Official Phenom 2 Review Thread

[Dravic]

Originally posted by: cmdrdredd

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes

Wow a lot of hate going around for both the processor camp's...ouch

I agree.

When i want the absolute best the core i7 965 is the way to go.

When i go for good but not ultimate i prefer the Ph II.
Why, when i look at the combination of motherboard memory and processor, the Phenom II is a good choice. The MB's are not that expensive. Quality low latency DDR2 memory modules are cheap. You dont need an uber expensive powersupply. When comparing , the phenom II does rather well. When the price drops a little more i am truly interested, but compared the early adopter price is not too bad. When i also take a 4000 range gfx card from ati i can use it in crossfire with the onboard gfx . Or maybe ( i still have to see if this is possible) use the onboard gfx for physics simulation and use the seperate 4000 gfx card only for visual. When looking at everything combined it looks AMD finally starts to learn what Intel has been doing for years : Providing customers with a complete solution.
Good solid support chips to complement a good processor.
Gfx is still better with AMD but AMD really needs to integrate a MAC phy module in the southbridge. I think 14 usb ports is overkill. Especially as it seems the performance of the usb ports is still not that good. I rather have 8 ports and fast then 14 and slow.
But overall i think amd delivers a good complete solution. Good enough for me to start saving pennies.

Motherboard/memory is not badly priced for a C2Q either. It's only fair you compare that as well as a similarly clocked C2Q still beats the PII.

True, but 775 is a dead end socket. Not to mention the Mainstream socket for i7 has yet to be released, and these current enthusiast x58 boards are pricey. The best 790gx/sb750 boards are only $140 or less, the TA790GX is $99.

Even if you could get the price difference down to only $100, thats a lot to add to a GPU upgrade.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Dravic

Originally posted by: cmdrdredd

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes

Wow a lot of hate going around for both the processor camp's...ouch

I agree.

When i want the absolute best the core i7 965 is the way to go.

When i go for good but not ultimate i prefer the Ph II.
Why, when i look at the combination of motherboard memory and processor, the Phenom II is a good choice. The MB's are not that expensive. Quality low latency DDR2 memory modules are cheap. You dont need an uber expensive powersupply. When comparing , the phenom II does rather well. When the price drops a little more i am truly interested, but compared the early adopter price is not too bad. When i also take a 4000 range gfx card from ati i can use it in crossfire with the onboard gfx . Or maybe ( i still have to see if this is possible) use the onboard gfx for physics simulation and use the seperate 4000 gfx card only for visual. When looking at everything combined it looks AMD finally starts to learn what Intel has been doing for years : Providing customers with a complete solution.
Good solid support chips to complement a good processor.
Gfx is still better with AMD but AMD really needs to integrate a MAC phy module in the southbridge. I think 14 usb ports is overkill. Especially as it seems the performance of the usb ports is still not that good. I rather have 8 ports and fast then 14 and slow.
But overall i think amd delivers a good complete solution. Good enough for me to start saving pennies.

Motherboard/memory is not badly priced for a C2Q either. It's only fair you compare that as well as a similarly clocked C2Q still beats the PII.

True, but 775 is a dead end socket. Not to mention the Mainstream socket for i7 has yet to be released, and these current enthusiast x58 boards are pricey. The best 790gx/sb750 boards are only $140 or less, the TA790GX is $99.

Even if you could get the price difference down to only $100, thats a lot to add to a GPU upgrade.

For all intents and purposes, both AM2+ and LGA775 are dead-end sockets.

Sure AMD is expected to release future PhII SKU's which are AM2+ compatible, but it is unlikely that you will find yourself upgrading your 3GHz PhII with a 4 or 5GHz AM2+ CPU.

If you are really into not buying the final round of tech before a transition then you should be hold off and get an AM3 PhII even if you just turn around and drop it into your existing AM2+/DDR2 mobo.

