***Official*** NHL Lockout news thread ***Confirmed***

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Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
19,446
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You know, the more I hear players who I've loved watching play for years bitch and moan about how it's all the leagues fault, and they are just the victims has totally changed my view of them.

Are they living in the real world?

Fvck em all. :|

Federov, Sundin, Brodeur, Shanahan....why don't you fvcking guys fly over to Europe before your money runs out and you can't afford a ticket :roll: .....and fvcking stay there. :|

 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
McKenzie: I've got a news flash for both sides

TSN.ca Staff
12/14/2004

We've heard from the NHL and the NHLPA, so now let's get a broader perspective.

What we are going to see in the next little while is an increase in the rhetoric, which will get cranked up to an unbelieveable level. The people who believe in the Players' Association will be shaking their fists and saying, "No Cap!" And the people who believe in the National Hockey League will be saying, "Cost Certainty!"

All I know is this - you can make a case for both sides being entirely reasonable.

The National Basketball Association and the National Football League have cost certainty. So it is not unreasonable for the National Hockey League to insist on a system with cost certainty. You can wonder if it's reasonable to do that in the face of losing an entire season, but that's a whole other question.

You can also turn around and say that much of what the players offered provided the league with an opportunity to negotiate a system that doesn't neccesarily have cost certainty, but has enough systemic pressure within it - along with the 24 percent rollback - to allow the general managers to do their job in a sensible fashion while still allowing some teams to make some money.

Well, I've got a news flash for both sides.

You've got a 2.1 billion dollar pie right now. As long as these two sides continue on their current course, that pie is going to shrink. A year from now, that pie that started out looking like a nice big pot pie is going to turn into a little mince meat tart.

At the end of the day there is going to be cost certainty in this game because the $2.1 billion pie might be cut in half within a year. And that means everybody gets paid less.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
Cherry expects players to blink first

Canadian Press
12/16/2004

TORONTO (CP) - Hockey broadcaster Don Cherry says it's likely the locked-out players will relent in the NHL's labour impasse over the league's steadfast demand for a salary cap.

Cherry made the first of two appearances on TSN's Off The Record on Thursday. When host Michael Landsberg asked Cherry, ''Who takes a step back?'', Cherry replied that it should be the players.

''It's not the right thing, it will be the only thing,'' said Cherry, who suggested the owners have the financial resources to wait for the union to crack.

''I don't know who should (give in) but the players will have to come again because the owners are billionaires . . . and the one thing that they want is control of the game.

''It's not over hockey. This stuff, I have to laugh, 'for the love of hockey.' It's over money.''

Cherry, the controversial host of the popular Coach's Corner segment on CBC's Hockey Night in Canada, has been laid off from his TV job because of the lockout. On Thursday, he also advised the players to lay off of their harsh criticism of NHL commissioner Gary Bettman.

''No other place do they call the commissioner of any league a `mad man, greedy, liar, cheat','' Cherry said. ''You don't think that ticks off Bettman?

''You don't think that ticks off some of those owners? Some of those owners are pretty vindictive guys. It's a fight but you should be smarter than that. I'll tell you, some of those owners out there are really ticked off at what the players are saying about it. Play it smarter than that.''

Cherry has always been a staunch defender of the players. But he was critical of now-retired Patrick Roy, the NHL's all-time winningest goaltender, who said he wasn't surprised the owners turned down the NHLPA's latest offer this week and that a number of league teams need a salary cap to survive.

''He didn't say that in '94 (during the last NHL lockout), why didn't he say that in '94?,'' Cherry said. ''That's the thing I hate, when guys get out and say, `This is what it should be.'

''The players should stick together.''<

Cherry also believes NHL players shouldn't be playing overseas during the lockout.

''They don't need to go over there,'' he said. ''I know a guy for sure, I won't mention his name, who had been over there (in Europe) for five years with his family and you know what (the European team) told him this year?

'''If the lockout is there for next fall, don't bother coming because we're going to get NHL guys.' Players are players, hockey players are hockey players, they shouldn't be over there.''

Cherry also doubts the NHL will ever receive a major American television contract because there are still too many Americans who don't understand the sport.

Cherry's second appearance on the show is scheduled for Friday night.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
Union blasts NHL for rejecting proposal

Canadian Press
12/16/2004

The NHL Players' Association found something else to be angry about Thursday.

Two days after both sides in the NHL labour dispute walked away the negotiating table, the NHLPA held a conference call to chide the NHL for misinterpreting its rejected proposal - and to hammer the league again for its calculations.

The crux of the argument was prompted by commissioner Gary Bettman's comments Tuesday that the union's offer - highlighted by a 24 per cent salary rollback - would still lead to financial losses as early as the 2005-06 season.

''They came forward and based their reaction to our significant proposal by saying they would be right back where they were. Well, that's a bunch of hogwash,'' NHLPA executive director Bob Goodenow said on a conference call.

''What they did is they mixed up and diced up some statistics in a blender and came out with what I think are just absolutely ridiculous forecasts,'' added Goodenow, who also tore a strip off the league Tuesday for its numbers.

Essentially, the NHLPA disputes the league's projections that salaries will rise 12.1 per cent a year while revenues will only increase by three per cent.

The 12.1 figure is accurate over the last 10 years. Over the same period, revenues rose an average of 9.4 per cent a year.

''All we're saying is that you have to compare apples with apples,'' said NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin.

