obama 'speech'

[IronWing]

So if we are to assume what you say is correct, what we've had for the past seven years is a president who is unable to work with the other side. He what, decided it was just too hard? Although not a Senator for long, he was one and he should have had a pretty good idea how the process works as dysfunctional as it it.

But I get it. It's mentally soothing to foist the blame on others. He attained the office with high aspirations and a slew of promises. Instead, he choomed out on the nation and improved his golf game.

That's how it appears to me here in the wilds of the nation, far outside of the beltway. I see a nation that by every metric, if one decides to use the real numbers and not the current truth as presented by the administration, that has declined and in some cases greatly. In some cases by design and in others through incompetence. "Wasn't me" works for kids just once typically. After that good parents let them know that it doesn't cut it anymore. I can put up with one more year of "wasn't me". I can also endure the high pedestal he has been put on and the even higher one that will be fabricated out of thin air after he leaves office. That pedestal will get taller and taller over time. Whatever.

We haven't heard the last of him. His ego will take over and just like Carter, we'll hear from him one more time in January of 2017 before he leaves office. He'll need to tell himself how wonderful he is in public one last time.

I predicted early in his first term that his ultimate goal was to be the head honcho at the U.N. Of course I had no idea how lazy he actually was at that time. But, his ego is not going to be happy with him out of the spotlight and he knows he can be a slacker quite easily there after being one for eight years as preezy. We'll see if I'm right.

Obama has shown a singular capacity for avoiding taking leadership for the policies he espouses. "I want healthcare reform!", followed by a complete abdication of leadership and responsibility for seeing meaningful legislation work its way through Congress.

 

[theeedude]

You along with every corporation who wants to outsource our jobs to countries with little to know employee rights.. but hey they they are CHEAP!

Meanwhile the US is doing 'great' because we back filled those spots with $12 an fast food 'careers'. Because everyone should run on Dunkin'!

Call me when either one of your parties is ready to involve the middle class in any part of their plans other than the single source of tax revenue.

You can bash Obama all day long, but nobody is going to make things you want happen and then call you. You have to think, work, organize, and vote at every level for them to happen. Obama doesn't have a magic wand.

 

[thraashman]

The right has been laughing at him for the past seven years because he's the center of the universe in his own mind. But, maybe you don't have a full understanding of how our government is supposed to work. It's that three branches with equal power thing we're supposed to have going on? When it's working as it was designed, our President needs to reach out to the other branches, especially the Congress for help in achieving his goals. Instead, Obama chooses to berate the members of the Republican party and do things on his own even though our high courts keep striking his actions down.

So, when he says I over and over and over, it's his massive ego talking because that's just the way he's wired. It's all about him and it's plain to see. He's been described repeatedly as petulant. It suits him perfectly. Few people that have attained the office have been as unsuited for the office as Barack Obama. One more year of the grand experiment.

I get that you're trying to supplant michal1980 as most fucking stupid member of ATPN, but I'm sorry the lead he's built up is just too much. I admire your effort in this thread as it's significant. The amount of fucktardedness you've displayed is ... impressive in its stupidity, but you simply can't catch him. Perhaps you should instead just try to be intelligent and useful? I know, it's not your thing, but you can try.

 

[trenchfoot]

I haven't heard a single peep out of the very wealthy about how Obama is ruining their lives and livelihood, although I have heard very loud and clear via their desire to push for a Republican president with their exorbitant use of SuperPacs.

Meaning: They're happy that Obama, for the most part, left them the precious ground they gained during Bush's tenure but they want and expect more and more and more tax cuts and givebacks and corporate welfare and corruption and influence and control over the already corrupt government that they now have in their back pockets.

They want the Democrat Party to cease to exist. They want, as has been witnessed by the legislation the Repubs in Congress have been religiously pushing for, every Social Assistance Program the gov't has been providing either privatized or demolished so they can raid the treasury of those funds that go toward supporting such essential assistance that ironically, they themselves have a large part in creating by off-shoring jobs and other such "profit making" policies.

