhouse). Our work told everyone we were arrested for dealing drugs and that they saw the drugs (aka the bag of change). So we were fired for no call no show! But they told my wife it was because they did not believe us on what happened!
Anyway after they arrested us they took both of us to a sub station and had my wife in tears asking her how I made the checks, what was going on, where I got them from. Then they came in and played this "You want to do the right thing, and tell me everything" Story on me. I told the Female detective everything. I offered the other checks, emails, everything. She asked me why I had gotten so many I told her of the check scams (Nigeria, etc) and that this was apparently one of them. She acted like she had never heard of them. She asked me why I did not report it. I said I reported laptop theft to the FBI before. (This was a fun story, I had an iBook G3 500mhz and had purchased a Powerbook Ti online. I was scammed through paypal (this was before eBay owned them) and was left high and dry. I called the FBI and reported it and they showed up at my house. I was like wow I guess they can help. No they said my wife sounded like a woman who had been kidnapped with her daughter and they started asking me question and such. So instead of being helped I was integrated by the FBI of something else. (They apologized later saying it was a huge mistake and our cell phone number was sim. to the one they were tracking and my wife had sounded like the woman they were looking for). So basically I found out what most everyone else has with online trading. (Esp. when it?s with eBay as this Powerbook deal was)) You?re screwed. On the forums yes the user can be banned and others know about it but rarely does anything come of it. So I told her I had given up on reporting things, this was not the first time I had been trolled and I knew as do many others online it?s pretty much hopeless.
She leaves the room and thinks I can not hear her. I hear her telling her boss she thinks I am full of it (Up till then she had acted like she was my friend, you get the idea). So I got pissed, she came back in and I told her I heard what she had said, why was she wasting my time. I told her everything I offered proof and yet she was stringing me along and wasting my time. She said she wanted to go to the house I asked her what would happen, she said we would just look around and if she found anything that showed I was making the checks she would stop there and get a warrant. I said that?s fine let?s do it. She came back in and said they had decided not to go and just took my wife and I to JAIL! They released us later and set a court date.
So I was appointed a lawyer and they had a Grand Jury decided if they should take it to trial (They just decided if there is enough to take it to trial) The first time they claimed the other check I had cashed showed I was doing this constantly and intentionally. Yet the other check was never reported to the police, anyone. The lawyer had the case thrown out of court, but they came back and did it again only this time they did not enter the same information. The grand jury asked "Do they not check these checks when you go in?" The prosecutor said he did not have that information. And that was it! So again I was told I have to go to trial again!
So I met my lawyer again I had already given here all the emails I had from Michael, I had also given her copied of all the checks, envelopes, everything. She told me that they had offered a plea of a class 4 felony!! I was like hell no! She said she agreed with me but that the case was losable. I asked why and she said because you did not report it to the police and they have the check you cashed. I told her everything and pointed out everything I gave her. She just told me the case is losable but if I got her the emails showing the check scan I sent to be verified it would be easier plus all the other information I could get her.
Now today she told me she had gotten a new plea, a class 6 that with 1.5yrs probation would be reduced to a misdemeanor (SP?). She said we go into court tomorrow to extend the time on the case.
Basically I am lost, and my brain is fried from trying to write everything down, I am going to recap and see if I missed anything but basically I am really lost here and have no clue what to do. (Also my lawyer is appointed by the state).
(Quick Info/Cliffs)
Basically I got bad checks from scammers in this order:
1) Cashed at a bank, was from Nigeria I still have the empty envelope. Cops called but we were told all we could do was go after the issuer of the check.
2) Cashiers Check that was from Micheal. Sent a Scanned copy to Checkmate they said it was great and cashed it. Then 30 days later told me it was bad.
3) Cashiers Check on another laptop. Check not cashed but taken into same Checkmate to verify. They could not get a hold of the bank at the time (To late I believe) and told me to come back in the morning (this was before the call about the check above #2). After finding out about check #2 I called and verified the check myself, found out it was fake. (I still have this as well)
4) To provide proof I accepted an offer for a Nigeria check as well again just to get one and have it unopened. I got it and still have it as well.
I have been arrested at my work with my wife; we both lost our jobs because of it. We were interrogated, put in jail overnight and released.
I have been to court twice, the first time the case was dismissed, and the second time is now. I was offered a Plea for a class 4 felony which I rejected.