The league stands by its projected three per cent annual revenue growth, pointing to the fact that no new buildings are coming on line, ticket prices are already at maximum levels in some markets, U.S. national TV revenues are down, and also pointing to the damage coming out of an extended labour dispute.

The NHL wouldn't bite any further Thursday.

''We do not believe the union's public negotiation with the media warrants any further comment,'' Bill Daly, the NHL's executive vice-president and chief legal officer, said in a statement.

In the big picture, it's just another example of the mistrust that exists between both sides when it comes to the bottom line and why it's going to be so difficult for the league to implement a system that ties player costs to revenues - a salary cap.

''This is a very important example of how some people may define a partnership, and how depending on how people behave, it won't work,'' Goodenow said. ''How the reliance on people's numbers is difficult, it really highlights how people can play with numbers. It makes it hard.''

Using a three-year projection based on league numbers, the NHLPA says its offer would produce a $275.5 million profit for teams as opposed to a $568.5 million operating loss, as stated by the NHL.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
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Jacobs, Snider back league and Bettman

TSN.ca Staff with files

12/17/2004

It didn't take too long for some of the NHL's owners to respond to the renewed stalemate between the league and the NHL Players' Association.

Just a day after the union blasted the NHL and the numbers behind their latest proposal, two of the league's higher profile executives have offered their opinions in the war of words.

Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs told the Boston Globe on Thursday that he agreed with NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman that there is a desperate need to retool the system. Jacobs then added that if it costs the 2004-05 season, then that's the price the owners and the league are willing to pay.

"If I were leaning, I'm leaning more (toward) wait for next year," Jacobs told the Globe.

"We're talking to a group of guys (among the union's negotiating committee) who, if we wait until next year, they probably won't be the guys who eventually will be playing. This is a wasting asset in their case. In our case, we're trying to preserve an asset. They're blaming us for getting where we are and we're assuming full responsibility for that. But they're not agreeing with our cure for it."

"When you're in an industry that values success based on how you finish in the standings or have a Stanley Cup, it's not for economic success, and yet we have to control the economics of this business," he added.

"That's the way we're doing it. If we continue to just leave it on the basis that the guy who wins the most amount of games is successful, irrespective of how they financially win or lose, then that's going to a different discipline and a different set of circumstances. We're going to have to blend the two. We want to take control over this business and the only way we can do it is by satisfying this particular issue (of tying salaries to revenues)."

Philadelphia Flyers chairman and Hockey Hall of Fame member Ed Snider also spoke out on the failed negotiations.

"(The owners) are totally in sync with the league," Snider told the Philadelphia Daily News. "I have been in this league since 1966, 38 years I've been involved in the league, and I've never seen the owners so solidly together as they are today. They are as solid as a rock.

"You can say that the owners are stupid, and (NHL Executive Director Bob Goodenow) can say all the crap he wants, but the bottom line is we have a system that doesn't work."

The remarks came just hours after the NHLPA held a conference call to chide the NHL for misinterpreting its rejected proposal - and to hammer the league again for its calculations.

The crux of the argument was prompted by commissioner Gary Bettman's comments Tuesday that the union's offer - highlighted by a 24 per cent salary rollback - would still lead to financial losses as early as the 2005-06 season.

Files from the Boston Globe and Philadelphia Daily News were used in this report.

Cheers,
Insane3D

:p
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
19,446
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Cold, hard facts to face

By Kevin Paul Dupont, Globe Staff | December 15, 2004

Dead end? You bet. The game is going nowhere? Oh baby, you got it, and in a hurry.

Cast a look around the rink this morning, and all we see is despair, despair, double-runnered despair.

Hey, far be it from one in the daily doom-and-gloom business to cast a ray of sunshine across what happened yesterday in Toronto. As expected, the National Hockey League owners returned volley, following up last Thursday's offer by the NHL Players Association, and reaffirmed in bold letters that there won't be a new collective bargaining agreement until -- OK, you know the rest, fellow puck lovers -- there are a couple of fat paragraphs in said document that guarantee profits for owners and fixed wages for the rank-and-file stick carriers.

And, predictably, the players kept up their siren call. To wit: You know what you can do with your cap, Mr. Bettman!

Other than that, you know, not a bad winter here in the Hub of Hockey. No hockey on the horizon, but no snow in the driveway either (coincidence, or further substantiation that we have entered the global microwave era?).

Look, this stinks. For everybody. From the fourth-line bucket carrier on the Fleet's Bull Gang to the Darlin' of Davos, Joe Thornton. The game many of us love -- including the general sports columnist population who seem to love it just to hate it -- can't seem to get everyone on the same side of the ratified document.

Cap or no cap. Revenue linkage or no revenue linkage. Luxury tax or no luxury tax. That's the terminology for fans to ponder in these puckless times.

Sure is a far cry from the days of getting to know the names and faces of the Kraut Line, the Production Line, and the GAG Line. Oh, just to see the Polish Prince take another twirl, ya know?

But here we are, with so little left in the tank after seeing Players Association boss Bob Goodenow and other union heavies cast their empty, forlorn looks upon exiting yesterday's brief tussle over the terms. There is no deal in sight, and while the NHL paid due respect to the PA for its latest offer, it essentially dismissed it out of hand and made clear all 30 rinks will remain dark until the players buy into the fact the NHL is doing business much like the NFL and the NBA.

