NVIDIA Pascal Thread

Discussion in 'Nvidia' started by Sweepr, Feb 12, 2016.

  1. Sweepr

    Sweepr Diamond Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    5,151
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    From the other thread:

    GP106
    [​IMG]

    GP104 - ~ 290-300mm²
    GP106 - ~195-205mm²
     
    #1251 Sweepr, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  2. DooKey

    DooKey Golden Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    169
    I'm starting to feel that itch for new shinies. Come to me my precious ones.........AMD or NV.....just give me some new shinies to buy!!
     
  3. Sweepr

    Sweepr Diamond Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    5,151
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    Looks like the fun starts June/July. Exciting times ahead.
     
  4. Sweepr

    Sweepr Diamond Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2006
    Messages:
    5,151
    Likes Received:
    1,123
    #1254 Sweepr, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  5. Adored

    Adored Senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    256
    Likes Received:
    0
    That's identical to GK104's die size, does anyone have the actual measurements of that?
     
  6. MrTeal

    MrTeal Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,595
    Likes Received:
    116
    Wouldn't 2560 CC's make more sense than 3072, given how the cores are arranged in GP100? Granted GP104 might not maintain the same GPC:TPC:SM:CC ratio as GP100, but that does seem likely. GK110 had the same FP32 CUDA Core number per SMX as GK104, just with additional FP64 units. GM204 and GM200 shared the same SMM to CC ratio as well.
     
  7. Kris194

    Kris194 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2016
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't think so, If they will keep 2:4:6 ratio it will be more like

    x80 - 2560 CUDA cores
    x70 - 2304(?) CUDA cores

    To have 3072 cores in GP104, GP104 would have to have 4,8 GPC, it doesn't make any sense.
     
    #1257 Kris194, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  8. Head1985

    Head1985 Golden Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    1,534
    Likes Received:
    262
    I think AMD will win in this generation..vega 11 with HBM2 and 4096Sp will crush this.

    Pascal looks pretty lame
    256bit 8Ghz DDR5 64rops 2560sp is just lame.
    it better have 3072Sp or its crap
     
  9. el etro

    el etro Golden Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2013
    Messages:
    1,581
    Likes Received:
    14
    Good point on Mem chips, they look awesome and will make the PCB smaller. Just wanted to it be GDDR5x, would push the BW of the chips to bigger heights without the need of to use bigger and hungrier buses.
     
  10. jpiniero

    jpiniero Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    Messages:
    5,371
    Likes Received:
    406
    If it's really 300 mm2, then my pricing estimates of $399/$649 are likely too low. Maybe it does have 384-bit memory. This does seem like it could be trouble if it has the same core:SM ratio that GP100 does.
     
  11. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    Its Vega 10 that got 4096SP, not Vega 11.

    Also they may not compete at all.

    Polaris 10 is the first one, and that looks to be 2304ish SP and 256bit GDDR5.

    Unless GP104 pulls a GDDR5X or HBM2. Then nobody with a GTX970/290 and up is going to upgrade this year.
     
  12. Glo.

    Glo. Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2015
    Messages:
    2,535
    Likes Received:
    1,183
    If you are correct, that will mean 2560 GCN4 Core 232 mm2 GPU will compete in performance with 300 mm2 2560 CUDA core GPU and in comparison of clock-to-clock will win.

    But overall, you are correct, it will be that X80 is 2560 CUDA core.
     
  13. MrTeal

    MrTeal Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,595
    Likes Received:
    116
    Source? That's the same number as Fiji, which seems extremely unlikely for the next gen flagship. It also leave very little room between 4096 and the proposed P10 at 2304 SP for Vega 11 to slot in at. Hawaii was 41% larger than Tahiti; Fiji was 41% larger than Hawaii. The gap at the start of GCN was even larger, with Tahiti being 60% more shaders than Pitcairn while Pitcairn was twice as many as Cape Verde. Even if you space the 14nm chips out evenly, that would give V11 1/3rd more shaders than P10 and V10 1/3rd more shaders than V11.
     
  14. Adored

    Adored Senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    256
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nvidia aren't going to build a 300mm2 bandwidth-starved GPU on 16FF+. Either it has a 384-bit bus or 256-bit bus with compression + arch enhancements meaning bandwidth constraints are further lessened. I prefer the latter.

    Don't forget that Samsung's process is denser than TSMC's as well, so AMD's 232mm2 could be closer to Nvidia's 275mm2. AMD also have history of wider buses in smaller area, look at Hawaii and Tonga, however the memory amounts in the leaks don't appear to support a 384-bit bus.
     
    #1264 Adored, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  15. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    http://hexus.net/tech/news/graphics/91592-amd-greenland-vega-10-said-4096-stream-processors/
     
  16. jpiniero

    jpiniero Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    Messages:
    5,371
    Likes Received:
    406
    I suppose one option is that both products are cut so that 8 Ghz GDDR5 would be enough, and then a followup in 2017 would up the core counts and add GDDR5X. Or it's going to be an epic paper launch just to mess with AMD and Polaris but won't actually be really available until September or October.
     
  17. Head1985

    Head1985 Golden Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    1,534
    Likes Received:
    262
    #1267 Head1985, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  18. DooKey

    DooKey Golden Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,424
    Likes Received:
    169
    I hope you're right. Unfortunately we're talking about Glofo executing Samsung tech and they don't have the best reputation for exectution.........
     
  19. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    If Polaris 10 doesn't get GDDR5X, its bottlenecked. Then a 2500-2800sp cut down Vega 11 part is going to be much faster. Not to mention it could have another TMU/ROP layout as well.
     
  20. swilli89

    swilli89 Golden Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,425
    Likes Received:
    835
    You make so many matter of fact statements without knowing so many constants. You don't know Polaris:

    uArch changes
    sp performance changes
    memory compression changes
    clockspeed
    memory speed

    Why don't you let AMD engineers worry about matching up a memory interface with their graphics core?
     
  21. Adored

    Adored Senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    256
    Likes Received:
    0
    Most people would have said the 980 would be totally bottlenecked with bandwidth too but it doesn't appear to be the case. I prefer to compare a Polaris 10 at ~Fury X performance level to the 980 rather than Hawaii.

    Yes it means AMD will need to have made another leap in compression or other architectural advances, but I don't feel it's impossible. I fully expect Nvidia to have made a similar leap if not greater.

    I think we are all going to be surprised as just how far a 256-bit bus can stretch.
     
  22. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    The 980 is bandwidth bottlenecked. ;)

    If you dream of Fury X performance level, then there is a real long way to 512GB/sec. And even Fury X benefits with faster memory. So does Hawaii. And now some 192-224GB/sec bus will be enough?
     
    #1272 ShintaiDK, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  23. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    If it bugs you so much, ignore it. :)
     
  24. Adored

    Adored Senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    256
    Likes Received:
    0
    It might be slightly held back perhaps, but quite far from bottlenecked.

    At TPU the 980 is 19% behind the 980 Ti at 1080p, 24% at 1440p and 27% at 4K - http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GTX_980_Ti_XtremeGaming/23.html

    Memory amount surely counts in favour of the 980 Ti as well in some games. Is the 980 really being badly bottlenecked with its 256-bit bus?
     
    #1274 Adored, Apr 8, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016
  25. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    20,395
    Likes Received:
    128
    I own a GTX980, the answer is yes.