That the Repub Party, as witnessed by their legislative agenda, has been solely focused on helping the wealthy get wealthier while keeping their voting base happy with sloganeering and legislating hyped up single issue social crises, speaks to their purpose in life as an ideology and the pursuit thereof.

I hear nothing coming out the Repubs in Congress about how they plan to raise the living standards of their middle class and poor constituents, about how they are going to provide affordable health care for them, about how they are going to provide jobs for them, other than having their wealthy benefactors become so rich as to have the overflow of such wealth trickle down to their vassals and the peasants that support their way of life.

So to hear from Obama how, under his management, the economy has turned the corner, how efforts are being made to move the nation toward paying attention to the needs of the middle class and the poor, well, it gives me a little hope that things can and do get better for the nation.

I recall the doom and gloom, the visions of the nation sinking into abject poverty and despair, the prophesying of the nation losing its identity as a nation of Christians and upstanding moral values that came out of the Repub spin machine as Obama took office, when absolutely NONE of it came to pass.

This is what the Repubs have been offering the nation since Obama took office. This is what the Repubs in Congress want the nation to believe and to act in accordance with.

Well, too bad, so sad, the nation is moving on despite the visions of horror the RNC has been flooding the media with.

IMO, Obama painted a more accurate picture of what condition the nation is in.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

I get that you're trying to supplant michal1980 as most fucking stupid member of ATPN, but I'm sorry the lead he's built up is just too much. I admire your effort in this thread as it's significant. The amount of fucktardedness you've displayed is ... impressive in its stupidity, but you simply can't catch him. Perhaps you should instead just try to be intelligent and useful? I know, it's not your thing, but you can try.

He doesn't admire Obama and that somehow makes him stupid in your opinion? Why don't you say something intelligent and useful as I would really like to see what that looks like. What is it about Obama's presidency that you like so much? Foreign policy? Economic policy? Domestic policy? What has he done during his tenure that warrants your unwavering adulation?

 

[fskimospy]

He doesn't admire Obama and that somehow makes him stupid in your opinion? Why don't you say something intelligent and useful as I would really like to see what that looks like. What is it about Obama's presidency that you like so much? Foreign policy? Economic policy? Domestic policy? What has he done during his tenure that warrants your unwavering adulation?

Uhmm, we should all be able to agree that boomerang is one of the more poorly informed and one of the more unhinged posters on here. I remember for quite awhile he was utterly convinced that Obama's published birth certificate was a forgery. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy.

As for what I like about him, his economic policy was pretty good. The US saw a dramatic increase in employment during his tenure, and the US economy substantially outperformed basically all other developed nations in recovering from the crisis.

Domestic policy, he has the ACA, which is one of the most valuable pieces of legislation passed in my lifetime. He has Dodd-Frank, and he has a host of smaller ones. Social safety net wise he has been excellent, but his civil liberties stance has been bad.

Foreign policy is a bit of a mixed bag, as things in the Middle East have gone generally poorly. It's hard to tell how much of that we could control though. One thing we can control was the Iran nuke deal though, which is fantastic. Also, opening up to Cuba was long overdue.

I think in the end Obama will be judged quite well overall. He's not the second coming of FDR that people were hoping for, but still a good performance.

 

[MongGrel]

He doesn't admire Obama and that somehow makes him stupid in your opinion? Why don't you say something intelligent and useful as I would really like to see what that looks like. What is it about Obama's presidency that you like so much? Foreign policy? Economic policy? Domestic policy? What has he done during his tenure that warrants your unwavering adulation?

I was not going to say much earlier, but a few people are venturing to full rant mode at this point.

To put it a politely, Bill had an inherent advantage over Obama in regards to dealing with the GOP in general.

 

[Jhhnn]

Obama has shown a singular capacity for avoiding taking leadership for the policies he espouses. "I want healthcare reform!", followed by a complete abdication of leadership and responsibility for seeing meaningful legislation work its way through Congress.

You're smarter than that. Repubs are automatically against anything he wants so he puts Pelosi & Reid out front.