Cap envy. NHL owners have it bad, and there isn't the slightest reason to believe they'll shake the fixation. Truth is, they can't. Not after bolting their doors for a second time in 10 years. To return to business with anything less than a sure fix now not only would leave them with a compromised financial plan, it would make them mainstays in virtually every David Letterman Top 10 list for all the remaining days of over-the-air broadcast television.

Call me the unbridled optimist I know I am, but it's here, with everything looking and sounding its absolute worst, that I now feel this whole mess is about to turn.

Hurry, feet, get me to CNBC, now! I'm announcing a market correction.

That said, I've got nothing to go on but my gut, my belief that: 1. Goodenow is even smarter than that Harvard degree in jawbreaking leads many to believe, and 2. NHL players are mostly hard-working realists who don't need a AAA TripTik to realize they've already skated far, far too long down a highway to disaster.

Not only is there still a half-life season to save in 2004-05, there is also 2005-06 and beyond to consider. For a guy like Bill Guerin, with 2 1/2 seasons left on three seasons of $9 million apiece, that's worth waking up for. No doubt union brothers Alexei Yashin and Jaromir Jagr would agree, too. Every player eventually ages and must retire, while franchises, at least in theory, remain in perpetuity. Eventually, the business can find ways to recoup lost money, while players never turn back the odometers on days gone bye-bye.

The bet here is now that they've been handed their helmets yet again, the players finally will face up to the realities of North American sports economics in 2004. They've fought the good fight, the one they had to engage in for the sake of looking in the mirror this morning, next week, next year, and beyond. Did anyone really expect hockey players would go down without at least shaking off the gloves?

Better now that they put their full force behind Goodenow in crafting a deal that preserves all current values of existing contracts (forget that 24 percent haircut), and one that guarantees in full every contract going forward -- eliminating the existing two-thirds buyout clause. No small matter that, as any NFL player could attest. For the sake of accepting the cap -- one they still have time to make beefy -- the players should be able to trim back the age of standard unrestricted free agency from 31 to 29, maybe even a touch lower.

Other substantial tweaks would be necessary, especially in arbitration, but once the cap is in place, it's all tweakable.

Time now for the players to surrender? Hardly. It's time, here in their stated hour of despair, to wake up and deal from a position of strength. They are not poor souls, penniless for generations, about to be shut out while on the verge of realizing their greatest payday. This in no way is the carrot being pulled from their reach. Many of the rank-and-file are NHL-made millionaires, with riches they'll never be able to spend, and they still have time to shape an agreement that will allow for more millionaire hockey players to prosper for generations.

Uh, fellas, what's wrong with that? I'll even be so bold to suggest that some of you, especially those from nations that were under communist command not so long ago, should be embarrassed by the comments that have run alongside your names.

The NHL was one great business -- no doubt, weighted to ownership's side -- before most of today's players got here. And you know, it could easily be argued that some of today's players, for a variety of reasons, have made it a far less entertaining and engaging spectator sport than it was 20, 15, even 10 years ago. They can say that they make the game what it is, but many nights that is an indictment rather than a point of honor or pride.

What's done is done, boys. Time to get on with it. For those who'll say you lost, keep a pocket full of pictures at the ready to show 'em some snaps of your various retirement homes and docked yachts. The true loss would be to stay the course, lose this season and next, and ultimately get the owners' work conditions, and vastly reduced salaries, shoved right down your throats. No chance your voice will be heard then.

Cheers,
Insane3D

;)
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
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Season a lost cause?
Jacobs says owners are willing to wait

By Nancy Marrapese-Burrell, Globe Staff | December 17, 2004

Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs has been active in trying to forge a new collective bargaining agreement with the National Hockey League Players Association. Jacobs believes hockey is sick and he agrees with commissioner Gary Bettman that there is a desperate need to retool the system.

If it costs the 2004-05 season, which Jacobs thinks it will, then that's the price the owners are willing to pay.

"If I were leaning, I'm leaning more [toward] wait for next year," said Jacobs, when asked about a resolution. "We're talking to a group of guys [among the union's negotiating committee] who, if we wait until next year, they probably won't be the guys who eventually will be playing. This is a wasting asset in their case. In our case, we're trying to preserve an asset. They're blaming us for getting where we are and we're assuming full responsibility for that. But they're not agreeing with our cure for it."

Jacobs said the uniqueness of pro sports provides challenges other businesses can't match. Companies are in business to make money. In sports, some owners aren't concerned about making a profit so much as they are winning. Jacobs says that flies in the face of good business.

"When you're in an industry that values success based on how you finish in the standings or have a Stanley Cup, it's not for economic success, and yet we have to control the economics of this business," said Jacobs. "That's the way we're doing it. If we continue to just leave it on the basis that the guy who wins the most amount of games is successful, irrespective of how they financially win or lose, then that's going to a different discipline and a different set of circumstances. We're going to have to blend the two. We want to take control over this business and the only way we can do it is by satisfying this particular issue [of tying salaries to revenues]."

The players have maintained that it isn't their problem, that the owners need to be protected from themselves. However, Jacobs said unless those safeguards are put into place, some owners will be tempted to push the envelope in the name of winning.

"The guys who own this sport, they want to win that Cup," he said. "When you're dealing with [the richer owners], the financial disparity is great. We have a very eclectic, a very rich constituency who own these teams. Once they put their personal assets into it, it takes the economic realities out of this and we have to, for the long run, make this sport not depend on the largesse of our owners who are putting a lot of money into it, and then they get sick of it and they sell their teams. That's what we've been up against."

