NYPD gets into fist fight with man resisting arrest

[Perknose]

and what is someone who's going camping or works in a warehouse or something supposed to do?

In my experience, which is admittedly anecdotal, the cops haven't been looking to enforce this to the letter of the law in Philly. Iirc, there is an exception when your job legitimately requires such a tool, though.

 

[ElMonoDelMar]

It's a question aimed at those that seem to believe they actually NEED to carry a knife at all times.

Also: what the fuck is your problem?

You've been given several answers for why someone would WANT to carry a pocket knife with them but you can't seem to let go.

 

[Pulsar]

I use it to fix things, remove stuff from my skin, fabricate parts, open packaging... I don't know how anyone can not have a knife. Asking why a knife is useful is like asking why rope, fire, or wire is useful. It's one of the most basic and universal tools you can have.

Don't justify yourself to idiots like this. The whole point is that the government shouldn't be limiting things on a "do you need it" basis. It is the same moronic argument made against guns, suv's, etc.

We don't make laws on a "you don't need it" basis, and engaging people with that mentality just gives their shortsighted viewpoint validity.

 

[Perknose]

We don't make laws on a "you don't need it" basis, and engaging people with that mentality just gives their shortsighted viewpoint validity.

Straw man argument. I'm not posting in support of the full scope of these laws as applied in NYC or Philly. But I do need to point out the fundamental flaw in your argument above.

The basis of the law is not "you don't need it." The basis, whether you buy it or not, is that knives can be used as an offensive weapon, with the exception to their prohibition being for those who have a "legitimate" work need for them.

The "need" part applies to the exception to the law's prohibition, not the prohibition itself. Attacking the law because you think it's basic viewpoint against carrying a knife is "you don't need it" is, therefore, a straw man argument.

Now, watch as subsequent posters attack me for supporting these laws as written and enforced, which I have not. 😉

 

[pauldun170]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...uspect-cop-start-brawling-streets-Harlem.html

The offense (unconcealed knife) seems minor but the law is the law. The suspect resists arrest and pushes the cop away as he tries to cuff him.

The female officer appears to be merely a spectator at this point, offering no help to bring the situation under control.

Dailymail's video seems to skip the beginning of the original video
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f9e_1435807136

 

[waggy]

Jesus christ that lady was beyond worthless.

 

[PingviN]

You've been given several answers for why someone would WANT to carry a pocket knife with them but you can't seem to let go.

Want =! need

 

[jlee]

Straw man argument. I'm not posting in support of the full scope of these laws as applied in NYC or Philly. But I do need to point out the fundamental flaw in your argument above.

The basis of the law is not "you don't need it." The basis, whether you buy it or not, is that knives can be used as an offensive weapon, with the exception to their prohibition being for those who have a "legitimate" work need for them.

The "need" part applies to the exception to the law's prohibition, not the prohibition itself. Attacking the law because you think it's basic viewpoint against carrying a knife is "you don't need it" is, therefore, a straw man argument.

Now, watch as subsequent posters attack me for supporting these laws as written and enforced, which I have not. 😉

IMO it has nothing to do with "knives can be used as an offensive weapon" - because if that was the case, they would (should) be banning fixed-blade knives, which I would argue are better to fight with anyway. As I see it, it's an old law that's being misconstrued to arrest a shit ton of people.

http://www.villagevoice.com/news/so...-anyway-the-answer-might-surprise-you-6661270

 

[Perknose]

IMO it has nothing to do with "knives can be used as an offensive weapon" - because if that was the case, they would (should) be banning fixed-blade knives, which I would argue are better to fight with anyway. As I see it, it's an old law that's being misconstrued to arrest a shit ton of people.

http://www.villagevoice.com/news/so...-anyway-the-answer-might-surprise-you-6661270

They do ban fixed blade knives over 4" in blade length. The under 4" exception is meant to cover those workmen who do have a legitimate work need.

It's a poorly written law, now apparently being enforced in a draconian way.

The (flawed) thinking behind the old law was that a fixed blade under 4" was a reasonable exception, but that no workman needed a folding or spring loaded knife, which could be more easily concealed, for work purposes.

The law has everything to do with their attempt to remove knives as offensive weapons. It just doesn't work very well at all.

 

[TwiceOver]

Cool. One more reason not to live in NY. I'd say 9/10 men over 12 have a folding knife on them here. It's one of the few things I put in my pocket every day.

 

[Gerle]

Want =! need

I need to carry it with me so I don't need to go find it when I want to use it. Time management.

 

[jlee]

They do ban fixed blade knives over 4" in blade length. The under 4" exception is meant to cover those workmen who do have a legitimate work need.

It's a poorly written law, now apparently being enforced in a draconian way.