Look at the slick way he decoupled from marijuana legalization in framing it as States' Rights while supporting it all the way. He made it not about him but rather about what the people want, executed a complete mindfuck on the opposition. Might as well have smacked 'em in the forehead with a rubber mallet.

He deftly maneuvered right around them with Iran, as well.

 

[Jhhnn]

Obama chooses to berate the members of the Republican party and do things on his own even though our high courts keep striking his actions down.

Pure delusion. The SCOTUS ruled in his favor both in striking down DOMA & similar state laws, also in upholding the ACA repeatedly. There are other examples as well, I'm sure.

 

[Subyman]

oh please. Progress and positivity? The guy was divisive for 7+ years and now talks about progress and positivity?

Obama's progress: Rich even richer

Obama's positivity: Global warming will kill the planet.

I see the anger in you. Positivity and progress seem to make you angry.

 

[jackstar7]

He doesn't admire Obama and that somehow makes him stupid in your opinion?

Your strawman is not well constructed.

 

[Subyman]

Uhmm, we should all be able to agree that boomerang is one of the more poorly informed and one of the more unhinged posters on here. I remember for quite awhile he was utterly convinced that Obama's published birth certificate was a forgery. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy.

As for what I like about him, his economic policy was pretty good. The US saw a dramatic increase in employment during his tenure, and the US economy substantially outperformed basically all other developed nations in recovering from the crisis.

Domestic policy, he has the ACA, which is one of the most valuable pieces of legislation passed in my lifetime. He has Dodd-Frank, and he has a host of smaller ones. Social safety net wise he has been excellent, but his civil liberties stance has been bad.

Foreign policy is a bit of a mixed bag, as things in the Middle East have gone generally poorly. It's hard to tell how much of that we could control though. One thing we can control was the Iran nuke deal though, which is fantastic. Also, opening up to Cuba was long overdue.

I think in the end Obama will be judged quite well overall. He's not the second coming of FDR that people were hoping for, but still a good performance.

This pretty much sums up my feelings. I don't believe Obama is some savior. An important measure for me though is that I like him more now than in 2008. I was very skeptical with the "greenhorn" during the McCain/Obama election. Now I look at the upcoming presidential election and am disappointed in our next offerings compared to him.

I also realize that Bush had crazies that made up stuff about him as well. Birthers, "Obama is a Muslim", and "Obama wants to confiscate guns" people aren't any different than the loons that thought 9/11 was a vast GWB conspiracy. It does seem like their voice is louder this time, which is troubling. People certainly have the right to not like a President's policy, but to refuse to even listen or try to understand that policy isn't healthy for anyone.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

This pretty much sums up my feelings. I don't believe Obama is some savior. An important measure for me though is that I like him more now than in 2008. I was very skeptical with the "greenhorn" during the McCain/Obama election. Now I look at the upcoming presidential election and am disappointed in our next offerings compared to him.

I also realize that Bush had crazies that made up stuff about him as well. Birthers, "Obama is a Muslim", and "Obama wants to confiscate guns" people aren't any different than the loons that thought 9/11 was a vast GWB conspiracy. It does seem like their voice is louder this time, which is troubling. People certainly have the right to not like a President's policy, but to refuse to even listen or try to understand that policy isn't healthy for anyone.

If Obama even aspired to be a savior, he was already crucified by mid-summer 2010.

You have to measure his staying-power by the lockstep extent of the Opposition, attempting to obstruct his presidency at every turn. Now, it has sunk to the subterranean level of picking every Executive Order scab, hoping to see blood, as if this had been an "Imperial Presidency" like Nixon's.

 

[Jhhnn]

This pretty much sums up my feelings. I don't believe Obama is some savior. An important measure for me though is that I like him more now than in 2008. I was very skeptical with the "greenhorn" during the McCain/Obama election. Now I look at the upcoming presidential election and am disappointed in our next offerings compared to him.

I also realize that Bush had crazies that made up stuff about him as well. Birthers, "Obama is a Muslim", and "Obama wants to confiscate guns" people aren't any different than the loons that thought 9/11 was a vast GWB conspiracy. It does seem like their voice is louder this time, which is troubling. People certainly have the right to not like a President's policy, but to refuse to even listen or try to understand that policy isn't healthy for anyone.