In Boston, the absence of the NHL has affected the community in general and Jacobs's Delaware North corporation in particular, which owns the FleetCenter and the concessions business for several other arenas. He said it's been hard but necessary.

"From our standpoint -- Delaware North -- clearly the FleetCenter gets hurt and the hockey business gets hurt." When the union made its latest pitch to the owners Dec. 9 in Toronto, Bettman said there was only 2.6 percentage points between what the owners wanted to pay in salaries (54 percent of revenues) vs. what the players were asking for (56.6 percent). But the commissioner believes with no controls in place (read: a salary cap), that percentage would escalate very quickly.When asked if the process had gone as he expected, Jacobs was pragmatic. "The obvious consequence was not playing and that this could go on for a very long time," he said. "If we don't play this year, it's going to be sad. But as a business, if we can't do it on the right basis, then we can't do it. We're looking for a long-term fix. What we did [to end] the last work stoppage [in 1994] didn't help us at all. This can't be a Band-Aid, to quote the commissioner. As far as Boston's concerned, we have to have something we can grow the sport with. Right now, I think the sport has suffered."

If there is no season, Jacobs said he understands it will have a significant impact on the fan base.

"[The fans] are the ones who are suffering the most," he said. "Beyond the players and the owners, I think the fans are a broader group and they're suffering more than any of us are and it hurts them. I think we're fixing it now but it's going to be hurtful. It may take a completely different posture going into the future. This will be different. We'll have a different group of fans and we'll maybe have a whole different group of players, I don't know. But when the sport comes back, it will have a future I think."

Cheers,
Insane3D

:shocked:
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
NHL, NHLPA invited to settle over poker

TSN.ca Staff with files
12/21/2004

The NHL lockout could be coming to a poker table near you.

In an effort to find a solution to salvage the season, PokerRoom.com, one of the world's largest online poker gaming sites, delivered registered letters to NHL commissioner Gary Bettman NHL Players' Association executive director Bob Goodenow Tuesday, inviting them to settle the longstanding labour dispute like men - in a game of winner-take-all Texas Hold'em.

The popular online pasttime simply proposes that the first player to capture all his opponent's chips wins the challenge and the season is saved.

"Hockey fans in North America have had enough of the current high-stakes game of brinkmanship that led to and continues to disrupt the 2004-2005 NHL hockey season," said PokerRoom.com casino boss Patrik Selin in a statement.

"If they can't resolve this dispute through traditional negotiations and compromise, then the PokerRoom.com tournament offers them the best, and quickest, way to declare a winner and let the fans enjoy hockey again before it's too late. With no downloads required to play and the tournament hosted on-line, Mr. Bettman and Mr. Goodenow can easily take on the challenge from their respective offices in New York and Toronto."

The NHL and the players' association met last week in Toronto and the league made a counter-proposal to the players submission of last week. Both parties have rejected the other's proposal and no date has been set for future negotiations.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
Poll: Fans remain on owners side

TSN.ca Staff
12/21/2004

Despite the NHL's 24% solution proposed two weeks ago, Canadians remain steadfast that owners are being more reasonable than the players in their bitter labour dispute.

In an Ipsos-Reid poll conducted by TSN on Tuesday, 59% of poll respondents are in the owners corner - almost unchanged from the 60% from the original poll conducted just before the lockout began. Player support has fallen from 20% to 16% over the same period.

The union also hasn't swayed the public when it comes to the blame game. If the season were canceled, 50% of the respondents would find fault in the players, which is virtually unchanged from results in the September poll.

As for awarding hockey's most coveted prize, 31% believe club teams should be allowed to compete in a challenge tournament for the Stanley Cup even though technically, it's NHL property. Of those polled, 62% feel Lord Stanley's mug should only be awarded to an NHL team and should be put away if this season is scrapped.

But if the lockout ends this season, how many games in a shortened schedule would be enough to justify awarding the cup? According to the poll, 36% say at least 40 regular season games, while declining numbers feel 30 or 20 games would be legitimate.

The NHLPs Senior Director Ted Saskin made the following statement in response to the Ipsos-Reid/TSN poll:

"It has not been our practice to comment on polls especially given the bias that emerges from the way in which questions are framed. From what I saw of the questions asked in this poll, the respondents were given no information about our recent proposal and mistakenly told that the Players' Association wanted a free market versus the owners' desire for cost controls. Anyone conversant with our proposals would know players are in no way asking for a free market and have already proposed significant new cost controls on top of an across the board 24 percent salary rollback representing over $500M in reductions to contracts previously committed to by owners. I am confident anyone apprised of all the facts would be more supportive of the players' efforts to find a solution, especially in light of the owners' ongoing refusal to negotiate or accept any compromise solution."

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
NHL Board of Governors to meet Jan. 14

Canadian Press
12/22/2004

The NHL has finally produced what appears to be a drop-dead date - Jan. 14 - for cancelling the season.

Although it won't admit to it.

The league confirmed Wednesday that a board of governors' meeting has been scheduled for that day in New York.

"I don't want to speculate as to what the agenda will look like on Jan. 14 because obviously there's more than three weeks between now and then," Bill Daly, the NHL's executive vice-president and chief legal officer, said Wednesday from New York. "Hopefully a lot happens between now and then.

"But we haven't had the board together in a formal way since Sept. 15 and at a minimum we need to update them on the process."

When the board of governors last convened Sept. 15 in New York, commissioner Gary Bettman came out of the meeting to announce the lockout.

