While morality is a purely subjective thing, I'm interested in knowing why you feel homosexuals are "against the natural order of life?" I also want to know how you feel about birth-control. Are you also strongly against birth-control -- which as you know interferes with the natural order of reproduction? What about antibiotics and medications which cure diseases? Are you against that too?
I honestly do not see what the problem is with gay people. The ones I know are very nice and respectful and do not push their beliefs on me. I never met a gay person who pushed to be gay, there's no reason for it. They just found something in the same sex, maybe someone they love. I have no problem with that, and all of the gay people I've met are very nice.
You guys really don't understand it comes down to someone they love. So what they are the same sex, if that makes them happy, fine. Yea, there are gays that show how proud they are with the stickers, flags, etc. but isn't that the same thing is being a Christian with a fish on your car, NRA buffs, all the God bumper stickers? It's in the same area, don't tell me it isn't. Oh, and btw I'd rather have a gay person who is clean and nice rather than some asshole Redneck POS who is racist.
And I'm not gay btw, I'm just trying to show a view point.
You guys really don't understand it comes down to someone they love. So what they are the same sex, if that makes them happy, fine. Yea, there are gays that show how proud they are with the stickers, flags, etc. but isn't that the same thing is being a Christian with a fish on your car, NRA buffs, all the God bumper stickers? It's in the same area, don't tell me it isn't. Oh, and btw I'd rather have a gay person who is clean and nice rather than some asshole Redneck POS who is racist.
And I'm not gay btw, I'm just trying to show a view point.
People have the right to be with whoever the hell they want. Who are we to tell them what to do? If they chose someone of the same sex, then it's their own choice. And who cares if homosexuality is or isn't against the natural order of life? Without happiness, life isn't worth much. And if being with someone of the same sex makes them happy, then good for them. I know from personal experience (after going through depression, for reasons I don't care too discuss) that nothing good can come of others forcing their opinion on you. I honestly feel people should just mind their own buisness and allow people to be with whoever they want.
People have the right to be with whoever the hell they want. Who are we to tell them what to do? If they chose someone of the same sex, then it's their own choice...
so how about this Michael Jackson fellow...
so how about this Michael Jackson fellow...
Oh, very funny, ha, ha (and no, I'm not laughing, since it wasn't )...You're asuming the kid(s) (if he actuly did it) said "Yes Michael, I want to be with you " or "Yes Michael, I want to have sex with you." Which I highly doubt the kid(s) did. And even if they did, I doubt they understood what they were doing. Beside, I was talking about 2 consenting adults. Either way, it's was very inappropriate of you to make that statment. And I have no intention of going near that statment again.
Micheal Jackson:
Innocent untill proven guilty in a court of law
is the law of the land and for just cause.
But can a person get a fair trial in America is another question ?
I think gay can be traced back to cave man days, so it appears to be natural or normal.
I believe there are gay lab rats. What the percentage is I don't know,
but one test showed the percentage increased as the cage got more crouded.
As did the violence and other bad character trates as if situation made the person.
The worse the living conditions, the worse the acts.
Something to consider as our planet gets over crouded with the human population explosion.
I don't know if it's true or not, but AIDs may save the world from over population.
It's certianly doing it's work in some 3rd world countries.
Innocent untill proven guilty in a court of law
is the law of the land and for just cause.
But can a person get a fair trial in America is another question ?
I think gay can be traced back to cave man days, so it appears to be natural or normal.
I believe there are gay lab rats. What the percentage is I don't know,
but one test showed the percentage increased as the cage got more crouded.
As did the violence and other bad character trates as if situation made the person.
The worse the living conditions, the worse the acts.
Something to consider as our planet gets over crouded with the human population explosion.
I don't know if it's true or not, but AIDs may save the world from over population.
It's certianly doing it's work in some 3rd world countries.
Originally posted by: maXroOt
Originally posted by: Genesys
oh really? how about you fill us in on how i have no understanding of the concept. i place 'gender identity disorder' in the same category as ADD/ADHD. its all in your mind and you are capable of fixing it if so desired. someone else brought up gender identity disorder, so save your breath on how it doesnt deal with sexuality, because i dont really care one way or the other.
please explain to me how morality is subjective. its either right or wrong. lying is wrong [look at how you libs attack the President]. murder is wrong. thievery is wrong. homosexuality is wrong. just because you kill someone 'insignificant' or steal a small item does not make it any less wrong than if you killed some one of great power and/or influence or stole something worth a lot of money.
the purpose of a hetero relationship [biologically speaking] is to reproduce. a man gets together with a woman does the freak nasty and they get a kid. 2 guys/gals get together, do the freak nasty and get a sore anus and a 'pleasurable experience'. no reproduction has taken place, and the process of life does not continue.