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

 

[William Gaatjes]

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

Holding off to see what the SB800 does is sure worth the waiting. But AM3 offers nothing for me at the moment. Fast low latency DDR3 is very expensive. And since i am not an upgrader of single components being upgradable is not a neccesary option. But i will wait and see, i am buying around may at the latest . I expect then to have some more knowledge about what to buy.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

Holding off to see what the SB800 does is sure worth the waiting. But AM3 offers nothing for me at the moment. Fast low lattency DDR3 is very expensive. And since i am not an upgrader of single components being upgradable is not a neccesary option. But i will wait and see, i am buying around may at the latest . I expect then to have some more knowledge about what to buy.

Yeah I thought the same thing when I read that. What's the point in waiting when you're only going to pay more for DDR3?

 

[Cookie Monster]

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes
Holding off to see what the SB800 does is sure worth the waiting. But AM3 offers nothing for me at the moment. Fast low latency DDR3 is very expensive. And since i am not an upgrader of single components being upgradable is not a neccesary option. But i will wait and see, i am buying around may at the latest . I expect then to have some more knowledge about what to buy.

SB8xx enhancements

Looking quite good actually, I guess nVIDIA will also finishing off the final touches for their nforce 8xxa chipsets.

 

[Dravic]

For all intents and purposes, both AM2+ and LGA775 are dead-end sockets.

Sure AMD is expected to release future PhII SKU's which are AM2+ compatible, but it is unlikely that you will find yourself upgrading your 3GHz PhII with a 4 or 5GHz AM2+ CPU.

If you are really into not buying the final round of tech before a transition then you should be hold off and get an AM3 PhII even if you just turn around and drop it into your existing AM2+/DDR2 mobo.

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

I disagree about AM2+ being th same as LGA775. I hardly call a platform where you can get a Motherboard and 8GB of ram for ~$200 that supports all current and yet to be released production CPU's for the next 12-18 months "dead end".

LGA775 and AM2+ are the sweet spots for budget upgraders but IMHO AM2+ has the better upgadability of the two because it's compatabile with AM3 cpus. Because of memory prices, AM3 is currently in the same boat as the i7 platforms until DDR3 becomes the domimant memory format. Why would/should i pay more for the same performance while taking money away from my GPU upgrade.

Test aready show low latency DDR equal to the ddr3 as far as perforamce goes. Unless AMD's DDR3 support is better then their DDR2 IMC support, but i'm not expecting huge gains.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Originally posted by: cmdrdredd

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes

Wow a lot of hate going around for both the processor camp's...ouch

I agree.

When i want the absolute best the core i7 965 is the way to go.

When i go for good but not ultimate i prefer the Ph II.
Why, when i look at the combination of motherboard memory and processor, the Phenom II is a good choice. The MB's are not that expensive. Quality low latency DDR2 memory modules are cheap. You dont need an uber expensive powersupply. When comparing , the phenom II does rather well. When the price drops a little more i am truly interested, but compared the early adopter price is not too bad. When i also take a 4000 range gfx card from ati i can use it in crossfire with the onboard gfx . Or maybe ( i still have to see if this is possible) use the onboard gfx for physics simulation and use the seperate 4000 gfx card only for visual. When looking at everything combined it looks AMD finally starts to learn what Intel has been doing for years : Providing customers with a complete solution.
Good solid support chips to complement a good processor.
Gfx is still better with AMD but AMD really needs to integrate a MAC phy module in the southbridge. I think 14 usb ports is overkill. Especially as it seems the performance of the usb ports is still not that good. I rather have 8 ports and fast then 14 and slow.
But overall i think amd delivers a good complete solution. Good enough for me to start saving pennies.

Motherboard/memory is not badly priced for a C2Q either. It's only fair you compare that as well as a similarly clocked C2Q still beats the PII.

When i look at the prices of similair clocked C2Q matched with x48 boards and DDR3 i do not really feel it is that comparable. And i just want an IMC. It is an obsession i know :thumbsup: As do i favor the 790 chipset from AMD.

 

[magreen]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: Goty
I think people are also missing the point that i7 is currently still a halo product and won't be Intel's mainstream product until late this year.

That's why I think that it's so impressive that the P2 can beat it overclocked.

I doubt there's much overclocking headroom for the i7 extreme 465 anyway.

Also keep in mind that the Phenom 2 is running DDR2 ram vs. DDR3 on the i7 and many of the C2Qs.