The (flawed) thinking behind the old law was that a fixed blade under 4" was a reasonable exception, but that no workman needed a folding or spring loaded knife, which could be more easily concealed, for work purposes.

The law has everything to do with their attempt to remove knives as offensive weapons. It just doesn't work very well at all.

Except they don't ban all folding knives. 😉 This is an interesting read.

 

[Darwin333]

Why would you need to always be carrying a knife? I get it if you actually need it professionally, but why would you carry it with it everywhere you go?

Same reason I always carry my wallet with me everywhere I go.

 

[Perknose]

Except they don't ban all folding knives. 😉 This is an interesting read.

Under the current interpretation of that NYC law, they ban almost all of them, including this one from your own link:

The Sheffield utility knife Neal had in his pocket is the kind of thing sold at hardware and sporting-goods stores all over the city. At the time, that model and ones more or less identical to it were stocked at Auto Zone, Pep Boys, Home Depot, Paragon Sports, and several other reputable hardware and outdoor-gear shops in the five boroughs. It's the kind of thing your outdoorsy uncle might carry. Today you can buy one on Amazon for less than 15 bucks.

[...]

Nonetheless, under the department's unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife. It's as if authorities in New York City were using an antiquated law against flintlock muskets to prosecute BB-gun owners.

And the prohibition is as strict as it is all-encompassing. A knife that can be shoehorned into that definition is not only illegal to carry, it's illegal to possess at all, even within one's home. The only narrow exceptions apply to those "actively engaged" in hunting and fishing, and are essentially meaningless in New York City.

 

[Chess]

Why would you need to always be carrying a knife? I get it if you actually need it professionally, but why would you carry it with it everywhere you go?

to shank someone 🙄

 

[Perknose]

Except they don't ban all folding knives. 😉 This is an interesting read.

Under the current interpretation of that NYC law, they ban almost all of them, including the common folding one in your link:

The Sheffield utility knife Neal had in his pocket is the kind of thing sold at hardware and sporting-goods stores all over the city. At the time, that model and ones more or less identical to it were stocked at Auto Zone, Pep Boys, Home Depot, Paragon Sports, and several other reputable hardware and outdoor-gear shops in the five boroughs. It's the kind of thing your outdoorsy uncle might carry. Today you can buy one on Amazon for less than 15 bucks.

[...]

Nonetheless, under the department's unique interpretation of Penal Code 265.01, almost every pocketknife on the market today can be considered a gravity knife. It's as if authorities in New York City were using an antiquated law against flintlock muskets to prosecute BB-gun owners.

And the prohibition is as strict as it is all-encompassing. A knife that can be shoehorned into that definition is not only illegal to carry, it's illegal to possess at all, even within one's home. The only narrow exceptions apply to those "actively engaged" in hunting and fishing, and are essentially meaningless in New York City.

They've taken the outdated term in that law of "gravity knife", and expanded it beyond all recognition to basically include any non fixed-blade knife they want to. 🙁

 

[Darwin333]

I dont argue that a knife is useful, I argue the need to have it with you all the time.

Earlier today I was driving around running errands when I got a call asking if I wanted something my buddy was getting rid of at his camp. I drove straight there and since I had a knife on me I was able to cut the rope and tie down the load in my truck. Last weekend at my daughters softball tournament I had to cut a ton of zip ties. My knife even has a seatbelt cutter and glass breaker on it and while I highly doubt I'll ever need it for that purpose, I haven't yet needed my seatbelt either but I still wear it.

Those are just things/places off the top of my head that I wouldn't have thought I would need to use my knife and it ended up being necessary.

 

[jlee]

Under the current interpretation of that NYC law, they ban almost all of them, including the common folding one in your link:


They've taken the outdated term in that law of "gravity knife", and expanded it beyond all recognition to basically include any non fixed-blade knife they want to. 🙁

Yep, that's exactly the case. Then, tighten the hinge, remove all the oil and dump some sand inside, and it's no longer illegal. It's even worse than 'scary black rifle' laws, IMO, because the same exact knife can become illegal over time as it starts to wear and get loose.

 

[Darwin333]

Under the current interpretation of that NYC law, they ban almost all of them, including this one from your own link:

That is the really fucked up part. If you can buy something that's in the bargain bin in the checkout of pepboys or home depot, MAJOR retailers, any reasonable person assumes that it's a perfectly legal item to own. If it wasn't why haven't the police raided the people selling these illegal products? I find it incredible that case made it all the way through the court system and still they decided it was a crime (at all) punishable by 6 years in prison.

What isn't illegal in NY?

 

[ViperXX]

I carry a Taurus TCP .380 everywhere I go. But when I cross into NY, no wait I don't go to New York so screw their BS laws.