Obama speaks peace to Muslims

[Mr Pepper]

SourceCNN

Does anyone find his following statement odd:

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation," he said. "It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

SourceWiki

"The American Civil War was the deadliest war in American history, causing 620,000 soldier deaths and an undetermined number of civilian casualties. Its legacy includes ending slavery in the United States, restoring the Union, and strengthening the role of the federal government. The social, political, economic and racial issues of the war decisively shaped the reconstruction era that lasted to 1877, and brought changes that helped make the country a united superpower."


It seems like alot of fluff to me. History has proven that not all differences can be solved over tea and crumpets.

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

 

[Mr Pepper]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

 

[Shuxclams]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
SourceCNN

Does anyone find his following statement odd:

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation," he said. "It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

SourceWiki

"The American Civil War was the deadliest war in American history, causing 620,000 soldier deaths and an undetermined number of civilian casualties. Its legacy includes ending slavery in the United States, restoring the Union, and strengthening the role of the federal government. The social, political, economic and racial issues of the war decisively shaped the reconstruction era that lasted to 1877, and brought changes that helped make the country a united superpower."


It seems like alot of fluff to me. History has proven that not all differences can be solved over tea and crumpets.

I believe that Mr. Obama was referring to the peaceful civil rights movement during the 1960's which help win full citizenship status for African Americans. Also, the Civil War was not just about Slavery.

As for his speech, it's a speech given in front of a tough audience that has been largely ignored or at best given lip service for 8+ years. His words concerning Israel, Palestine, Iran and Islam were a good first step in diplomacy. He kept a promise and I hope he continues to "speak always the truth."


SHUX

 

[Shuxclams]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

 

[Mr Pepper]

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
SourceCNN

Does anyone find his following statement odd:

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation," he said. "It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

SourceWiki

"The American Civil War was the deadliest war in American history, causing 620,000 soldier deaths and an undetermined number of civilian casualties. Its legacy includes ending slavery in the United States, restoring the Union, and strengthening the role of the federal government. The social, political, economic and racial issues of the war decisively shaped the reconstruction era that lasted to 1877, and brought changes that helped make the country a united superpower."


It seems like alot of fluff to me. History has proven that not all differences can be solved over tea and crumpets.

I believe that Mr. Obama was referring to the peaceful civil rights movement during the 1960's which help win full citizenship status for African Americans. Also, the Civil War was not just about Slavery.

As for his speech, it's a speech given in front of a tough audience that has been largely ignored or at best given lip service for 8+ years. His words concerning Israel, Palestine, Iran and Islam were a good first step in diplomacy. He kept a promise and I hope he continues to "speak always the truth."


SHUX

If he is going to "speak always the truth", he is going to need to start getting his historical facts in order. Again, there could not have been a " peaceful civil rights movement" in the 60's (if that's what you want to call it) if slavery had not been abolished before that.

 

[Mr Pepper]

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

And where did these Americans, that peacefully fought for their civil rights in 60's, gain the freedom to do so?

 

[Analogsoul]

The Civil War started mainly as a States right issue, not to end slavery itself. Lincoln freed the slaves under the Emancipation Proclamation a year after the Civil War started. Really the end of slavery is a byproduct of the Civil War, not the cause of it.

 

[MrChad]

Originally posted by: Analogsoul
The Civil War started mainly as a States right issue, not to end slavery itself. Lincoln freed the slaves under the Emancipation Proclamation a year after the Civil War started. Really the end of slavery is a byproduct of the Civil War, not the cause of it.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/2183...mpsons-apu-is-approved

 

[Mr Pepper]

Originally posted by: Analogsoul
The Civil War started mainly as a States right issue, not to end slavery itself. Lincoln freed the slaves under the Emancipation Proclamation a year after the Civil War started. Really the end of slavery is a byproduct of the Civil War, not the cause of it.

Certainly not the sole "cause" of it, but certainly significant and influential on the main issues.

Source

"The root causes of the Civil War can be broken down into States Rights, Slavery, Political and Economic considerations. Slavery, while listed as a separate cause, had significant influence on the other three. An understanding of the above influences of the time will reveal, however, that slavery should not be considered the sole cause of the Civil War."

 

[heyheybooboo]

As a really old guy who grew up in the segregated south, excuse me while I snicker, y'all

 

[Shuxclams]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

And where did these Americans, that peacefully fought for their civil rights in 60's, gain the freedom to do so?

Wow, your really going to ask that in a public forum? Are you that ignorant? You need to learn some history before you go shooting your mouth off, particularly American History.







SHUX

 

[gwlam12]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

And where did these Americans, that peacefully fought for their civil rights in 60's, gain the freedom to do so?