#1. It's the i7 extreme 965, dammit. You have said 465 one too many times in this thread for me to overlook it.

#2. Where are you getting it that the 965 can't overclock? It's a beast at overclocking, so if you're going to look at overclocking the PhII then look at overclocking the 965 also. If you're not going to compare it like that, then whoop-dee-doo, you can take a cheaper processor and overclock it to match the speed of an expensive processor at stock speeds. That's what we've been doing for years around here, and you can do it with a C2Q also.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

it lost if you want to compare it with a i7.

Its a GREAT competitor if you want to class it with yorkfield.

Read my previous post. I was telling people to STOP grouping it with i7, and put it with yorkfield for a more even playing ground.

If you want to talk about raw performance against an i7, how can you say AMD didnt lose?

Please read my previous post again - I've bolded the area where I acknowledged that you have stated that PhII should not be compared with i7. Yet you have compared PhII with i7, and came to the logical conclusion that AMD lost. I understand and agree with your point regarding the comparison, but by my thinking you shouldn't even acknowledge that PhII and i7 are fit to be compared, that's all.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: Dravic

For all intents and purposes, both AM2+ and LGA775 are dead-end sockets.

Sure AMD is expected to release future PhII SKU's which are AM2+ compatible, but it is unlikely that you will find yourself upgrading your 3GHz PhII with a 4 or 5GHz AM2+ CPU.

If you are really into not buying the final round of tech before a transition then you should be hold off and get an AM3 PhII even if you just turn around and drop it into your existing AM2+/DDR2 mobo.

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

I disagree about AM2+ being th same as LGA775. I hardly call a platform where you can get a Motherboard and 8GB of ram for ~$200 that supports all current and yet to be released production CPU's for the next 12-18 months "dead end".

LGA775 and AM2+ are the sweet spots for budget upgraders but IMHO AM2+ has the better upgadability of the two because it's compatabile with AM3 cpus. Because of memory prices, AM3 is currently in the same boat as the i7 platforms until DDR3 becomes the domimant memory format. Why would/should i pay more for the same performance while taking money away from my GPU upgrade.

Test aready show low latency DDR equal to the ddr3 as far as perforamce goes. Unless AMD's DDR3 support is better then their DDR2 IMC support, but i'm not expecting huge gains.

But the performance ceiling for future Phenoms that are AM2+ compatible is most likely going to be only the same or slightly higher than the performance ceiling for 775 C2Q. Future Phenoms (or whatever they'll be called in 2010) that support DDR3 only will not work in AM2+ sockets.

 

[harpoon84]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: Dravic

For all intents and purposes, both AM2+ and LGA775 are dead-end sockets.

Sure AMD is expected to release future PhII SKU's which are AM2+ compatible, but it is unlikely that you will find yourself upgrading your 3GHz PhII with a 4 or 5GHz AM2+ CPU.

If you are really into not buying the final round of tech before a transition then you should be hold off and get an AM3 PhII even if you just turn around and drop it into your existing AM2+/DDR2 mobo.

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

I disagree about AM2+ being th same as LGA775. I hardly call a platform where you can get a Motherboard and 8GB of ram for ~$200 that supports all current and yet to be released production CPU's for the next 12-18 months "dead end".

LGA775 and AM2+ are the sweet spots for budget upgraders but IMHO AM2+ has the better upgadability of the two because it's compatabile with AM3 cpus. Because of memory prices, AM3 is currently in the same boat as the i7 platforms until DDR3 becomes the domimant memory format. Why would/should i pay more for the same performance while taking money away from my GPU upgrade.

Test aready show low latency DDR equal to the ddr3 as far as perforamce goes. Unless AMD's DDR3 support is better then their DDR2 IMC support, but i'm not expecting huge gains.

But the performance ceiling for future Phenoms that are AM2+ compatible is most likely going to be only the same or slightly higher than the performance ceiling for 775 C2Q. Future Phenoms (or whatever they'll be called in 2010) that support DDR3 only will not work in AM2+ sockets.

Thats a good point. Right now the 'upgrade ceiling' for S775 quads is the QX9770 @ 3.2GHz, and I don't expect Intel to release faster quads for this platform. A Yorkie @ 3.2GHz is roughly equivalent to a 3.6GHz PII.

