Obama will create 4 million jobs, save or create 4 million, make that 3.5 million

[Budmantom]

So how do we measure this stimulus bill, how do you measure saved jobs, in 4 years if we have 3.5 million government employees is this a success for the stimulus bill?

When are these jobs to be created are we talking 1 year, 4 years or 20 years?

This is a serious question, what is the purposed method of measuring success?

 

[fallenangel99]

It's all psychological

 

[JaYp146]

Originally posted by: Budmantom
So how do we measure this stimulus bill, how do you measure saved jobs, in 4 years if we have 3.5 million government employees is this a success for the stimulus bill?

When are these jobs to be created are we talking 1 year, 4 years or 20 years?

This is a serious question, what is the purposed method of measuring success?

History books.

 

[Slew Foot]

When the stimulus goes away, will we lose those 3.5 million jobs?

 

[Stunt]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
When the stimulus goes away, will we lose those 3.5 million jobs?

I believe 80% of the US economy is driven by consumer spending, if confidence in the market and job security goes down by a monumental amount as it has now; people stop spending. The purpose of the stimulus is to flood the market with money that has no reservations as to how or if it's spent backed by the government. As more people go back to work, spending increases and markets stabilize; consumer confidence and subsequently spending will increase. This is the justification for the stimulus...will be interesting to see if it is able to have the intended impact.

Originally posted by: fallenangel99
It's all psychological

You are right...it is psychological...consumer confidence drives all.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
When the stimulus goes away, will we lose those 3.5 million jobs?

The simple answer to that question is "yes", particularly the jobs related to infrastructure.

That said, if the plan can jump-start an entire industry like wind power, then it has the potential to create lots of long-term employment.

 

[nullzero]

From what I hear the job creation numbers are fabricated BS based on a rebound in the GDP. Some economist broke it down and said its more like 2 million jobs. They said one of the infrastructure jobs which they claimed would make 10,000 jobs did not have enough money to even pay 5,000 construction workers the average going salary.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Budmantom
So how do we measure this stimulus bill, how do you measure saved jobs, in 4 years if we have 3.5 million government employees is this a success for the stimulus bill?

When are these jobs to be created are we talking 1 year, 4 years or 20 years?

This is a serious question, what is the purposed method of measuring success?

There is none (other than 'estimates').

Personally, I see very little in new job creation; money allocated to infrastructure projects was simply far too small and it's going to be spread out over a very long period.

I think some jobs might be saved (less layoffs at the state/local gov levels given the huge 'welfare' amount given to them) but I've never heard anyone even attempt to claim that can be quantified, only estimated.

FDR's plan didn't work, as Morganthau admitted; I don't see how this one can either. At least that plan seemed to have put the money into peoples' pockets (unlike this one).

Fern

 

[StageLeft]

Truly the last figure i heard was 5m. You'll note that as more people lose their jobs the figure keeps rising.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Budmantom
So how do we measure this stimulus bill, how do you measure saved jobs, in 4 years if we have 3.5 million government employees is this a success for the stimulus bill?

When are these jobs to be created are we talking 1 year, 4 years or 20 years?

This is a serious question, what is the purposed method of measuring success?

www.recovery.gov

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act will be carried out with full transparency and accountability -- and Recovery.gov is the centerpiece of that effort.

 

[StageLeft]

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act will be carried out with full transparency and accountability -- and Recovery.gov is the centerpiece of that effort.

My last job I had a title of Business Solutions Specialist. My co-workers called it BS specialist, and they were right. That particular profession makes good use of words like transparency, accountability, and risk aversion.

 

[First]

There's no way to prove you "saved" jobs, it's a politically shrewd move given that a POTUS really can't affect the economy that directly and quickly. If that were the case, every POTUS from the last few decades would have simply passed multi-billion dollar stimulus packages. Not that simple. All Obama can do is flood the market with the dollars necessary to get people investing, get banks loaning, improve some infrastructure, and get people spending. That's it, and it'll be on a somewhat relatively small scale.

 

[Jiggz]

Originally posted by: Evan
There's no way to prove you "saved" jobs, it's a politically shrewd move given that a POTUS really can't affect the economy that directly and quickly. If that were the case, every POTUS from the last few decades would have simply passed multi-billion dollar stimulus packages. Not that simple. All Obama can do is flood the market with the dollars necessary to get people investing, get banks loaning, improve some infrastructure, and get people spending. That's it, and it'll be on a somewhat relatively small scale.

As mentioned before, if spending billions can pull us out of this downturn or recession, we would have spent billions of trillions so we'll all be in paradise! But the truth is that it'll not!

The millions of jobs mentioned (initially claimed to create 2M, 2.5M, 3M, 3.5M, 4M and then back to 3.5M) is nothing but a campaign "promise". After election the 3.5M jobs purportedly to create jobs was revised to "either to create or save" jobs. This is called MISLEADING EUPHEMISMS just like what Bill C did when he asked, "What is 'is'?" during his impeachment hearing. With the word "saved" comes a deliberate purpose of evasion and manipulation, with the Measure of Performance or Success becoming murkier! Which basically means, THERE ARE NO SUCH 3.5M JOBS! Created or saved!

