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Obama Care is a disaster

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Charles Kozierok said:
Good, let's see them. Backed up with valid sources.

Then you'll have something.

Until then, this is just propaganda from a right-wing book-huckstering Fox News regular.
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You've got your own forum for all that. The forum where everything is all neat, tidy, orderly and sanitized, where everybody extends their pinkies when they post and farts don't smell. Rule as the overlord in that one and let the rest of us post what we will here.

Micromanaging control freaks. Just can't get enough of that!
 
Charles Kozierok said:
You know, I could go to Media Matters and find articles rebutting her claims. And then if I posted them here, all of you right-wing hacks would... dismiss the messenger.
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Thank you for declaring you're a left-wing hack. Do you feel better now that you have it off your chest? Does it feel good to be "out". Your views aren't righteous and just although I'm certain you feel they are.

If you didn't have your nose buried in HuffPo, DailyKos, Media Matters and all the other prog sites (purely to ensure you have a balanced perspective, I'm sure) you'd know that there are many, many articles saying basically the same thing Betsy McCaughey is saying. It's little more than common sense to everyone that doesn't think like a prog. To insure more people for less cost you have to cut back on the level of care. It's based in math which I know is a dirty word for progs.

Only in progville could the ginormous increase in spending of borrowed funds be a good thing. Fucking children are running our country. Just keep following the pied piper.
 
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Anecdotal stuff, but probably more useful than the garbage biased articles.

- my best friend operates a small civil engineering firm. The penalty to not insure is far cheaper than the cost to insure. And the cost to insure has continued to increase - regardless of pre- or post-Obamacare.


I'm a MD who up until the past week worked in a very depressed inner city setting (~8 years). In addition to the obvious, my bias is the experiences recounted to me by my father, who grew up under socialism in eastern Europe.

- There is far too much administrative overhead in healthcare (HC) - and what will Obamacare do? Increase administration.

- There is a tremendous amount of time and effort spent by those of us who deliver HC to navigate the well-intentioned but ignorant mistakes of people with business degrees.

- I read an article on how California plans to deal with the HC worker shortage by allowing unsupervised nurse practitioners, physician assistants and pharmacists to treat patients. While I think they serve a vital role in HC today, my experience is that they lack the knowledge and (continued) professional investment for this task. Think about what this means for the end-user (you).

- My experience at two different VA hospitals, which are the closest thing we have to socialized HC, is that people will not be happy with socialized HC. Socialized HC contains cost by rationing, despite the euphemisms used by proponents of such.

There's more... ultimately, I would pose questions to the proponents of Obamacare / socialized medicine: Why does the gov't exempt others and themselves from participation if this is such a good program?
 
boomerang said:
You've got your own forum for all that.
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And I've got this forum for responding to propaganda posted by people like you.

Sactoking did a good job of confirming based on his experience with healthcare what I knew was true based on my experience with the author.

This opinion piece is propagandistic nonsense.

The truth hurts. I know. Sorry about that.

boomerang said:
Thank you for declaring you're a left-wing hack.
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I didn't realize I became a "left wing hack" by visiting a website.

Please find a post on this board where I've used Media Matters as source. Go ahead.

The *entire point* of mentioning them is to demonstrate that biased sources are not useful.

boomerang said:
If you didn't have your nose buried in HuffPo, DailyKos, Media Matters and all the other prog sites (purely to ensure you have a balanced perspective, I'm sure) you'd know that there are many, many articles saying basically the same thing Betsy McCaughey is saying.
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All of which are coming from the right-wing sites where your nose is buried.

Perhaps if you tried posting items of value instead of slopping propaganda and then engaging in personal attacks on those who correctly identify it as such, people might actually take you seriously.
 
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MeowKat said:
I worked for the same company for 17 years. If any insurance company tried to increase premiums we would all decide to tolerate it or drop them as a company for someone else. We did well switching companies.

The private market at work. :whiste:
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Who is We? Where I work the owners make the decisions. So when you found cheaper insurance did it offer better benefits? yeah riiiiiiight. :whiste:
 
Charles Kozierok said:
And I've got this forum for responding to propaganda posted by people like you.

Sactoking did a good job of confirming based on his experience with healthcare what I knew was true based on my experience with the author.

This opinion piece is propagandistic nonsense.

The truth hurts. I know. Sorry about that.



I didn't realize I became a "left wing hack" by visiting a website.

Please find a post on this board where I've used Media Matters as source. Go ahead.

The *entire point* of mentioning them is to demonstrate that biased sources are not useful.



All of which are coming from the right-wing sites where your nose is buried.

Perhaps if you tried posting items of value instead of slopping propaganda and then engaging in personal attacks on those who correctly identify it as such, people might actually take you seriously.
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your a left wing hack.

The fact that you were made a moderator is mind blowing.

heres another story about obamacare failing

http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...9d56ac-779c-11e2-8f84-3e4b513b1a13_print.html

Washington post might be too much of a hack newspaper for you. Since the only news you accept is that which agrees with your pov.



Moderator callout.

You may not user a members mod status to make your point.

It has nothing to do with the topic.

This is your only warning on this matter.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
 
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Charles Kozierok said:
Thank you for your opinion. I shall give it all the consideration it deserves based on your posting history.
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I'll raise you your positing history.

At least I wouldn't accept a moderator job of a political forum. But when your a 100% hack, you'll do anything.zz



Moderator callout.

You may not user a members mod status to make your point.

It has nothing to do with the topic.

This is your only warning on this matter.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
 
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michal1980 said:
I'll raise you your positing history.
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I'll put my posting history up against yours any time.

I speak out on a wide variety of subjects, and am routinely accused of being too far left by right-wingers and too far right by left-wingers.

In contrast, contentless bashing of "liberals", Obama and so forth is all you ever post.