Should we also have him refer to the colonies' uprising against the British? Because if America never became independent, there would be no Civil War. :roll:

 

[Shuxclams]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
As a really old guy who grew up in the segregated south, excuse me while I snicker, y'all

I guess Education in this country is worse then I thought when they teach Ronnie McRegan was the savior of the whole entire universe but can't manage to teach the history of segregation and the civil rights movement....

"The function of education is to teach one to think intensively and to think critically... Intelligence plus character - that is the goal of true education." ~Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

SHUX












SHUX

 

[txrandom]

It wasn't about slavery...we were fighting for our rats.

 

[Andrew1990]

Originally posted by: txrandom
It wasn't about slavery...we were fighting for our rats.

My rat squeky thinks about what those great men did for her freedom back in the day.


Well gents, its time for me to start up the grill, now where did that rat go?

 

[Mr Pepper]

You are more than welcome to take any of my statements out of context to suit your personal needs. Lets solve this peacefully after all.

 

[Moonbeam]

Again we come to the question of whether the evolution of humanity is due to violent struggle or the death of bigotry via conscious evolution. Can we say that the deaths of millions of people causes some minds sometimes to question and grow?

It is not in a quiet medium that the the conscious of sleeping souls is prodded to awaken but often after their own backwardness has cost them a terrible price.

Those who are wise are often those who have known deep pain and found in that pain a sympathy for others who suffer.

Does this mean we must have violence to evolve? No, it means that we must evolve because we are violent.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Does this mean we must have violence to evolve? No, it means that we must evolve because we are violent.

Survival of the fittest is a component of evolution, and violence is one manifestation of survival. Compassion and sympathy are constructs of the human condition that have the potential to either hinder OR forward our evolution as a species.

 

[tfcmasta97]

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

And where did these Americans, that peacefully fought for their civil rights in 60's, gain the freedom to do so?

Thanks for the insignt Mr Pepper.

So i guess those in the middle east may as well set off a few nukes in the US clear out the few hundred mil that are holding down the other 7 billion. I mean, it's not like Obama's trying to make a point for people to be reasonable or anything. So may as well just start a modern clusterfuck war

 

[heyheybooboo]

To bring this disturbing episode to a close ....

All of us share this world for but a brief moment in time. The question is whether we spend that time focused on what pushes us apart, or whether we commit ourselves to an effort ? a sustained effort ? to find common ground, to focus on the future we seek for our children, and to respect the dignity of all human beings.

President Obama
Cairo University
June 4, 2009

 

[OrByte]

nit-picky like a mofo just to criticize Obama while he is actually trying to do some good in the middle east.

will wonders never cease? :roll:

 

[nageov3t]

Obama... Muslim :shocked:

 

[piasabird]

The Civil war was caused by Violent Resistance??? Same goes for the Revolutionary war. I think his speech was an attempt to sue for peace in his own liberal way.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITI...obama.cairo/index.html

This is from the Article:

Quote:
He said that, "The Holy Quran tells us, 'O mankind! We have ... made you into nations and tribes so that you may know one another.' ... The Talmud tells us: 'The whole of the Torah is for the purpose of promoting peace. ...'"

"The Holy Bible tells us, 'Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.' ... The people of the world can live together in peace. We know that is God's vision. Now, that must be our work here on Earth."

Amen, Mr. President.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Arsalan Iftikhar

 

[Mr Pepper]

Originally posted by: tfcmasta97

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: Shuxclams

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Mr Pepper
Seriously? Are we to believe the Civil War never happened?

The Civil War didn't stop the racism, discrimination, nor murder of black people.

Perhaps not, but abolishing slavery was the first step towards tackling those problems. I stand by my original analysis. Obama cited slavery ("lash of the whip"), and that is what the Civil War abolished.

Your original analysis was incorrect. the Statement

"Resistance through violence and killing is wrong, and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation,"

He says for centuries they suffered under slavery - True

He then says "and the humiliation of segregation" - True

"It was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America's founding."

He is speaking directly to the struggle for full and equal rights, which of course was won during the civil rights movement in the 1960's by using peace and non-violence. - True





SHUX

And where did these Americans, that peacefully fought for their civil rights in 60's, gain the freedom to do so?

Thanks for the insignt Mr Pepper.

So i guess those in the middle east may as well set off a few nukes in the US clear out the few hundred mil that are holding down the other 7 billion. I mean, it's not like Obama's trying to make a point for people to be reasonable or anything. So may as well just start a modern clusterfuck war

Yes, what I am suggesting here is that without the fight against the suppression of black American's rights during the Civil War, it would have never been possible for the fight to continue more peacefully for civil rights, later in history.

In other words, the first step to civil freedom was for slaves to be considered humans. And most believe that was worth fighting and dying for.

I hope that cleared up the contextual issues that seemed to come from nowhere in this thread. If not, please continue to derail.