NY State *passes* most restrictive weapons ban ever after being rushed to a vote.

[Brovane]

Actually, from what was posted regarding the new legislation, this doesn't look that bad.



Most of these (other than the 7 cartridge per magazine restriction) seem common sense to me.

Banning the possession of what was legally owned magazines isn't bad?

 

[dmens]

Argumentum ad Hitlerum is always an airtight case.

In further news, Michelle Obama wants us to eat more vegetables. KNOW WHO ATE A LOT OF VEGGIES? DER FUHRER.

Please. Obama uses children as props for emotional value in propaganda, just like Hitler. Feel free to try and come up with another reason.

If it makes you feel any better, Bush did the same thing.

 

[fskimospy]

Please. Obama uses children as props for emotional value in propaganda, just like Hitler. Feel free to try and come up with another reason.

If it makes you feel any better, Bush did the same thing.

So why did you use Hitler and not Bush?

Please, we all know the answer to that. Argumentum ad Hitlerum.

 

[Agent11]

Glad to see there's still some sense in New York: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rRSUEaLKvA&feature=youtube_gdata_player

That was really well said.

 

[dmens]

So why did you use Hitler and not Bush?

Please, we all know the answer to that. Argumentum ad Hitlerum.

Implying Nazi propaganda techniques weren't admired and copied by states all across the world both during and after the Third Reich. But sure, let's not learn from history.

Here, another dictator who loved using children in propaganda:

Argumentum ad Mao?

 

[Moonbeam]

Yeah, you know they should rush through all legislation, allowing only minutes for the delegates to read it and effectively zero debate. I'm sure the people would love that.

Like they love Corvettes.

 

[irishScott]

Implying Nazi propaganda techniques weren't admired and copied by states all across the world both during and after the Third Reich. But sure, let's not learn from history.

Here, another dictator who loved using children in propaganda:

Argumentum ad Mao?

To be fair, it isn't just dictators that do this. "Kissing the baby" has been used by politicians since the dawn of time.

 

[mect]

You're certainly using that as a battering ram without really going into detail about how those laws worked and what the loopholes were.

I suggest that you actually study the loopholes of the laws, and how Australia for instance removed firearms from most people and has not suffered as many mass shootings as the USA.

Australia btw is a frontier country just like the USA, an English settled one at that.

Interesting how you mention Australia. While they may not suffer as many mass shootings, did you look at what happened to the crime rates in Australia since the ban? Studies have produced a bunch of mixed results, with no clear indication that it had any impact whatsoever.

To quote from the conclusion of a study from 2008, "Although gun buybacks appear to be a logical and sensible policy that helps to placate the public’s fears, the evidence so far suggests that in the Australian context, the high expenditure incurred to fund the 1996 gun buyback has not translated into any tangible reductions in terms of firearm deaths."

http://www.ssaa.org.au/capital-news/2008/2008-09-04_melbourne-uni-paper-Aust-gun-buyback.pdf

So if all we care about is people's perception of safety, I suppose its a good idea. On the other hand, I'd rather not waste a bunch of money taking people's property just so that people will enjoy the illusion of being safer.

Now granted, as the study points out, this is just in the context of Australia, but I have yet to see anyone post a significant study demonstrating the success of gun regulations.

 

[Matt1970]

It's really nice to see the Republican party in NY pass legislation responding to the will of the people.

No, they wanted it passed before they heard the will of the people. After reading it people are seeing why it was rushed through and immediately signed.

 

[dmens]

To be fair, it isn't just dictators that do this. "Kissing the baby" has been used by politicians since the dawn of time.

Indeed, that is exactly my point.

 

[micrometers]

Interesting how you mention Australia. While they may not suffer as many mass shootings, did you look at what happened to the crime rates in Australia since the ban? Studies have produced a bunch of mixed results, with no clear indication that it had any impact whatsoever.

To quote from the conclusion of a study from 2008, "Although gun buybacks appear to be a logical and sensible policy that helps to placate the public’s fears, the evidence so far suggests that in the Australian context, the high expenditure incurred to fund the 1996 gun buyback has not translated into any tangible reductions in terms of firearm deaths."

http://www.ssaa.org.au/capital-news/2008/2008-09-04_melbourne-uni-paper-Aust-gun-buyback.pdf

So if all we care about is people's perception of safety, I suppose its a good idea. On the other hand, I'd rather not waste a bunch of money taking people's property just so that people will enjoy the illusion of being safer.

Now granted, as the study points out, this is just in the context of Australia, but I have yet to see anyone post a significant study demonstrating the success of gun regulations.

Mass shootings are enough justification. Like, everyday crime, sure, lots of people will resort to other tools, but these mass shootings target random strangers in public places and are worth extra-ordinary response. To be honest, I don't really care when like, a drug deal goes bad and some guy shoots another guy, or like if two friends get in argument and one kills the other. It's between them, and the guy who gets killed often had some choice in the matter in not associating with the person or not wronging him in some way.

But like, these mass shootings of complete strangers are utterly outrageous.

 

[micrometers]

Banning the possession of what was legally owned magazines isn't bad?

Those are grandfathered in. What is banned is the transfer of those magazines.

That's fair enough. The biggest loophole in the 1994 AWB was that you could still sell stuff made before the ban.

 

[micrometers]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia

I would very much approve of this happening in the USA.