Another major announcement appears more than likely from the January meeting.

Essentially the timing is right to pull the plug on the season. Teams have been booking events in their arenas 45 days in advance and the league is simply running out of time to salvage a season even if the lockout ends.

"Let's say in reality they don't really need 45 days but say 21 or 22 days, on Jan. 14 you're still through for that month before hockey can start again," former Rangers GM Neil Smith said Wednesday from New York. "So I would think the league will definitely announce Jan. 14 that the season is over, although that's probably a forgone conclusion at this point for most of us."

The NHL salvaged a 48-game season during the last lockout 10 years ago after both sides reached an agreement Jan. 11.

Bettman does not actually need an official vote from the board to cancel the season, just as he didn't need it when he triggered the lockout. But he would obviously need its approval _ and establishing a potential drop-dead date on the season also serves to put pressure on the union.

"The scheduling of the board of governors meeting is a league matter and not something the NHLPA will comment on," NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin said in a statement.

Sources indicate the union is not working on another new proposal and will not be the one to pick up the phone to renew talks.

"It's funny (the NHL) calls a meeting like that when they don't even call for negotiations," New Jersey Devils goalie Martin Brodeur said in Poland, after completing the Worldstars' tour of Europe. "If that's what it is, it's unfortunate.

"But one way or another, if they have an agenda, then tell us right away and then we won't have to worry about not playing and guys can go to Europe. We're not going to accept a cap.

"If they don't get off that, we won't be playing."

Added Anaheim Mighty Ducks centre and fellow Worldstar Sergei Fedorov: "It's going to be a disaster for the sport if they announce a cancellation. No other pro sport has ever been cancelled for the reasons they gave us.

"I want to stay positive and in the back of my mind, I want to keep up hope because the sport is bigger than Gary Bettman. I know the PA did everything it can to have a season."

There's still time for the NHL and NHLPA to reach an agreement. But no talks are planned and the two sides haven't met since Dec. 14 in Toronto when the NHL rejected the union's proposal and the NHLPA in turn rejected the league's counter-proposal.

"I would certainly hope that we have some talks between now and Jan. 14 and I would hope we would have some serious negotiations between now and Jan. 14," Daly said. "But I'm not singularly in control of that process so we'll have to see how that plays out."

Bettman and his counterpart, NHLPA executive director Bob Goodenow, have left little wiggle room in their respective positions. Bettman insists he will never accept a payroll tax system, while Goodenow maintains a salary cap is unacceptable to the union.

Should the season be called off, the NHL would become the first of the four major pro leagues in North America to cancel a full season.

The last time the Stanley Cup wasn't awarded was in 1919 when the Spanish flu cancelled the Montreal-Seattle final. The Cup was contested during the Second World War.

The lockout reached 98 days Wednesday, with 470 of the season's 1,230 games gone by the wayside. By Jan. 14, when the board of governors meet, 627 games will have been scrapped.

The NHL has said from the beginning of this dispute that it was willing to forgo an entire season if it could not get a new deal that "fixed the system."

"Our owners are fully prepared, as they've shown to date, to incur whatever business damage that might be necessary to make sure that we have a collective bargaining agreement that's going to work long-term for this league," Daly said.

The league says it has lost $1.8 billion US over the course of the last deal, which spanned 10 seasons, and needs "cost certainty" in any new agreement - a salary cap.

The union responded by making a proposal Dec. 9 that surprised many, a package that included a 24 per cent rollback on all existing player contracts as well as other changes in favour of the owners in salary arbitration, restricted free agency and the entry-level system.

While recognizing the 24 per cent rollback as a major concession, Bettman responded five days later by saying it was a one-time fix and that "we would be back in the same position - best case - within two to three years, continuing to struggle the entire time."

The union angrily disagreed with the "one-time fix" assertion, saying its package would reset the entire market-place and have a ripple effect on a number of levels which would help cure the financial ills of owners.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
NHL Board of Governors to meet Jan. 14

Canadian Press
12/22/2004

The NHL has finally produced what appears to be a drop-dead date - Jan. 14 - for cancelling the season.

Although it won't admit to it.

The league confirmed Wednesday that a board of governors' meeting has been scheduled for that day in New York.

"I don't want to speculate as to what the agenda will look like on Jan. 14 because obviously there's more than three weeks between now and then," Bill Daly, the NHL's executive vice-president and chief legal officer, said Wednesday from New York. "Hopefully a lot happens between now and then.

"But we haven't had the board together in a formal way since Sept. 15 and at a minimum we need to update them on the process."

When the board of governors last convened Sept. 15 in New York, commissioner Gary Bettman came out of the meeting to announce the lockout.

Another major announcement appears more than likely from the January meeting.

Essentially the timing is right to pull the plug on the season. Teams have been booking events in their arenas 45 days in advance and the league is simply running out of time to salvage a season even if the lockout ends.

"Let's say in reality they don't really need 45 days but say 21 or 22 days, on Jan. 14 you're still through for that month before hockey can start again," former Rangers GM Neil Smith said Wednesday from New York. "So I would think the league will definitely announce Jan. 14 that the season is over, although that's probably a forgone conclusion at this point for most of us."

The NHL salvaged a 48-game season during the last lockout 10 years ago after both sides reached an agreement Jan. 11.

Bettman does not actually need an official vote from the board to cancel the season, just as he didn't need it when he triggered the lockout. But he would obviously need its approval _ and establishing a potential drop-dead date on the season also serves to put pressure on the union.