Now from what I've seen AMD will be stuck in the low 3GHz range for a while with PII. They *may* eventually get over the 3.6GHz mark to finally surpass the fastest C2Qs, but I doubt we'll see stock 4GHz chips anytime soon.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Dravic

For all intents and purposes, both AM2+ and LGA775 are dead-end sockets.

Sure AMD is expected to release future PhII SKU's which are AM2+ compatible, but it is unlikely that you will find yourself upgrading your 3GHz PhII with a 4 or 5GHz AM2+ CPU.

If you are really into not buying the final round of tech before a transition then you should be hold off and get an AM3 PhII even if you just turn around and drop it into your existing AM2+/DDR2 mobo.

For new mobo buyers it would seem like the smart money is holding off for AM3 mobo, DDR3 ram, and AM3 PhII so your parts of your investment stand a chance of surviving a couple upgrade cycles. (at which point you should do price/performance analysis of AM3 AMD system vs. P45/X48 C2Q system vs. i7 system)

I disagree about AM2+ being th same as LGA775. I hardly call a platform where you can get a Motherboard and 8GB of ram for ~$200 that supports all current and yet to be released production CPU's for the next 12-18 months "dead end".

LGA775 and AM2+ are the sweet spots for budget upgraders but IMHO AM2+ has the better upgadability of the two because it's compatabile with AM3 cpus. Because of memory prices, AM3 is currently in the same boat as the i7 platforms until DDR3 becomes the domimant memory format. Why would/should i pay more for the same performance while taking money away from my GPU upgrade.

Test aready show low latency DDR equal to the ddr3 as far as perforamce goes. Unless AMD's DDR3 support is better then their DDR2 IMC support, but i'm not expecting huge gains.

I consider AM2+ EOL as is LGA775 because the last line of processors to go into that socket is the current line of processors. Penryn for LGA775 and Phenom II for AM2+.

EOL/dead-end does not mean unavailable for continued purchase. You'll be able to purchase LGA775 boards and load them with 8GB of DDR2 for <$200 for another two years minimum, same as AM2+.

IMO they are both effectively EOL sockets. If AM2+ wasn't EOL then AMD would not be transitioning to AM3.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

it lost if you want to compare it with a i7.

Its a GREAT competitor if you want to class it with yorkfield.

Read my previous post. I was telling people to STOP grouping it with i7, and put it with yorkfield for a more even playing ground.

If you want to talk about raw performance against an i7, how can you say AMD didnt lose?

Please read my previous post again - I've bolded the area where I acknowledged that you have stated that PhII should not be compared with i7. Yet you have compared PhII with i7, and came to the logical conclusion that AMD lost. I understand and agree with your point regarding the comparison, but by my thinking you shouldn't even acknowledge that PhII and i7 are fit to be compared, that's all.

ahhh my appologies!!

 

[William Gaatjes]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster

Originally posted by: William Gaatjes
Holding off to see what the SB800 does is sure worth the waiting. But AM3 offers nothing for me at the moment. Fast low latency DDR3 is very expensive. And since i am not an upgrader of single components being upgradable is not a neccesary option. But i will wait and see, i am buying around may at the latest . I expect then to have some more knowledge about what to buy.

SB8xx enhancements

Looking quite good actually, I guess nVIDIA will also finishing off the final touches for their nforce 8xxa chipsets.

It is mentioned in the picture that there are 2 8051 microcontroller cores available where 1 is assigned for DASH compliancy.

What is the purpose of DASH and being DASH compliant ?
I found some pdf but that looked like it was written by a politician. No clear words what it is used for just abstractions. I would really like to know what DASH means in a proper technical explanation.

Edit by me :


I found an easy explanation in a pdf.

And i hope it can be turned off.
It gives me the same feeling as internet explorer & activex did back in the days.
Good for companies behind a dedicated professional firewall but not good for consumer pc's connected to the internet.

www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/DownloadableAssets/ ADVCORC72736_DashCollateral.pdf


It seems the link does not always work.

When i copy the link and insert in the google searchbox the download always seem to work.
That is the download always works when pressing the link in the google search results.