Please. 9/11 Truthers never had any support from the Democrats. That can't be said for Republicans & their pandering to the fringe.

 

[Tab]

I thought the SOTU was decent but I feel that's Obama's inherently a uniter not a divider and there isn't a whole lot to work with on the other side of the aisle. The Republican response just leaves me dumbfounded, according to them the sky is falling yet gas prices are low, unemployment is down and the future looks promising.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I thought the SOTU was decent but I feel that's Obama's inherently a uniter not a divider and there isn't a whole lot to work with on the other side of the aisle. The Republican response just leaves me dumbfounded, according to them the sky is falling yet gas prices are low, unemployment is down and the future looks promising.

The GOP will always argue that Obama is a Divider -- not a Uniter. That's been their entire playbook over the last seven years.

I suspect they're counting on the electorate to believe it, but it's unbelievable. They were always the Dividers.

As for gas prices, even Obama succumbs to spinning that one. On a scale of 1 to 10 for spin, I count it as a 1 or 2.

When it comes to Lies or lesser variations, you have to separate the beans from the chaff. The GOP is "fulla beans."

 

[Moonbeam]

This pretty much sums up my feelings. I don't believe Obama is some savior. An important measure for me though is that I like him more now than in 2008. I was very skeptical with the "greenhorn" during the McCain/Obama election. Now I look at the upcoming presidential election and am disappointed in our next offerings compared to him.

I also realize that Bush had crazies that made up stuff about him as well. Birthers, "Obama is a Muslim", and "Obama wants to confiscate guns" people aren't any different than the loons that thought 9/11 was a vast GWB conspiracy. It does seem like their voice is louder this time, which is troubling. People certainly have the right to not like a President's policy, but to refuse to even listen or try to understand that policy isn't healthy for anyone.

I take it you see that one side of the different reactions to Obama's speech as insane and dangerous..????

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Uhmm, we should all be able to agree that boomerang is one of the more poorly informed and one of the more unhinged posters on here. I remember for quite awhile he was utterly convinced that Obama's published birth certificate was a forgery. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy.

Obama is still convinced there is a $.77 gender wage gap despite all the evidence to contrary. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy either...yet, this clear indication that he's poorly informed doesn't seem to bother you. Imagine that. You can rationalize anything you want in ways that make perfect sense...to you. Flip the logic around and it doesn't seem as sound for some odd reason.

As for what I like about him, his economic policy was pretty good. The US saw a dramatic increase in employment during his tenure, and the US economy substantially outperformed basically all other developed nations in recovering from the crisis.

GDP growth under Obama is the worst under any President since FDR. Granted it was an especially severe recession; however, the recovery has been very, very disappointing. I personally don't believe that he's done anything of significance here to warrant accolades except for the fact that he didn't screw up the recovery.

Comparatively, job growth is also less than stellar during his tenure.

Domestic policy, he has the ACA, which is one of the most valuable pieces of legislation passed in my lifetime. He has Dodd-Frank, and he has a host of smaller ones. Social safety net wise he has been excellent, but his civil liberties stance has been bad.

I like certain aspects of ACA, but believe it was poorly conceived and executed. Dodd-Frank has some issues but overall it's good. Obama's signature education reform 'Race to the Top' has been deemed a failure. I have issues with his immigration policy as well.

Foreign policy is a bit of a mixed bag, as things in the Middle East have gone generally poorly. It's hard to tell how much of that we could control though. One thing we can control was the Iran nuke deal though, which is fantastic. Also, opening up to Cuba was long overdue.

This is where he completely failed in my opinion...from his incredibly naive Reset strategy to the Libya debacle....nothing much here except fail imo.

I think in the end Obama will be judged quite well overall. He's not the second coming of FDR that people were hoping for, but still a good performance.

My main disappointment is his leadership style and how outwardly divisive and combative he has been throughout his presidency (the antithesis of Bill Clinton imo). Quick to point fingers...and slow to take blame...always passing the buck. Fundamentally, I don't trust him. Not a fan.