 

[First]

Originally posted by: Jiggz

Originally posted by: Evan
There's no way to prove you "saved" jobs, it's a politically shrewd move given that a POTUS really can't affect the economy that directly and quickly. If that were the case, every POTUS from the last few decades would have simply passed multi-billion dollar stimulus packages. Not that simple. All Obama can do is flood the market with the dollars necessary to get people investing, get banks loaning, improve some infrastructure, and get people spending. That's it, and it'll be on a somewhat relatively small scale.

As mentioned before, if spending billions can pull us out of this downturn or recession, we would have spent billions of trillions so we'll all be in paradise! But the truth is that it'll not!

Injecting dollars via stimulus (and partially or wholly nationalizing private enterprises) have worked for decades both in the U.S. and abroad, actually. It's far more proven than doing nothing. Doing "nothing" by ignoring warning signs and creating an environment of lax regulation is exactly what led to the current crisis of private firms making terrible risk management decisions to the tune of trillions of dollars. And that's just from 3 firms alone (Bear Sterns, Lehman, AIG).

The millions of jobs mentioned (initially claimed to create 2M, 2.5M, 3M, 3.5M, 4M and then back to 3.5M) is nothing but a campaign "promise". After election the 3.5M jobs purportedly to create jobs was revised to "either to create or save" jobs. This is called MISLEADING EUPHEMISMS just like what Bill C did when he asked, "What is 'is'?" during his impeachment hearing. With the word "saved" comes a deliberate purpose of evasion and manipulation, with the Measure of Performance or Success becoming murkier! Which basically means, THERE ARE NO SUCH 3.5M JOBS! Created or saved!

It's smart politics. You don't get elected if you're a terrible politician, unless you run on name alone like Bush.

 

[Carmen813]

Well we lost 600,000 jobs last month. That doesn't count, since stimulus wasn't passed yet. So if we lose >3.5 million jobs, I guess stimulus failed. If we create or lose <3.5 million, it worked.

At least, that's how I'm assuming it will be spun.

 

[Firebot]

In 6 months the only sure thing that we all know will happen, Democrats will say the bill will have succeeded in saving jobs as many more jobs would have been lost had it not been for the bill, while Republicans will say the bill was a total disaster, raising the national debt irresponsibly and did not produce regardless of the actual job numbers (if it goes up it's due to Bush past policies, if it goes down it's Obama / Clinton's fault).

 

[OCGuy]

Nancy Pelosi says the stimulus will create 5 million jobs a month for the next 20 years. :laugh:

 

[TheSlamma]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Nancy Pelosi says the stimulus will create 5 million jobs a month for the next 20 years. :laugh:

Now if only she can tell us what those jobs will be. I don't understand what line of work is supposed to get stimulated? Fast food? Manufacturing? Steel workers? Landscapers? Sanitation Engineers?

I'm sure she has absolutely no clue.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: Firebot
In 6 months the only sure thing that we all know will happen, Democrats will say the bill will have succeeded in saving jobs as many more jobs would have been lost had it not been for the bill, while Republicans will say the bill was a total disaster, raising the national debt irresponsibly and did not produce regardless of the actual job numbers (if it goes up it's due to Bush past policies, if it goes down it's Obama / Clinton's fault).

QFT

 

[Jiggz]

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: Jiggz

Originally posted by: Evan
There's no way to prove you "saved" jobs, it's a politically shrewd move given that a POTUS really can't affect the economy that directly and quickly. If that were the case, every POTUS from the last few decades would have simply passed multi-billion dollar stimulus packages. Not that simple. All Obama can do is flood the market with the dollars necessary to get people investing, get banks loaning, improve some infrastructure, and get people spending. That's it, and it'll be on a somewhat relatively small scale.

As mentioned before, if spending billions can pull us out of this downturn or recession, we would have spent billions of trillions so we'll all be in paradise! But the truth is that it'll not!

Injecting dollars via stimulus (and partially or wholly nationalizing private enterprises) have worked for decades both in the U.S. and abroad, actually. It's far more proven than doing nothing. Doing "nothing" by ignoring warning signs and creating an environment of lax regulation is exactly what led to the current crisis of private firms making terrible risk management decisions to the tune of trillions of dollars. And that's just from 3 firms alone (Bear Sterns, Lehman, AIG).

Can you be more specific like name a country and the period they injected money into the economy and it actually rebounded on that same time or period? Don't even mention Hoover or FDR for both of their programs didn't work. Abroad? What about Japan in the 90's? It didn't work either.

The millions of jobs mentioned (initially claimed to create 2M, 2.5M, 3M, 3.5M, 4M and then back to 3.5M) is nothing but a campaign "promise". After election the 3.5M jobs purportedly to create jobs was revised to "either to create or save" jobs. This is called MISLEADING EUPHEMISMS just like what Bill C did when he asked, "What is 'is'?" during his impeachment hearing. With the word "saved" comes a deliberate purpose of evasion and manipulation, with the Measure of Performance or Success becoming murkier! Which basically means, THERE ARE NO SUCH 3.5M JOBS! Created or saved!

It's smart politics. You don't get elected if you're a terrible politician, unless you run on name alone like Bush.

Smart politics? Nah! It's stupid and idiot voters! People who can't decide for themselves and are so gullible it affects all of use.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

They'll create another website to track it. Everyone that got a job after the stimulus bill should register so they can keep accurate numbers.