"The scheduling of the board of governors meeting is a league matter and not something the NHLPA will comment on," NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin said in a statement.

Sources indicate the union is not working on another new proposal and will not be the one to pick up the phone to renew talks.

"It's funny (the NHL) calls a meeting like that when they don't even call for negotiations," New Jersey Devils goalie Martin Brodeur said in Poland, after completing the Worldstars' tour of Europe. "If that's what it is, it's unfortunate.

"But one way or another, if they have an agenda, then tell us right away and then we won't have to worry about not playing and guys can go to Europe. We're not going to accept a cap.

"If they don't get off that, we won't be playing."

Added Anaheim Mighty Ducks centre and fellow Worldstar Sergei Fedorov: "It's going to be a disaster for the sport if they announce a cancellation. No other pro sport has ever been cancelled for the reasons they gave us.

"I want to stay positive and in the back of my mind, I want to keep up hope because the sport is bigger than Gary Bettman. I know the PA did everything it can to have a season."

There's still time for the NHL and NHLPA to reach an agreement. But no talks are planned and the two sides haven't met since Dec. 14 in Toronto when the NHL rejected the union's proposal and the NHLPA in turn rejected the league's counter-proposal.

"I would certainly hope that we have some talks between now and Jan. 14 and I would hope we would have some serious negotiations between now and Jan. 14," Daly said. "But I'm not singularly in control of that process so we'll have to see how that plays out."

Bettman and his counterpart, NHLPA executive director Bob Goodenow, have left little wiggle room in their respective positions. Bettman insists he will never accept a payroll tax system, while Goodenow maintains a salary cap is unacceptable to the union.

Should the season be called off, the NHL would become the first of the four major pro leagues in North America to cancel a full season.

The last time the Stanley Cup wasn't awarded was in 1919 when the Spanish flu cancelled the Montreal-Seattle final. The Cup was contested during the Second World War.

The lockout reached 98 days Wednesday, with 470 of the season's 1,230 games gone by the wayside. By Jan. 14, when the board of governors meet, 627 games will have been scrapped.

The NHL has said from the beginning of this dispute that it was willing to forgo an entire season if it could not get a new deal that "fixed the system."

"Our owners are fully prepared, as they've shown to date, to incur whatever business damage that might be necessary to make sure that we have a collective bargaining agreement that's going to work long-term for this league," Daly said.

The league says it has lost $1.8 billion US over the course of the last deal, which spanned 10 seasons, and needs "cost certainty" in any new agreement - a salary cap.

The union responded by making a proposal Dec. 9 that surprised many, a package that included a 24 per cent rollback on all existing player contracts as well as other changes in favour of the owners in salary arbitration, restricted free agency and the entry-level system.

While recognizing the 24 per cent rollback as a major concession, Bettman responded five days later by saying it was a one-time fix and that "we would be back in the same position - best case - within two to three years, continuing to struggle the entire time."

The union angrily disagreed with the "one-time fix" assertion, saying its package would reset the entire market-place and have a ripple effect on a number of levels which would help cure the financial ills of owners.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
19,446
0
0
LMAO Aquaman....you are getting a little senile during this lockout...why did you post that story twice? ;)

:p

"It's funny (the NHL) calls a meeting like that when they don't even call for negotiations," New Jersey Devils goalie Martin Brodeur said in Poland, after completing the Worldstars' tour of Europe. "If that's what it is, it's unfortunate.

"But one way or another, if they have an agenda, then tell us right away and then we won't have to worry about not playing and guys can go to Europe. We're not going to accept a cap.

"If they don't get off that, we won't be playing."

Why don't you stay in fvcking Poland you POS. :|


Added Anaheim Mighty Ducks centre and fellow Worldstar Sergei Fedorov: "It's going to be a disaster for the sport if they announce a cancellation. No other pro sport has ever been cancelled for the reasons they gave us.

"I want to stay positive and in the back of my mind, I want to keep up hope because the sport is bigger than Gary Bettman. I know the PA did everything it can to have a season."

Yeah, why don't you stay there too you fvcking greedy POS. :|
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
McCabe rips Bettman on BOG meeting

TSN.ca Staff with Toronto Sun files
12/23/2004

Toronto Maple Leafs defenceman and Players' Association representative Bryan McCabe was among the first to offer his thoughts on news that National Hockey League Commissioner Gary Bettman was holding a board of governors meeting Jan. 14.

"Do they really need a meeting?" McCabe told the Toronto Sun hours after the news. "I mean, Gary's been poised to throw away (this) season for the past five years. I think he's known this was going to happen for a long time now."

McCabe didn't hold back from there, adding that the commissioner knew nothing about hockey.

"He's a basketball guy," McCabe told the Sun. "If he bumped into me on the street, he wouldn't know me. You could probably say that if he bumped into 95 per cent of the league."

The NHL salvaged a 48-game season during the last lockout 10 years ago after both sides reached an agreement Jan. 11. The work stoppage lasted 103 days, while this lockout is just four days shy of that time frame.

Bettman does not need an official vote from the board to cancel the season, just as he didn't need it when he triggered the lockout. But he would need its approval - and establishing a potential drop-dead date on the season also serves to put pressure on the union.

Should the season be called off, the NHL would become the first of the four major pro leagues in North America to cancel a full season.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
19,446
0
0
"Do they really need a meeting?" McCabe told the Toronto Sun hours after the news. "I mean, Gary's been poised to throw away (this) season for the past five years. I think he's known this was going to happen for a long time now."