the purpose of a hetero relationship [religiously speaking] is the same as stated above, but you add in the emotions and support that the partners are supposed to give to one another. however this is not to say that homosexuals are not capable of emotional support to one another. go here for the purpose of marriage according to Islam. also, notice that according to the Bible that God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. this leads you to believe what...? God created man and woman to share sexual relationships, not 2 men to share a sexual relationship. although im not really sure why i always include the religious part into my debate [it obviously fallas upon deaf ears] i went ahead anyway, as always.
umm, sure, ill be against birth control pills. [yes, only pills, preventative measures like condoms/diaphrams are ok because theyre not messing with body chemistry or preventing your body from acting in its normal fashion]
as for medications/antibiotics...no, im not against them. i dont mind eradicating the harmful [insert something about homosexuality being harmful here]
Zebo, i dont need google to tell me how to observe the obvious. tell me how it doesnt violate the natural order of life instead. you obviously know much more about it than i do.
kinda like prisons, no? lots of men crowded together, not a woman in sight, so he gets a little desperate and decides to act.
killing and stealing make me happy. [no, not really, im just presenting an example.] why would you deny my happiness but not a homosexuals.
having a relationship with little boys makes NAMBLA members happy, why would you deny them their happiness?
im sure freedom would make Saddam happy, why not go set him free?
having a loving relationship with sheep makes people from Arkansas happy, why not allow them to marry? [an extreme example i know, but it is pertinent]
how many times do i have to point out how deeply divided this country is over this issue? look at how its splitting the Episcopalean church. look at how you have the religious lining up against this.
as taken from dictionary.com [look up definition of :
morality
# The quality of being in accord with standards of right or good conduct.
# A system of ideas of right and wrong conduct: religious morality; Christian morality.
# Virtuous conduct.
# A rule or lesson in moral conduct
how about you explain to me how homosexualty conforms to ANY of those points. homosexuality is NOT good conduct, nor does it 'agree' with Christianity, nor is it virtouous in ANY way.
no, actually my judgement is borne out of sitting down and thinkin about the issue instead of letting my heart make the judgement for me. thats why liberals are called bleeding hearts.
but since you seem to have the incredible ability to peer into my mind and feelings, why are my judgements based out of fear and ignorance?
Homophobes are, overall, a rather dull lot, mostly folks who've never really examined their own sexuality, who are basically afraid to do so. Afraid that they might have some homoseckshual desires of their own...
So I have some fun with it. The CEO came by the shop for one of his pep talks last week, with his extremely effeminate assistant in tow. Afterwards, one of my coworkers commented about how the guy is an obvious f@ggot, to which I replied "yeh, but I'll bet he gives one helluva BJ." the shock factor set in a little bit , and I added "what? you don't think so? I'll bet he does, why don't you go chat him up, find out?" I may have stripped the poor guy's gears a little bit, but it's all for a good cause.
I know who I am and what turns me on, and men aren't it- hell, a lot of women aren't it, either, but then I've never been afraid of examining my own feelings, either....
So I have some fun with it. The CEO came by the shop for one of his pep talks last week, with his extremely effeminate assistant in tow. Afterwards, one of my coworkers commented about how the guy is an obvious f@ggot, to which I replied "yeh, but I'll bet he gives one helluva BJ." the shock factor set in a little bit , and I added "what? you don't think so? I'll bet he does, why don't you go chat him up, find out?" I may have stripped the poor guy's gears a little bit, but it's all for a good cause.
I know who I am and what turns me on, and men aren't it- hell, a lot of women aren't it, either, but then I've never been afraid of examining my own feelings, either....
Genesys, you really are grasping for straws, aren't you? I mean, after my reply to ReiAyanami one would think you and some of the other homofobes out there would notice I'm talking about 2 consenting adults, and not kids and sheep, as those 2 can't really stop you if you force yourself on them. But feel free to give more ridiculous exemples like the ones you gave me. Although I'll be nice and counter all the exemples with just one statment. "In what way does being gay hurt others, unlike those exemples you gave me?" Others have pointed out time and time again that being gay doesn't hurt anyone else.
As for libs being bleeding hearts. All I can say is, who gives a fvck. I'd prefer to be a lib and a bleeding heart over being a tight a$$ conservative. I know it might come as a surprice to you, but people are capable of using both their heart and mind at the same time, in order to show some compassion without going overboard.
So, I'll end this debate (atlest on my part, since this is going nowere, and neither you or the others are going to change their opinion on the matter) by saying: "What business is it of ours what people (or should I say 2 consenting adults, for those of you who are being anal) do in the privacy of their own home?"
As for libs being bleeding hearts. All I can say is, who gives a fvck. I'd prefer to be a lib and a bleeding heart over being a tight a$$ conservative. I know it might come as a surprice to you, but people are capable of using both their heart and mind at the same time, in order to show some compassion without going overboard.
So, I'll end this debate (atlest on my part, since this is going nowere, and neither you or the others are going to change their opinion on the matter) by saying: "What business is it of ours what people (or should I say 2 consenting adults, for those of you who are being anal) do in the privacy of their own home?"
Have you noticed who criticizes America and George Bush- terrorists, dictators, France, defense lawyers and liberals!