My lawyer keeps telling me she feels this is a losable case for some reason. (I am not sure why still I will talk to her this week or so). We have a new plea that?s a class 6 and will become a misdemeanor if I complete 1.5yrs of probation.
I believe the charges are classes 3 and 4 felonies for theft and misrepresentation.
Flat out I told basically everything above. I am not sure I got everything but there is so much in my head to remember and I am thinking it faster then I can type it. Basically I want to see what you guys think here. I am lost, I have no clue what to think and I do not understand how they can blame me for the check and have any chance of a case with all the information they have now.
I mean, I did not make them; I took them to a place to verify them. I have all the information and yet somehow they can pin it on me.
What do you guys think? I have a lot to read over and correct spelling and anything I left out but I want to know what you guys think.
Thanks everyone.
Seems there is some confusion so let me make it clear:
THIS IS NOT A NIGERIA CHECK I AM IN COURT FOR!!! I did get a check from Nigeria back when Ebay and Paypal were different companies, quite some time ago. That was handled and when reported the police told me tough (And then all the info about the Nigeria Check thing became well know also this was on eBay that the Nigerian scam happened to me and again SOME TIME AGO!)
The other checks in question ARE NOT FROM NIGERIA!!!! (Just to make sure that?s
clear)
Another thing to make clear:
Question from another member
As I pointed out I took a Check from Nigeria quite some time ago and took it to the bank. They cashed it no questions asked then reversed it. It was made 100% clear to me by the bank that they only check to see the account exists. So I almost got nailed on that one but did not really spend any of the money.
NOW at a CHECK CASHING PLACE, the call the bank, they verify everything. So I wanted to be 110% sure this time and not have any problems so I did not even go in I just called and emailed them the check. They told me after checking everything it was good.
I guess I did not make that clear so let me do so,
A) There was Delievery Confirmation
B) I lost the records from the post office when I bought them.
That?s why I went with the Check cashing place.
MILLS CLIFF NOTES!!!
He sells laptop and is paid with a cashier's check.
Check cashing place says check is good and gives him the money. He even scans it and has it verified.
30 days later the check bounced.
Before check bounced he did the same thing with another check.
The first check comes back as fraud.
He finds the second is a fraud (This check was never cashed!!)
He gets arrested.
Loses job.
Cops don't believe him
He has evidence but has a crappy public attorney.
Also from below:
THIS IS NOT A NIGERIA CHECK I AM IN COURT FOR!!! I did get a check from Nigeria back when Ebay and Paypal were different companies, quite some time ago. That was handled and when reported the police told me tough (And then all the info about the Nigeria Check thing became well know also this was on eBay that the Nigerian scam happened to me and again SOME TIME AGO!)
The other checks in question ARE NOT FROM NIGERIA!!!! (Just to make sure that?s clear)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First lets cover the "Your a freaking dumb A**" and so forth posts. I took the steps needed to make sure I thought I was not scammed. I went to the proper places, scanned and emailed them the check front and back before even going in because I did not believe it was real. Then they told me everything was great so I believed them (I mean they are a check cashing place, who else can verify faster, and yes I tried the bank before I ended up getting that check cashed and they pulled it back on me. Luckily it was handled) and cashed the check. After 30 days the come back after me, like it took that long.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anyway here?s the deal. I sold 3 Apple Powerbook G4 Ti 800mhz's to a gentleman named Michael Wayen. He told me they were for his business. He wanted to pay with a Cashiers Check. Since I knew of the Nigeria check scam (THIS WAS NOT ASSOCIATED WITH THAT THESE CHECKS WERE NOT FROM NIGERIA) and I had gotten one of those MO's and gone through a ton of crap with my bank once I was careful and told him that I would only accept it if it cleared.
After a month I got a Cashiers Check. I took the check and scanned it. I then called a local check cashing place called Checkmate. They asked me to email them the check; I told them I wanted them to verify the check for me. I sent the email (I have this email with the scan on a backup HD, I had to figure out where outlook stored messages but I should have them on CDR today) and got a reply and phone call back saying the check was great and they wanted to cash it for me.