 

[MongGrel]

Obama is still convinced there is a $.77 gender wage gap despite all the evidence to contrary. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy either...yet, this clear indication that he's poorly informed doesn't seem to bother you. Imagine that. You can rationalize anything you want in ways that make perfect sense...to you. Flip the logic around and it doesn't seem as sound for some odd reason.

So I take if you're better informed and have better access to information in general than the POTUS ?

I kind of stopped reading after that.

You're heading into full derp mode again.

In major ways, not even bothering to respond to the later comments in that post. They do not even warrant one.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

. . . .
My main disappointment is his leadership style and how outwardly divisive and combative he has been throughout his presidency (the antithesis of Bill Clinton imo). Quick to point fingers...and slow to take blame...always passing the buck. Fundamentally, I don't trust him. Not a fan.

This reminds me of the guy in South Park who fell in an ice-crevice to thaw out three years later. The town treated him as "prehistoric."

Here are my memories.

In December, 2008, a chucklehead wrote to the local paper citing a one-day downward blip in the stock-market, saying that "It was Obama's fault." A month or so after the inauguration, a homeless IT tech guy who lost his house told the story of his father, who had lost his job in summer 2008, insisting that "Obama caused me to lose my job." Two months after the inauguration, Boehner stood up, shouting his rhetorical question "Where are the jobs, Mr. President?" In the middle of 2009, six months into the presidency, I encountered a fellow at the grocery store who adamantly but politely insisted to me that "Obama is the worst president -- EVER!" A month or two after the Deepwater Horizon blowout, and before it was capped, Obama was advocating a $20 billion penalty to BP, and Congressman Barton stood up and accused him of "shaking down corporations." And it all just continued from there.

In order for good leadership to be effective, one must have "good followship." A Marine Corps veteran told me that.

The "followship" during the last seven years has been despicable. And I won't forget it anytime soon. Good for the goose? Sauce for this gander! If Trump or Cruz win next November, I'm tempted to refer to them perpetually as "President F***Stick. Reap what ye sow.

 

[Jhhnn]

GDP growth under Obama is the worst under any President since FDR. Granted it was an especially severe recession; however, the recovery has been very, very disappointing. I personally don't believe that he's done anything of significance here to warrant accolades except for the fact that he didn't screw up the recovery.

Yeh, the greatest Republican policy induced financial meltdown since 1929 was an especially severe recession. Not to worry, though, they're still trying to finagle their way out of Dodd-Frank.

And if we'd just been able to Cut! Cut! Cut! govt spending & employment like Repubs want then this would look a whole lot better, right?

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/01/13/yes-he-did/

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

This reminds me of the guy in South Park who fell in an ice-crevice to thaw out three years later. The town treated him as "prehistoric."

Here are my memories.

In December, 2008, a chucklehead wrote to the local paper citing a one-day downward blip in the stock-market, saying that "It was Obama's fault." Two months after the inauguration, Boehner stood up, shouting his rhetorical question "Where are the jobs, Mr. President?" In the middle of 2009, six months into the presidency, I encountered a fellow at the grocery store who adamantly but politely insisted to me that "Obama is the worst president -- EVER!" A month or two after the Deepwater Horizon blowout, and before it was capped, Obama was citing a $20 billion penalty to BP, and Congressman Barton stood up and accused him of "shaking down corporations." And it all just continued from there.

In order for good leadership to be effective, one must have "good followship." A Marine Corps veteran told me that.

The "followship" during the last seven years has been despicable. And I won't forget it anytime soon. Good for the goose? Sauce for this gander!

The presidency isn't meant for sissies who get butt hurt and reactionary over comments from the peanut gallery. Doesn't matter who you are or what party you belong to...you're going to take a lot of shit. It's how you react to it that defines you.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

The presidency isn't meant for sissies who get butt hurt and reactionary over comments from the peanut gallery. Doesn't matter who you are or what party you belong to...you're going to take a lot of shit. It's how you react to it that defines you.