To sum it up :

Remote power on and off.
Remote updates and patches.
Remote diagnostics.
Hardware and software inventory while the pc is off.
Security ? Probably TPM based.

 

[Dravic]

But the performance ceiling for future Phenoms that are AM2+ compatible is most likely going to be only the same or slightly higher than the performance ceiling for 775 C2Q. Future Phenoms (or whatever they'll be called in 2010) that support DDR3 only will not work in AM2+ sockets.

But that's not correct as far as everything I have read. The IMC on AM3 cpus works wih both DDR2 and DDR3. AM3 cpus will be pin cmpatabile and be a drop in upgrade to AM2+ Motherbards. The only reason to go to AM3 will be if there is a significant performance increase with DDR3, or until DDR3 becomes the dominant format and is cheaper then DDR2.

There are no DDR3 only PHII, as the IMC suports both.

From Anand

Next month, AMD will launch the first Socket-AM3 Phenom II processors. The main difference here is that these parts will support DDR3 memory. Oh no, another socket, right? Wrong.

Socket-AM3 Phenom II parts will also work in Socket-AM2+ motherboards, the two are pin-compatible. When in an AM2+ board, these upcoming Phenom II processors will work in DDR2 mode, but when in an AM3 board they will work in DDR3 mode. How cool is that?

With that, I expect the performance ceiling for PHII on AM2+ to possibly be significantly higher then C2D by its EOL.

 

[Dravic]

I consider AM2+ EOL as is LGA775 because the last line of processors to go into that socket is the current line of processors. Penryn for LGA775 and Phenom II for AM2+.

EOL/dead-end does not mean unavailable for continued purchase. You'll be able to purchase LGA775 boards and load them with 8GB of DDR2 for <$200 for another two years minimum, same as AM2+.

IMO they are both effectively EOL sockets. If AM2+ wasn't EOL then AMD would not be transitioning to AM3.

Incorrect AM2+ will support AM3 cpu's as drop in replacements. There are NO DDR3 only cpus planned. They are pin compatible. AMD is going to DDR3 because the RAM manufacturers want one DDR spec to produce. Haven't we all be talking about how the AMD processors don't appear to be bottlenecked by memory bandwidth?

Am I the only one following along here? I though that was one of the major selling points of going with the current AMD AM2+ platform. You get an AM3 cpu upgade path.

 

[BubbaBooBoo]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

I know what youre saying but I agree with this guy

AMD 920 940 naming scam

the name was speceficaly chosen by AMD to confuse people into thinknig that it was a competiter to i7 and thats a scam. They coulda called it anything else. Werent there enough numbers availeble?

 

[Zstream]

Originally posted by: BubbaBooBoo

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

I know what youre saying but I agree with this guy

AMD 920 940 naming scam

the name was speceficaly chosen by AMD to confuse people into thinknig that it was a competiter to i7 and thats a scam. They coulda called it anything else. Werent there enough numbers availeble?

lol a scam! Not to go by history but remember when Intel would say they have the fastest chip because it had so many mhz behind it?

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: Dravic

I consider AM2+ EOL as is LGA775 because the last line of processors to go into that socket is the current line of processors. Penryn for LGA775 and Phenom II for AM2+.

EOL/dead-end does not mean unavailable for continued purchase. You'll be able to purchase LGA775 boards and load them with 8GB of DDR2 for <$200 for another two years minimum, same as AM2+.

IMO they are both effectively EOL sockets. If AM2+ wasn't EOL then AMD would not be transitioning to AM3.

Incorrect AM2+ will support AM3 cpu's as drop in replacements. There are NO DDR3 only cpus planned. They are pin compatible. AMD is going to DDR3 because the RAM manufacturers want one DDR spec to produce. Haven't we all be talking about how the AMD processors don't appear to be bottlenecked by memory bandwidth?

Am I the only one following along here? I though that was one of the major selling points of going with the current AMD AM2+ platform. You get an AM3 cpu upgade path.