---I figured that if a check cashing place verified it then it had to be good because all a bank does is check and see if the account exists. Check places call and verify the account, names, amounts, everything. ---
Well I cashed the Cashiers Check with them and sent the three laptops off (They were out of state which was another reason it had thrown up caution flags). Then 29-30 days later I get a call from Phoenix. I am told by the company that they said the check bounced (It took this long?) and that they need information from me. So I told them everything, offered all the info I had, everything.
-------------WHILE THIS WAS GOING ON I SOLD ANOTHER LAPTOP--------------
Now in the mean time I had another laptop for sale and had gotten another request for me to take a Cashiers Check (I still have this one along with another one from Nigeria and the original one from Nigeria?s envelope, the one I have now from Nigeria is unopened) so I went through the same steps. ---This was 1 day before I got the phone call.--- Well this time they told me they could not cash the check until a manager was in the next day. I said that?s fine.
Now when I got the above call the next day I found the number for the bank on the check, called and found out myself that this Cashiers Check was a fraud. I wrote everything down.
Now back on the call, after we spoke he told me they were going to go after the issuer of the check. I told them I would do everything I could to help. Within 1 hour I got a call back saying that the other check I tried to pass was bad and that they were charging me with the check. I again told them what happened and it was the same guy. He told me to pay back the other check in full or they would press charges. I told him I could not do that. I asked him why the view had changed and he mentioned the other check and that I knew it was bad. I said no, I brought it in to be verified. He started yelling at me and that was it.
Now about 2 weeks later the police show up at my house while I am at work. My roommate tells them that I am at work and calls me to let me know they are looking for me. I of course freak out call the cops and we speak about the check issue.
They asked me about both checks and I told them everything. The officer says he is making a phone report and that should be fine. He told me not to accept any further checks I told him I had already stopped entirely. He said if he had anything further he would talk to me on it.
Now I heard nothing for another week then while going into work with my wife a cop was waiting for me at work! They got behind me when I parked, arrested me, called in other units and searched my car!!! They then took out a bag of change and asked if it was mine or my wife?s (At the time I was a server as was my wife we worked at the same place, Texas Roadhouse). Our work told everyone we were arrested for dealing drugs and that they saw the drugs (aka the bag of change). So we were fired for no call no show! But they told my wife it was because they did not believe us on what happened!
Anyway after they arrested us they took both of us to a sub station and had my wife in tears asking her how I made the checks, what was going on, where I got them from. Then they came in and played this "You want to do the right thing, and tell me everything" Story on me. I told the Female detective everything. I offered the other checks, emails, everything. She asked me why I had gotten so many I told her of the check scams (Nigeria, etc) and that this was apparently one of them. She acted like she had never heard of them. She asked me why I did not report it. I said I reported laptop theft to the FBI before. (This was a fun story, I had an iBook G3 500mhz and had purchased a Powerbook Ti online. I was scammed through paypal (this was before eBay owned them) and was left high and dry. I called the FBI and reported it and they showed up at my house. I was like wow I guess they can help. No they said my wife sounded like a woman who had been kidnapped with her daughter and they started asking me question and such. So instead of being helped I was integrated by the FBI of something else. (They apologized later saying it was a huge mistake and our cell phone number was sim. to the one they were tracking and my wife had sounded like the woman they were looking for). So basically I found out what most everyone else has with online trading. (Esp. when it?s with eBay as this Powerbook deal was)) You?re screwed. On the forums yes the user can be banned and others know about it but rarely does anything come of it. So I told her I had given up on reporting things, this was not the first time I had been trolled and I knew as do many others online it?s pretty much hopeless.
She leaves the room and thinks I can not hear her. I hear her telling her boss she thinks I am full of it (Up till then she had acted like she was my friend, you get the idea). So I got pissed, she came back in and I told her I heard what she had said, why was she wasting my time. I told her everything I offered proof and yet she was stringing me along and wasting my time. She said she wanted to go to the house I asked her what would happen, she said we would just look around and if she found anything that showed I was making the checks she would stop there and get a warrant. I said that?s fine let?s do it. She came back in and said they had decided not to go and just took my wife and I to JAIL! They released us later and set a court date.
So I was appointed a lawyer and they had a Grand Jury decided if they should take it to trial (They just decided if there is enough to take it to trial) The first time they claimed the other check I had cashed showed I was doing this constantly and intentionally. Yet the other check was never reported to the police, anyone. The lawyer had the case thrown out of court, but they came back and did it again only this time they did not enter the same information. The grand jury asked "Do they not check these checks when you go in?" The prosecutor said he did not have that information. And that was it! So again I was told I have to go to trial again!