We-ull, Pil-grum! I saw the shit piled high throughout the two terms. And all I see in Obama's public statements are witty retorts of common-sense to the shit-shovelers.

I never heard anything like "Oh, Gee! You folks have been so meee-an to me!"

About the only remark to the unspoken aspect of it, which I heard coming from the Prez in an interview, was an oblique reference to "my particular demographic." And that was pretty much "it" for the first time in almost seven years. I wanted to congratulate him on his choice of words . . . too . . .

 

[fskimospy]

Obama is still convinced there is a $.77 gender wage gap despite all the evidence to contrary. That's not exactly the mark of a sharp guy either...yet, this clear indication that he's poorly informed doesn't seem to bother you. Imagine that. You can rationalize anything you want in ways that make perfect sense...to you. Flip the logic around and it doesn't seem as sound for some odd reason.

Yes, clearly that's the same thing as being a birther and a birth certificate truther. This is dumb and desperate even for you. Why do you bother to defend your village idiots? Birthers are morons. Boomerang is (or at least was) a birther.

GDP growth under Obama is the worst under any President since FDR. Granted it was an especially severe recession; however, the recovery has been very, very disappointing. I personally don't believe that he's done anything of significance here to warrant accolades except for the fact that he didn't screw up the recovery.

Comparatively, job growth is also less than stellar during his tenure.

[/quote]

Comparing current US GDP growth to that of Kennedy, etc is pretty silly. Most economists believe that it would be impossible for us to achieve 4% GDP growth or even much more than 3% on a sustained basis as the US is in an entirely different economic world at this time. Additionally, most reasonable people wouldn't put blame (or credit!) for the economic results of the first few months of their presidency as there's simply no way for policy differences to affect outcomes at that point. If you take away the first 3-4 months of each president's tenure and assign them to the previous president things suddenly look much rosier for Obama both in terms of GDP growth and job growth.

More than anything though I look to the performance of the US as compared to other developed nations going through the same thing. The research pretty clearly shows that recoveries after a financial crisis are much slower than normal recoveries, but the US outperformed pretty much everyone else. That's something we should be proud of.

I like certain aspects of ACA, but believe it was poorly conceived and executed. Dodd-Frank has some issues but overall it's good. Obama's signature education reform 'Race to the Top' has been deemed a failure. I have issues with his immigration policy as well.

Well as we've discussed before, the ACA has exceeded basically every benchmark set for it at the time of its enactment and at a lower cost than estimated. If that's poor conception and execution, give me some more of that.

I'm not a big fan of race to the top myself, although I'm not really sure that it could be considered a failure.

This is where he completely failed in my opinion...from his incredibly naive Reset strategy to the Libya debacle....nothing much here except fail imo.

We're all entitled to our own opinions! If I remember correctly you listed the Iran nuclear deal as a big failure on his part, which is baffling to me.

My main disappointment is his leadership style and how outwardly divisive and combative he has been throughout his presidency (the antithesis of Bill Clinton imo). Quick to point fingers...and slow to take blame...always passing the buck. Fundamentally, I don't trust him. Not a fan.

This seems to be a pretty severely skewed view of how things happened. Obama spent an enormous amount of time and energy in attempts to find common ground and unify policy with Republicans but that was a total failure. I mean look at how much of the stimulus was wasted on ineffective tax cuts in order to appease conservatives. (it of course later came out that Republicans had already decided ahead of his time in office that they would work to uniformly oppose him, but he clearly didn't know it at the time)

He eventually came around and realized that Republicans had no interest in working with him and at that point he definitely adopted a more combative stance, I agree. He would have been a fool not to.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Yeh, the greatest Republican policy induced financial meltdown since 1929 was an especially severe recession. Not to worry, though, they're still trying to finagle their way out of Dodd-Frank.

And if we'd just been able to Cut! Cut! Cut! govt spending & employment like Repubs want then this would look a whole lot better, right?

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/01/13/yes-he-did/

There should be a corollary to Godwin's Law when someone links to a Krugman's blog as if he's the oracle of irrefutable fact.