 

[Agent11]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ju4Gla2odw

From our cold dead hands.

 

[Spike]

Those are grandfathered in. What is banned is the transfer of those magazines.

That's fair enough. The biggest loophole in the 1994 AWB was that you could still sell stuff made before the ban.

Actually no, they are not grandfathered in, just the rifles themselves. The new law states that any mags with an over 10 round capacity, even those made before 1994 and currently legal, will now be illegal. Owners have 1 year to turn them in or sell to someone out of state. If they have 10 rounders they need to be converted to 7 rounders.

 

[dmens]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia

I would very much approve of this happening in the USA.

Back up your talk, let's see you take point on a confiscation team.

 

[TallBill]

Which is ironic because it'll never be known that anyone possesses a magazine greater than 10 rounds or has more than 7 rounds in the magazine until someone is already being arrested for a real law.

 

[Matt1970]

Actually no, they are not grandfathered in, just the rifles themselves. The new law states that any mags with an over 10 round capacity, even those made before 1994 and currently legal, will now be illegal. Owners have 1 year to turn them in or sell to someone out of state. If they have 10 rounders they need to be converted to 7 rounders.

This is correct. All of my pistols that take 10+ round magazines are now useless. They don't make 7 round magazines for them. They were all manufactured before 1994 and were grandfathered in under the old NY law, but now they are illegal and I have 1 year to sell them out of state. Hell my 10 shot 22 is now illegal.

 

[Matt1970]

Which is ironic because it'll never be known that anyone possesses a magazine greater than 10 rounds or has more than 7 rounds in the magazine until someone is already being arrested for a real law.

Maybe not. All pistols in NY are registered by make and model number and may only be owned by permit. It's really easy to tell by model number which ones are high capacity.

 

[micrometers]

Back up your talk, let's see you take point on a confiscation team.

I would, if given the chance.

 

[micrometers]

This is correct. All of my pistols that take 10+ round magazines are now useless. They don't make 7 round magazines for them. They were all manufactured before 1994 and were grandfathered in under the old NY law, but now they are illegal and I have 1 year to sell them out of state. Hell my 10 shot 22 is now illegal.

boohoo.

 

[Matt1970]

boohoo.

There ya go asshat, you will be much safer when the guns are out of the hands of the law biding citizens.

 

[micrometers]

Switzerland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland

Conditions under the 1999 Gun Act
To purchase a firearm in a commercial shop, one needs to have a Waffenerwerbsschein (weapon acquisition permit). A permit allows the purchase of three firearms. Everyone over the age of 18 who is not psychiatrically disabled (such as having had a history of endangering his own life or the lives of others) or identified as posing security problems, and who has a clean criminal record (requires a Criminal Records Bureau check) can request such a permit.[9]
To buy a gun from an individual, no permit is needed, but the seller is expected to establish a reasonable certainty that the purchaser will fulfill the above-mentioned conditions (usually done through a Criminal Records Bureau check). The participants in such a transaction are required to prepare a written contract detailing the identities of both vendor and purchaser, the weapon's type, manufacturer, and serial number. The law requires the written contract to be kept for ten years by the buyer and seller. The seller is also required to see some official ID from the purchaser, for such sales are only allowed to Swiss nationals and foreigners with a valid residence permit, with the exception of those foreigners that come from certain countries (Croatia, Bosnia, Macedonia, Turkey, Sri Lanka, Albania, Algeria), to whom such sales are not allowed even if they do have a residence permit. Foreigners without a residence permit must ask for Waffenerwerbsschein (weapon acquisition permit). [10]
After turning 18, any individual can buy singleshot or semiautomatic long arms (breech-loading or muzzle-loading) without a permit (so-called "free arms").[citation needed] Likewise, members of a recognized rifle association do not need a buying permit for purchasing antique repeaters, and hunters do not need one for buying typical hunting rifles.[citation needed]
Basically, the sale of automatic firearms, selective fire weapons and certain accessories such as sound suppressors ("silencers") is forbidden (as is the sale of certain disabled automatic firearms which have been identified as easily restored to fully automatic capability). The purchase of such items is however legal with a special permit issued by cantonal police. The issuance of such a permit requires additional requirements to be met, e.g. the possession of a specific gun locker.[citation needed]
Most types of ammunition are available for commercial sale, including full metal jacket bullet calibres for military-issue weapons; hollow point rounds are only permitted for hunters. Ammunition sales are registered only at the point of sale by recording the buyer's name in a bound book.[citation needed]
[edit]

 

[xj0hnx]

Haha, I love this part:

""Assemblywoman Ellen Jaffee, D-Suffern in Rockland County, said a quick vote was prudent, saying she was concerned that a delay could lead to less stringent regulations.

"I'm concerned that the anti-gun-safety lobbyists would have influence in a way where we would lose the opportunity to move forward with gun safety," she said."

What a wise and beautiful woman. So now they've turned pretty much all guns into "assault weapons" and now this whore is framing people against more useless gun control as "anti-gun safety"? She should be drawn and quartered.

 

[Moonbeam]

This is correct. All of my pistols that take 10+ round magazines are now useless. They don't make 7 round magazines for them. They were all manufactured before 1994 and were grandfathered in under the old NY law, but now they are illegal and I have 1 year to sell them out of state. Hell my 10 shot 22 is now illegal.

Can't some sort of plug be fused in to allow loading only seven rounds?