AM3/DDR3 only CPU's are planned, according to my contact at AMD. Also, AM3 PhII's will not operate optimally in AM2+.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Originally posted by: BubbaBooBoo

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

I know what youre saying but I agree with this guy

AMD 920 940 naming scam

the name was speceficaly chosen by AMD to confuse people into thinknig that it was a competiter to i7 and thats a scam. They coulda called it anything else. Werent there enough numbers availeble?

Yeah, I agree it's a bad naming convention, although the blogger who posted the article is a self-confessed AMD-basher.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: Dravic

I consider AM2+ EOL as is LGA775 because the last line of processors to go into that socket is the current line of processors. Penryn for LGA775 and Phenom II for AM2+.

EOL/dead-end does not mean unavailable for continued purchase. You'll be able to purchase LGA775 boards and load them with 8GB of DDR2 for <$200 for another two years minimum, same as AM2+.

IMO they are both effectively EOL sockets. If AM2+ wasn't EOL then AMD would not be transitioning to AM3.

Incorrect AM2+ will support AM3 cpu's as drop in replacements. There are NO DDR3 only cpus planned. They are pin compatible. AMD is going to DDR3 because the RAM manufacturers want one DDR spec to produce. Haven't we all be talking about how the AMD processors don't appear to be bottlenecked by memory bandwidth?

Am I the only one following along here? I though that was one of the major selling points of going with the current AMD AM2+ platform. You get an AM3 cpu upgade path.

AM3/DDR3 only CPU's are planned, according to my contact at AMD. Also, AM3 PhII's will not operate optimally in AM2+.

I thought AMD was going to have two AM3 chips, maybe one with a 0 and one with a 5 at the end of the name or something like that. One that can run in AM3 only and one that can use DDR2 and run in AM2+ boards. My guess is at first both chips will be produced and slowly production will shift to AM3 only boards as higher frequencies and shrinks are introduced. But that still doesn't change the fact that AM2+ has at least some life left.

But, I wonder what 'not operate optimally' will mean? Maybe there will be more power saving features that you won't get, kind of like AM2+ vs. AM2. Maybe a slower HT frequency, again like AM2+ vs. AM2. I'm willing to bet you'll still get most of the performance, but not all. Again, at least there is some life ahead if you have an AM2+ board.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
I thought AMD was going to have two AM3 chips, maybe one with a 0 and one with a 5 at the end of the name or something like that. One that can run in AM3 only and one that can use DDR2 and run in AM2+ boards. My guess is at first both chips will be produced and slowly production will shift to AM3 only boards as higher frequencies and shrinks are introduced. But that still doesn't change the fact that AM2+ has at least some life left.

But, I wonder what 'not operate optimally' will mean? Maybe there will be more power saving features that you won't get, kind of like AM2+ vs. AM2. Maybe a slower HT frequency, again like AM2+ vs. AM2. I'm willing to bet you'll still get most of the performance, but not all. Again, at least there is some life ahead if you have an AM2+ board.

It is possible that the "5" will be reserved for just those SKU's where both AM2+ (only) and AM2+ compatible (AM3 capable) CPU's overlap in the core clockspeed. I.e. 940 vs. 945, 920 vs 925.

But when it comes to releasing future faster SKU's, like 3.4GHz X4 960, that could restrict those higher clocked releases to AM3 only and thus not need to keep the "5" designation at the end.

Also I beleive what has been discussed to date regarding the AM3 CPU's is that the lower TDP comes from the IMC operating at lower voltage with the lowered voltage DDR3...making an AM3 3.6GHz CPU possible from TDP considerations (for example) but you could not drop this AM3 into a AM2+ board and operate it at 3.6GHz with DDR2 as it would then exceed 140W TDP.

Likewise in the same circles of discussion, the L3$/NB of the AM3 parts clock slightly higher to accomodate the faster DDR3. Time will determine what the reality is.

 

[hooflung]

I found the review at HardOCP really, really jaded.

It is as if Kyle Bennett went down a checklist named, "How can I possibly show the PII in the worst of light," before his review.

1) Use a motherboard that I ( Kyle Bennett ) personally reviewed and would not recommend to ANYONE.

2) Use SLI instead of Crossfire so I would not show how the chip works with ACC and the SB750.

3) Use Tripple SLI and gimp the Phenom II with 2 gigs of ram, which thanks to the shoddy motherboard, cannot run at 1066.