:frown::disgust:

Another one to add to my list. How about you PLAYERS are throwing away this season? Nope...god forbid they admit responsibility. WTF sort of drugs is Goodenow feeding them...they might try a reality check. :|:|

Fvcking greedy, selfish POS.
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
19,446
0
0
PRO HOCKEY NOTES

Jacobs remarks a thorn in Thornton's side
By Nancy Marrapese-Burrell | December 26, 2004


Bruins captain Joe Thornton was less than thrilled when he read comments by team owner Jeremy Jacobs in this space last Sunday in which Jacobs said he thought one of the reasons for the sport's malaise is that the top players don't give 100 percent every game.

"There's a whole body of thinking by a lot of people within the sport who feel the high-priced players don't necessarily play every day," Jacobs said. "They play intermittently and that has added to some of the dullness. When you pay a lot for a player, you expect him to play a lot, so we're playing a lot of guys who maybe we shouldn't be playing, who aren't really giving it the kind of interest that needs to be shown in this game.

"They're comfortable, they're presumptuous, they know they're going to play and they don't have to fight for the position. There should be a way of handling that. There should be a way of perhaps sending them to a Providence for a couple of games or so until they build back the energy and the desire to play. That's the view of some, I don't say it's Jerry Jacobs's view, but it's been suggested that perhaps the game would be a whole lot more interesting if people skated harder every game as opposed to just mailing it in."

Thornton, currently playing for Davos of the Swiss Elite League during the lockout, was taken aback by the owner's comments.

"I was offended," said Thornton, reached by phone in Switzerland. "You've got to be offended. Personally, I think we're the best-[conditioned] athletes in the world. In my mind, I was thinking, `Wow, I can't believe he's saying that.' He's obviously not coming to the FleetCenter enough. I pride myself on working hard every game. You see [top] players getting hacked and whacked and having to play through that. You work hard for 82 games and it's the toughest grind in pro sports. That takes a lot out of you. It's the quickest and the best game in the world and it's a shame the owners won't let us play."

Thornton has followed the labor negotiations during his stint overseas and said although he's disappointed there is no NHL hockey, he -- like so many others -- isn't surprised.

When asked if he would accept a salary cap in order to save the season, Thornton said he agreed with the NHL Players' Association and that his answer was a resounding no. He even took it a step further, saying he wouldn't accept a salary cap even if it meant saving his career as an NHL player.

"We're not going to take it," he said. "They're trying to break the union and it's not going to happen. What, are the Providence Bruins going to be the Boston Bruins now? I don't know. I don't see no NHL in the future."

Thornton said Jacobs's criticism of the best and brightest players doesn't make him remotely hopeful of a resolution.

"With him saying stuff about the star players, it's not going to help," he said.

Colorado Avalanche star Joe Sakic didn't take kindly to Jacobs's comments, either, telling the Denver Post: "Here in Denver, we want to thank Jeremy Jacobs for the way he runs his business," said Sakic. "Otherwise, we wouldn't have gotten Ray Bourque and won a Stanley Cup. Other than that, I don't pay much attention to what he has to say."

The NHL's Board of Governors has a meeting scheduled for Jan. 14 in New York, at which time it's expected what many have suspected for months will be made official -- the 2004-05 season officially will be canceled.

Oates takes a stand

For a vastly different view of the union's position, look no further than former Bruins star Adam Oates, who retired last spring and now lives in Palm Springs, Calif. Oates went through the lockout in 1994 and although he was sympathetic to the union's position, he was an alternative voice from the hardliners. At that time, Oates publicly wondered what good the loss of income was doing the middle- and lower-tiered players who were never going to recoup that money. Oates still feels that way.

"The biggest thing for the players is we talk about how we're solidified [as a union] and you've got 300 guys making money [playing in Europe] and that is not solidified in my eyes," he said. "We talk about the union and [it's] always looking after the little guy and how the big guy is always going to be looked after. Well, we're not looking out for the little guy because the big guys are still making money in Europe. Or you've got a bunch of guys who can afford to go a year and a half without hockey. The little guys on the totem pole, they must be dying right now, panicking. I've got enough money, I'm not rolling in it, but I could take the $600,000 I lost [in '94] and give it to my brother and sisters. Everybody could. It's a joke to say otherwise."

On the issue of a salary cap, Oates said he can't understand the union's vehemence, provided the payroll number is high enough.

"It's ludicrous that with no TV deal we don't have a salary cap, but I think the numbers should be very flexible," he said. "We have to admit there is no TV deal, so there should be a cap, but the league should be flexible in agreeing that certain markets do better than others and there should be a luxury tax in those markets. I don't have a problem with a salary cap. We've got six or eight teams making money because they've got a great fan base and a great ownership situation. So, have a luxury tax on them and give that money to the other teams."

Oates said he's always been a strong proponent of a hard salary cap for rookies, something the union accepted in the last collective bargaining agreement, but it was circumvented by owners, in general, and the Bruins, in particular, who loaded up Thornton's contract with bonuses that became the model for entry-level players.