Here, I said that I would NOT post something from Media Matters BECAUSE I consider it too biased... and I'm being called a "left wing hack"?

You people are utterly irrational.
 
Angry Irishman said:
You are out of your flippin mind....that is all.
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Obamacare is a corporatist policy written for the benefit of health insurance companies (companies that wouldn't have a reason to exist under a progressive health policy) and to the benefit of the ultra-rich who will not see the tax increases required to move to a single payer system.

Obama is a center-right politician, to the right of Nixon, even to the right of Clinton. The only way to claim Obama is in any way "left" is to compare him to the Republican fascists.
 
IronWing said:
Obamacare is a corporatist policy written for the benefit of health insurance companies (companies that wouldn't have a reason to exist under a progressive health policy) and to the benefit of the ultra-rich who will not see the tax increases required to move to a single payer system.

Obama is a center-right politician, to the right of Nixon, even to the right of Clinton. The only way to claim Obama is in any way "left" is to compare him to the Republican fascists.
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That's something new 🙄
 
IronWing said:
Obamacare is a corporatist policy written for the benefit of health insurance companies (companies that wouldn't have a reason to exist under a progressive health policy) and to the benefit of the ultra-rich who will not see the tax increases required to move to a single payer system.

Obama is a center-right politician, to the right of Nixon, even to the right of Clinton. The only way to claim Obama is in any way "left" is to compare him to the Republican fascists.
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So why don't we cut out all insurance companies and replace them with single payer systems?

Why don't we nationalize grocery stores to "cut out the middleman"?

etc etc...
 
MeowKat said:
I can tell you this, my nephew was denied a job because of Obamacare. My friends who worked where I used to have seen a 300% increase in premiums since this law was passed with sky high deductibles. When I started there in 1991 our monthly premium was $5, YOU READ THAT RIGHT, FIVE DOLLARS AND N0/100 PER MONTH FOR HEALTH INSURANCE!!

Yeah, Obamacare did us all good, didnt it?
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Yeah... 🙄 He is certainly responsible for your nephew not getting a job and your premiums going up since 1991. Thanks for playing!
 
michal1980 said:
your a left wing hack.

The fact that you were made a moderator is mind blowing.
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I'm no left winger and I've debated Charles quite a bit on this forum, and I find him to be overall a reasonable person, if a bit stubborn. I think he'd make a good mod/admin, much better than that pizza guy..

Now back on topic, didn't the CBO release a new report on Obama care a week ago or something:

Link

And isn't the CBO supposedly a nonpartisan source?
 
IronWing said:
Because people are too stupid to vote their self interests.
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Interesting. So now not only do you think we should eliminate health insurance companies, but also auto insurance, life insurance, home insurance, etc.

And I assume you are also down with the nationalizing grocery stores idea since they are just evil middlemen making money off people's need for food.

Thank you for your honesty.
 
Originally Posted by michal1980
I'll raise you your positing history.


Charles Kozierok said:
I'll put my posting history up against yours any time.

I speak out on a wide variety of subjects, and am routinely accused of being too far left by right-wingers and too far right by left-wingers.

In contrast, contentless bashing of "liberals", Obama and so forth is all you ever post.

Here, I said that I would NOT post something from Media Matters BECAUSE I consider it too biased... and I'm being called a "left wing hack"?

You people are utterly irrational.
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Why are you posting in here?

Are you bored in the private club already?
 
michal1980 said:
amazing your a moderator of anything. Maybe the hoffenington post.

But you have the typical liberal mentality; Don't like the message just dismiss the messenger.
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I'm an opinionated bastard, yet I was a forum moderator here and later an admin. I think I can safely say did not abuse my position to squash those with whom I disagreed. If anyone disagrees let him say so.

With that background in mind I can tell you that the mettle of a moderator is tested not by his opinions, but in being able to divorce ones personal perspective from one's actions as a person of authority. When properly viewed, it is not something meant to serve to boost the ego, but stepping up when asked to do so for the benefit of the community as a whole. That does not mean we cannot express our opinions, but that we recognize that we wear two very different hats, and you need to realize it too. Charles and I have had different opinions with frustration sometimes being a result, but that does not disqualify him because of it. If it were otherwise I would say so. Think on that.
 
Originally Posted by michal1980
amazing your a moderator of anything. Maybe the hoffenington post.

But you have the typical liberal mentality; Don't like the message just dismiss the messenger.


Hayabusa Rider said:
I'm an opinionated bastard, yet I was a forum moderator here and later an admin. I think I can safely say did not abuse my position to squash those with whom I disagreed. If anyone disagrees let him say so.

With that background in mind I can tell you that the mettle of a moderator is tested not by his opinions, but in being able to divorce ones personal perspective from one's actions as a person of authority. When properly viewed, it is not something meant to serve to boost the ego, but stepping up when asked to do so for the benefit of the community as a whole. That does not mean we cannot express our opinions, but that we recognize that we wear two very different hats, and you need to realize it too. Charles and I have had different opinions with frustration sometimes being a result, but that does not disqualify him because of it. If it were otherwise I would say so. Think on that.
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Quoted for Bridge Sale contract
 
My appreciation to those who have been supportive.

dmcowen674 said:
Why are you posting in here?
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Why shouldn't I?

You know, you people who are mocking the new forum should be careful what you wish for. That new forum is allowing you to continue to use this one as a pig sty. The alternative was to reimpose order on P&N, and many of you would probably not have lasted very long.
 
dmcowen674 said:
Originally Posted by michal1980
amazing your a moderator of anything. Maybe the hoffenington post.

But you have the typical liberal mentality; Don't like the message just dismiss the messenger.




Quoted for Bridge Sale contract
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Did I ever abuse my authority that you could point to? What can you recall of my punishing you?
 
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