4) Use the flagship Intel Core 2 chip which cost a 1000 dollars instead of a Core 2 in the price range and mhz range of the Phenom II.

5) Use Far Cry 2, and go so far as to personally validate this pile of crap game noone but me likes, to give the "shot heard across the AMD world" conclusion that this ship is despictable.

6) Minimize the AM2+ motherboard install base to come to further conclusion that the "add in value" of having a socket that will live as long as DDR2 is cheap is grossly exagerated.




Seriously that was the worse review I've seen from Kyle. And he's done some doozies before. I plan on buying a Quad Core 2 for my P35 and I plan on getting a Phenom II for my 790GX. I don't care that the i7 exists as long as the motherboards are so BIOS sensative, priced high and 1600mhz DDR3 at stock volt spec is outrageously expensive.

Also, the fact that the Phenom II is hitting 6.8ghz on Liquid Helium and delivering crushing benches to me puts the ' is for enthusiests and we say the PII is not for that breed' into the Mencia folder.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

Originally posted by: BubbaBooBoo

Originally posted by: Flipped Gazelle

If PhII is not meant to compare with i7 - as you have stated numerous times - then why are you saying that "AMD lost this one..."? PhII is successful competing with C2Q, as AMD intended.

I know what youre saying but I agree with this guy

AMD 920 940 naming scam

the name was speceficaly chosen by AMD to confuse people into thinknig that it was a competiter to i7 and thats a scam. They coulda called it anything else. Werent there enough numbers availeble?

Yeah, I agree it's a bad naming convention, although the blogger who posted the article is a self-confessed AMD-basher.

It seems unnecessary to label AMD's marketing strategy as a scam. Is it misleading? Yes. Does it appear to be intentionally misleading? Yes. Is it a scam? Depends on whether the buyer gets what they pay for. Price/performance is important, so too is not having buyer's remorse.

And if buying an AMD box containing a "940" processor costs $500 less than buying an Intel box with a "940 processor in it gives you that feeling of having snagged the deal of the decade then you have been enriched (psychologically) by AMD's marketing strategy and are also likely to not be the kind of user that will challenge the processing capability of either an X4 940 or i7 940 CPU anyways.

Apple is not a scam, their buyers get what they pay for, a product and a sense of well-being (for reasons I can't explain) that can't come from buying a Zune or other. Good for Apple to recognize that demographic and provide a product that adds value to the lives of their customers. Same with AMD.

Same with Intel and their extreme processors. No one is scammed into buying an i7 965...but for those who find their lives enriched by owning one you are probably thankful Intel went to the trouble of addressing your market demographic.

 

[BubbaBooBoo]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

It seems unnecessary to label AMD's marketing strategy as a scam. Is it misleading? Yes. Does it appear to be intentionally misleading? Yes. Is it a scam? Depends on whether the buyer gets what they pay for. Price/performance is important, so too is not having buyer's remorse.

And if buying an AMD box containing a "940" processor costs $500 less than buying an Intel box with a "940 processor in it gives you that feeling of having snagged the deal of the decade then you have been enriched (psychologically) by AMD's marketing strategy and are also likely to not be the kind of user that will challenge the processing capability of either an X4 940 or i7 940 CPU anyways.

Apple is not a scam, their buyers get what they pay for, a product and a sense of well-being (for reasons I can't explain) that can't come from buying a Zune or other. Good for Apple to recognize that demographic and provide a product that adds value to the lives of their customers. Same with AMD.

Same with Intel and their extreme processors. No one is scammed into buying an i7 965...but for those who find their lives enriched by owning one you are probably thankful Intel went to the trouble of addressing your market demographic.

I agree but weather you are "the kind of user that will challenge the processing capability of either an X4 940 or i7 940 CPU" or not there realy was no reason to name these cpus 920 and 940. Its like going into a Ford delership and checking out a 350 V8 and then going to a Cheyv one and looking at a 350 V8, but the chevy is really a 170 V6. Sure its called a 350 V8 but how many people are gonna actualy rip the motor apart and check the displecement? The affect is that you were expecting one thing and got anothir.