----------------
Yeah, I noticed that but thought you could abreviate with all smart people.
I notice you want to palm off the reason homosexuality isn't wrong on others. That's because your reasons for thinking it's bad are bsed on irrational feelings. You can't say because you haven't any idea. It's only a bigoted feeling.
----------------
Yeah, I noticed that but thought you could abreviate with all smart people.
I notice you want to palm off the reason homosexuality isn't wrong on others. That's because your reasons for thinking it's bad are bsed on irrational feelings. You can't say because you haven't any idea. It's only a bigoted feeling.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
thats your idea of destroying society? that society has to fight bigotry is a descructive force? maybe we should have put down the black civil rights movement, it certainly divided the country. the womens rights movement, most any people who seek to end opression by the majority will divide the country. and for the better. an unjust society deserves no unity.
maybe you should look at some biology books sometime. there is no norm in nature. many female insects kill their mates, many are hermaphrodites and self insemination, detachable peni, etc it gets even weirder.
so you think thats the same as being homosexual? do you really? or is it just a power/domination/release thing? you think these guys would go queer for the rest of their lives even when released? don't be daft.
non consential crimes with victims, and you compare that to homosexuality. you are simply blind to this fundamental difference. its your kind of reasoning that denies all valid differences that lets people get away with dismissing the differences between suicide bombing civilians and measured military actions against terrorists.
standards of good conduct? remember, the standard of good conduct during slavery was to capture and return an escaped slave. basically, it doesn't comform only when morality is defined by YOU. and for arbitary reasons at that, you cannot explain valid reasons why it really hurts others or society.
well considering you completely ignore the AMA, and the american psychiatric association, and other professionals concensus that homosexuality is not harmful, not a mental disorder, and not harmful as parents, when ever more studies show genetic links, and you base your opinoin on your interpretation of a holy book, yes your judgements are based fear and ignorance.
So, a question: If being gay is "unnatural" then wouldn't the fact that someone is gay stop them from spreading their genes and kill it off? It seems to me that only something that occurs naturally is going to keep occuring across all cultures, ethnicities, nations and religions.
The "gay gene," right? ...which is right next to the "fat gene" and around the corner from the "Alcoholic gene" and down the street from the "violent gene" and on top of the "stupid gene" and to the right of the "poor gene."
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
it doesn't have to be a gay gene, conditions during fetal developement and other things can also have a role. http://www.cnn.com/2000/HEALTH/03/29/gay.fingers/
gay people long for their own sex before they have any conception of sex or have been recruited by the world wide homosexual agenda.
just as heteros after the cooties stage find the odd attraction to the opposite sex before they have any clue why, or what to do with it. speaking from personal experience. i just knew i liked girls. i didn't have to be taught or learn it.
gay people long for their own sex before they have any conception of sex or have been recruited by the world wide homosexual agenda.
just as heteros after the cooties stage find the odd attraction to the opposite sex before they have any clue why, or what to do with it. speaking from personal experience. i just knew i liked girls. i didn't have to be taught or learn it.
Homosexuality appears to be a naturally occuring component of the human condition, and has probably been with us as long as we've been a species. It exists in all cultures across time, but some cultures deal with it more constructively. Alexander the Great was clearly gay, and the Cheyenne held effeminate men in some kind of special reverence...
And it's not a black and white phenomenon, either, and stereotypes don't fit. Some cultures accept it to one degree or another, our own has rejected it for centuries, largely because of old testament injunctions. We are taught to disdain homosexuality from a very young age, largely by our parents, who legitimately fear they'll have no grandchildren as a consequence... And that's not necessarily intentional on their part, either...
Gays aren't child molesters, either, although many began active sex lives earlier than their hetero counterparts, simply because there was no fear of pregnancy... or later, because of their own fear and awkwardness with the opposite sex...
And they're mostly just like the rest of us, with that one difference. They go to work, pay their bills, find love if they're lucky, have their own triumphs and defeats, their own fears and insecurities.
They're hated and feared for the same irrational "reasons" we've hated native Americans, Blacks, Hispanics, Irish, Italians, Chinese and Jews- because we can....
And it's not a black and white phenomenon, either, and stereotypes don't fit. Some cultures accept it to one degree or another, our own has rejected it for centuries, largely because of old testament injunctions. We are taught to disdain homosexuality from a very young age, largely by our parents, who legitimately fear they'll have no grandchildren as a consequence... And that's not necessarily intentional on their part, either...
Gays aren't child molesters, either, although many began active sex lives earlier than their hetero counterparts, simply because there was no fear of pregnancy... or later, because of their own fear and awkwardness with the opposite sex...
And they're mostly just like the rest of us, with that one difference. They go to work, pay their bills, find love if they're lucky, have their own triumphs and defeats, their own fears and insecurities.
They're hated and feared for the same irrational "reasons" we've hated native Americans, Blacks, Hispanics, Irish, Italians, Chinese and Jews- because we can....
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