No outrage here..... just slight disappointment.
At the end of the day, I agree with about 85% of what Obama has done so far. That's fine by me, because despite what the OP thinks, most Obama supporters aren't naive enough to retract their support based on one or two policy disagreements.
That's the thing. Obama now has access to this privileged information and is having a "oh shit! Bush was right!"
This is the moment! The moment BB's eyes were opened. This is the moment!
frostedflakes
Diamond Member
- Mar 1, 2005
- 7,925
- 1
- 81
True, it's not like the writing wasn't on the wall. I was hoping he might come around, though.
Surely the courts will eventually put a stop to this, though. I mean to me this seems blatantly unconstitutional, I don't know how they could possibly rule in favor of it.
If you hated it under Bush man up and hate it under Obama. I know you guys can do it. I still hate it, sadly that and a dollar will get you a Jr. Bacon Cheese Burger at Wendys.
OrByte
Diamond Member
- Jul 21, 2000
- 9,303
- 144
- 106
Like another poster said earlier. The horse has left the barn now.
Power grabs like this are contagious...it was the threat all along. Any sitting president will seek to maintain administrative power rather than relinquish it.
Whether D or R. Same goes for the next President.
TastesLikeChicken
Lifer
- Sep 12, 2004
- 16,852
- 59
- 86
Has anyone considered the possibility that both Bush and Obama, knowing the facts around the wiretap issues, saw/see a need to keep this information as a State secret? Many in here could never begin to comprehend that with Bush in office. Now we have another example. So is this really Obama sliding to the dark side, or just a realization of what is necessary and best for the security of this nation?
ProfJohn
Lifer
- Jul 28, 2006
- 18,161
- 7
- 0
Hey!!! Wait a second...
Obama is expanding the war in Afghanistan.
Obama is NOT ending the war in Iraq.
Obama is NOT ending the wire tap program.
Perhaps this means that Bush WAS right on a lot of these issues. Of course the ideologues and hacks on this board will continue to make up excuses for Obama, but it does seem that Obama is confirming that a lot of what Bush did was necessary.
The day when North Korea launches a missile into South Korea, and as a result Obama decides to invade Thailand.
palehorse
Lifer
- Dec 21, 2005
- 11,521
- 0
- 76
Fixed.
I've known all along that Obama would rightfully continue many of Bush's decent policies.
That said, Bush did make some terrible mistakes during his Presidency... just as Obama has also made some terrible mistakes in his approach to fixing the economy.
It's a f'n rollercoaster man, and we're all just human....
Obama never said he was going to end the war in Afghanistan.
Obama is ending the war in Iraq.
Obama is not ending the wiretap program.
So, Obama is doing two things that most people support, and one bad thing. The left has correctly attacked Obama for his unconstitutional position on the wiretap program. What I find interesting is the fact that the left has clearly and repeatedly attacked Obama for doing things like perpetuating this illegal program, in stark contrast to the slavish devotion to Bush that the right showed. (don't act like they didn't. The right only partially abandoned Bush at the very end, far past when it actually mattered... and even then they didn't) I hate that Obama is doing this, and I think it's terribly wrong.
I find it funny that people think Obama saw an intel briefing and then decided that the way the world works requires him to violate statutory authority and the 4th amendment. More likely than not, Obama is simply unwilling to surrender executive power without a fight. This isn't a huge surprise to me, because nobody surrenders power freely. I fault Congress and the courts for not reigning in the executive branch with Obama the same way I faulted them with not reigning in Bush. In this case, it's not only the wiretaps that are shameful, but the claims of executive exclusivity in terms of state secrets. Both of these need to be abolished by the courts, and the sooner the better.
Bush's wiretapping policies are a blight on America, and it's shameful that Obama has perpetuated them. Other than that, Obama has done a good job... and so it's tough to indict an entire administration over a few policy out of dozens.
The only court ruling to ever rule on the merits said it did. If you really supported the Constitution as you so frequently like to wank about how you do, you would be against it too.
palehorse
Lifer
- Dec 21, 2005
- 11,521
- 0
- 76
That lower court "ruling" was later overturned. There are plenty of junior monkey courts that make unfounded and inaccurate rulings every day, only to be later overturned or dismissed by courts run by folks with a better education and a clue.
The reason I'm not opposed to this particular program is because I've been shown exactly how it works, years ago, and I realized immediately that it does not infringe upon any citizens' rights whatsoever.
The NSA is not listening in on, or recording, your calls. Period.
But hey, believe whatever you wish...
The lower court was overturned on grounds of standing, not on merits. I'm glad that you, with no legal training whatsoever, figured out immediately that it didn't infringe on any rights though. Or did you pass the bar sometime recently and didn't tell anyone?
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