this brings up something i've been wondering,
why is it class warfare when you raise taxes on the rich, but not when you cut them.
http://www.barackobama.com/taxes/
Obama?s plan will cut taxes overall, reducing revenues to below the levels that prevailed under Ronald Reagan (less than 18.2 percent of GDP).
Hmm....
As chess stated Obama is taking a huge political gamble with the bailouts....and like any big gamble or hail mary it will either pay off or burn him pretty bad.
However with his popularity...he is pandering to those who have not, especially with the freebies and handouts...last I checked the people who produce are in the vast minority compared to those who leech off the system, thus his approval ratings will always be pretty wonderful so long as people believe he is really trying to help them out.
However with his popularity...he is pandering to those who have not, especially with the freebies and handouts...last I checked the people who produce are in the vast minority compared to those who leech off the system, thus his approval ratings will always be pretty wonderful so long as people believe he is really trying to help them out.
Zebo
Elite Member
- Jul 29, 2001
- 39,398
- 19
- 81
Obama is bought and paid for by corporate elite. Instead of letting those losers and crooksters fail, as they should, he is rewarding their malfeasance. In the mean time hurting mom's and dad's accross this land, who really drive economies since it's demand not supply that pads the tops bottom line, are not getting any help. Worst way possible to spend limited resources/stimulus and he's doing it. I guarantee this economy will get worser and worser because of that and a couple other sundry issues like rewarding the very bottom deadbeats who do nothing.
Way to go out on a limb. Might as well have just yelled "It will either get worse, or it will get better." :roll:
You say bailing out the big companies hurts regular moms and dads that 'drive the economy,' and yet you're forgetting the MILLIONS OF PEOPLE THAT WOULD GET LAID OFF IF THOSE COMPANIES WENT UNDER.
Guess they'll get what is coming to them, huh? Cause it is definitely their fault that the company was in the red...
shira
Diamond Member
- Jan 12, 2005
- 9,500
- 6
- 81
Where do you get the gigantic ego to claim the Rs know what's "right" to do? And with no doubts either, right? You're Mr. Certainty. Wow.
Here's a clue to the clueless: NO ONE knows what's the "right thing to do." Everyone is guessing. It looks like the Obama Administration (and a majority of economists I might add) are guessing the opposite of what you and yours are guessing.
But instead of saying, "I think they're dead wrong, but I hope to God I'm the one who's wrong and the country ends up in a better place," you're nothing but a tiresome, negative, tape recording who apparently WANTs Obama to fail.
Could you be wroing? Answer the question: COULD YOU BE WRONG?
I know damn well I could be, but it's apparently not in your vocabulary.
shira
Diamond Member
- Jan 12, 2005
- 9,500
- 6
- 81
Eskimo, you fail to understand that any positive things that happened to the economy subsequent to FDR's (and, by extension, Obama's) policies were (by right-wing definition) not DUE to FDR's policies but DESPITE them.
You see, if Obama gets everything he asks for and the economy is back on track by the end of, say, 2010, Spidey and ProfJohn will claim the recovery had nothing to do with Obama's policies.
That's the kind of intellectual honesty you're dealing with with these sorts of ideological madmen.
PJ's favorite tactic of many, the big lie, repeat the lie oftn enough and some might fall for it.
shira
Diamond Member
- Jan 12, 2005
- 9,500
- 6
- 81
Please show us the multiple economic charts and graphs you maintain that isolate out the huge negative"coporate elite" and "bottom deadbeats" effects from the 18 billion other factors driving the U.S. economy. Please also provide us with the latest edition of the "moms and dads across the land" chart, which links the fate of mom and dad to those nefarious elites and deadbeats. You obviously have some marvelous tools at your disposal.
There's a right way and a wrong way to deal with the problems of the corporatocracy.
Sometimes it's needed to not just destroy what's there, but to reform things more construvtively.
While I"m certainly suspicious that the sort of reforms I'd like to see are not on Obama's plan, I think it's way too early to call him a 'corporate sellout'.
Causing a massive exonomic crash probably wouldn't help the situation.
Paul Krugman, for example, is no corporate sellout, and he's out supporting the bailout plan and budget Obama had put out, even with minor concerns.
This. The ongoing Spidey and Contard Hypocrisy & Fail. As an example ...
Rep. Sue Myrick [Republican, NC-9] votes against every omnibus spending bill while railing against earmarks. She totaled $21 million in earmarks for FY 2008. Fast forward to 2009 ...
Myrick asks for money, then opposes bill
Thursday, Feb. 26, 2009
Another $20+ million for FY 2009 ... her comment ??
Give it two years and several trillion in deficits with little to show for it. Right now the honeymoon is still on.
How can you be so confident that the stimulus will fail? Will you be the first in line to eat crow if the stimulus package does in fact perk the economy up? Are you willing to load a .38 with a single bullet, roll the barrel and put it to your head? That's what the Republicans have done.
And why do the Republicans care about deficits all of a sudden? When it was their boys Reagan and GWB piling it on, they bent over backwards to approve the budgets. Is it because the money went to the military and weapons makers instead of to healthcare and education? I'm trying to see the logic and I can't. It just stinks of pure hypocrisy.
StageLeft
No Lifer
- Sep 29, 2000
- 70,150
- 5
- 0
There is a bit of a backlash among Obama fans right now. When people condemned Bush the strawman from Republicans would be "Yeah Bush is to blame for EVERYTHING, right?!". Now we're seeing it a bit with dems. The argument will not have much lasting power unless Obama can help guide this country out of a recession. His approval numbers in 12 months will be more interesting than these.
I am not as irrational as most liberals. When I am wrong, i dont load a gun and pull the trigger.
I obviously cant see the future but answer this question for me. If the economy grows at a healthy rate in the next 24 months at say 3.5-4% what do you think those trillions we are pumping into the economy are going to do?
As for the deficit spending under Bush. I wasnt happy about it but at least it was 2-3% of GDP which makes it somewhat manageable. Though I would have prefered he run a balanced budget and felt he could have if he didnt venture into idiotic social programs like the prescription drug benefit. Speaking of which was one of the biggest spending increases under his reign of power and wasnt military spending. Look back at Bush and you will find of the 1.2 trillion increase in the federal budget a lot of it wasnt strictly military. The military budget was ballooned by the Iraq and Afghanistan war. Not a permenant increase like his social programs.
Obama is projecting a deficit in his first budget upto as much as Bill Clintons last budget 8 years ago. That should scare even the most liberal of liberals. That kind of deficit spending is simply not sustainable in any shape or form.
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