"If [a team gives a first-year player] a couple of million bucks and he turns out not to be a player, you just lost a couple of million," said Oates. "That's a lot of money in hockey. Because he got so much, he's in the NHL. If you're allowed to pay that guy reasonable money -- a couple of hundred grand and a couple of hundred grand [as a signing bonus] -- and he goes to the minors, learns to play hockey and he gets better, then he's up in five years and he's making $2 million because he's earned it. We didn't want to give in to a salary cap for rookies [in 1994] and I was like, `Well, why not?' "

Oates said he watched as one former teammate -- forward Stanislav Chistov, who was taken by Anaheim with the No. 5 overall pick in the 2001 draft -- signed a lucrative deal as a rookie and was pressured to develop faster than he was ready to because of his salary. Oates said the youngster didn't have to fight for what he had, was playing in situations he shouldn't have been in, and didn't really learn the game. Then he was criticized in his second season. Ultimately, he ended up demoted to the minors, where Oates believes he should've started.

"He can go back to Russia with $3 million in his pocket," said Oates. "It's good for him, but is it good for hockey? Obviously, the answer is no."

Oates said he blames both sides for the predicament, but he said if he had a message for players now, it would be to look after yourself -- whether it be in on-ice battles or union battles. In the end, he says, you're the only one who'll be supporting you and once you're out of the sport, no matter how much you've sacrificed, you'll need a ticket to get into a game just like everybody else.

"It's a job. What matters is when your kids have food on their plates. You know what matters to me? My family. We can all say we care about winning. But how many guys who have their name on the [Stanley] Cup would trade the ring for another year's salary? I bet you 80 percent. [A fellow player] told me, `The ring is everything,' and I said, `No, it's not.' I pointed to his son and said, `That's everything.' Yeah, you want to win, but it's not everything. Take care of your family."

Issue in Bertuzzi case
The attorney for Steve Moore of the Avalanche wants an inquiry by the attorney general in British Columbia into why his client wasn't able to appear in court during Wednesday's sentencing of Vancouver Canucks forward Todd Bertuzzi. Last March 8, Bertuzzi mugged Moore during a game and Moore suffered serious injuries. Attorney Tim Danson said when he learned of the court date, there wasn't enough time to get his client to Vancouver. "Steve is not passing judgment on the plea bargain, he's not passing judgment on the sentence," said Danson. "All he asked was to be heard. I don't know what impact it would've had, but it was a real simple request. Victims have the right to face the accused. He had a right to look at Todd Bertuzzi if he chose and let Todd Bertuzzi understand what impact this has [had]." Bertuzzi, who pleaded guilty to assault causing bodily harm, received a conditional discharge, a sentence that could carry no criminal record . . . Notice of the Board of Governors meeting rankled Maple Leafs defenseman Bryan McCabe. "Do they really need a meeting?" said McCabe. "I mean, [commissioner Gary Bettman] has been poised to throw away [this] season for the past five years. I think he's known this was going to happen for a long time now." If [when?] it happens, it will mark the first time in history that one of the four major pro sports leagues in North America will cancel a full season. On that upbeat note, Happy Holidays.

---------------------

Well, first off, let me give a big f-u to Thornton and McCabe...whiny b!tches. :|

Also, a huge :thumbsup: goes to Adam Oates! :D


Cheers,
Insane3D

:p
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
Gretzky: Long lockout looms

Canadian Press
1/2/2005

GRAND FORKS, N.D. (CP) - Wayne Gretzky is concerned that if the NHL and the players' association don't agree to a new collective bargaining agreement soon, not just this season, but next season will also be lost.

"If this is not decided in the next few days, I'm scared we could be looking at a year, a year and a half, two years, not just three months like a lot of people thought in September, " Gretzky said Sunday during a news conference at the world junior hockey championship. "From April to October, the players don't get paid, so I can't see us coming to an agreement in August or September.

"If we don't find a way to make everyone who is part of this sort of happy and get a deal done, we could be looking at a long, long time before hockey is played in the NHL and that's very alarming too. I hope in the next couple weeks we can come to an agreement."

Gretzky also denied recent published reports that the Phoenix Coyotes franchise is for sale. Gretzky is a minority owner and a managing partner of the club.

"The team is not for sale," Gretzky said. "If it was for sale I would tell you guys, but it's not. There's really no truth to the story at all."

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

spacejamz

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
10,938
1,605
126


had dallas stars season tickets for 4 years...did not renew for this year (mostly because I used to live a block away from where they play, but moved 30 minutes away)...pretty weird that I don't even miss it now...
 

Aquaman

Lifer
Dec 17, 1999
25,054
13
0
Rucchin: No new NHLPA offer planned

TSN.ca Staff
1/4/2005

Steve Rucchin says there will be no last minute proposal made by the players to try and get collective bargaining talks back on track.

The Anaheim Mighty Ducks player rep says he's hopeful of some last minute negotiations but the next move is up to the owners.

"It would be really sad if they didn't have a season," Rucchin tells the Los Angeles Times.

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman has convened a Board of Governors meeting for January 14, where two scenarios are possible - a drop dead date for the cancellation of the season will be announced or the owners will discuss making another proposal to try and re-start talks.

Despite some denials at the time, the NHLPA put forth a new proposal on December 9. That offer was rejected by the owners, who came up with their own proposal five days later. That offer was also rejected by the NHLPA.

Rucchin says their last offer is as far as players are willing to go when it comes to concessions.

Cheers,
Aquaman
 

marcello

Golden Member
Aug 30, 2004
1,141
0
0
AHHHHH. This fvcking sucks. In the San Jose area they're showing the top 5 Sharks games of all time. It's like a slap in the face. This is what you're missing, and it's great. Would they please figure this out. Fvck all those greedy bastards on both sides.