So I met my lawyer again I had already given here all the emails I had from Michael, I had also given her copied of all the checks, envelopes, everything. She told me that they had offered a plea of a class 4 felony!! I was like hell no! She said she agreed with me but that the case was losable. I asked why and she said because you did not report it to the police and they have the check you cashed. I told her everything and pointed out everything I gave her. She just told me the case is losable but if I got her the emails showing the check scan I sent to be verified it would be easier plus all the other information I could get her.
Now today she told me she had gotten a new plea, a class 6 that with 1.5yrs probation would be reduced to a misdemeanor (SP?). She said we go into court tomorrow to extend the time on the case.
Basically I am lost, and my brain is fried from trying to write everything down, I am going to recap and see if I missed anything but basically I am really lost here and have no clue what to do. (Also my lawyer is appointed by the state).
(Quick Info/Cliffs)
Basically I got bad checks from scammers in this order:
1) Cashed at a bank, was from Nigeria I still have the empty envelope. Cops called but we were told all we could do was go after the issuer of the check.
2) Cashiers Check that was from Micheal. Sent a Scanned copy to Checkmate they said it was great and cashed it. Then 30 days later told me it was bad.
3) Cashiers Check on another laptop. Check not cashed but taken into same Checkmate to verify. They could not get a hold of the bank at the time (To late I believe) and told me to come back in the morning (this was before the call about the check above #2). After finding out about check #2 I called and verified the check myself, found out it was fake. (I still have this as well)
4) To provide proof I accepted an offer for a Nigeria check as well again just to get one and have it unopened. I got it and still have it as well.
I have been arrested at my work with my wife; we both lost our jobs because of it. We were interrogated, put in jail overnight and released.
I have been to court twice, the first time the case was dismissed, and the second time is now. I was offered a Plea for a class 4 felony which I rejected.
My lawyer keeps telling me she feels this is a losable case for some reason. (I am not sure why still I will talk to her this week or so). We have a new plea that?s a class 6 and will become a misdemeanor if I complete 1.5yrs of probation.
I believe the charges are classes 3 and 4 felonies for theft and misrepresentation.
Flat out I told basically everything above. I am not sure I got everything but there is so much in my head to remember and I am thinking it faster then I can type it. Basically I want to see what you guys think here. I am lost, I have no clue what to think and I do not understand how they can blame me for the check and have any chance of a case with all the information they have now.
I mean, I did not make them; I took them to a place to verify them. I have all the information and yet somehow they can pin it on me.
What do you guys think? I have a lot to read over and correct spelling and anything I left out but I want to know what you guys think.
Thanks everyone.
Seems there is some confusion so let me make it clear:
THIS IS NOT A NIGERIA CHECK I AM IN COURT FOR!!! I did get a check from Nigeria back when Ebay and Paypal were different companies, quite some time ago. That was handled and when reported the police told me tough (And then all the info about the Nigeria Check thing became well know also this was on eBay that the Nigerian scam happened to me and again SOME TIME AGO!)
The other checks in question ARE NOT FROM NIGERIA!!!! (Just to make sure that?s
clear)
Another thing to make clear:
Question from another member
As I pointed out I took a Check from Nigeria quite some time ago and took it to the bank. They cashed it no questions asked then reversed it. It was made 100% clear to me by the bank that they only check to see the account exists. So I almost got nailed on that one but did not really spend any of the money.
NOW at a CHECK CASHING PLACE, the call the bank, they verify everything. So I wanted to be 110% sure this time and not have any problems so I did not even go in I just called and emailed them the check. They told me after checking everything it was good.
I guess I did not make that clear so let me do so,
A) There was Delievery Confirmation
B) I lost the records from the post office when I bought them.
That?s why I went with the Check cashing place.
MILLS CLIFF NOTES!!!
He sells laptop and is paid with a cashier's check.
Check cashing place says check is good and gives him the money. He even scans it and has it verified.
30 days later the check bounced.
Before check bounced he did the same thing with another check.
The first check comes back as fraud.
He finds the second is a fraud (This check was never cashed!!)
He gets arrested.
Loses job.
Cops don't believe him
He has evidence but has a crappy public attorney.
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