NSA's data mining explained

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: Amplifier

Originally posted by: aswedc
Wiretapping is one thing. This is arguing for the sake of argument. Abraham Lincoln was a worse violator of the Constitution than Dubya will ever be.

Yeah he was.

We can't do anything about what Lincoln did now can we?

how is this arguing for the sake of arguing?

 

[Amplifier]

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: Amplifier

Originally posted by: aswedc
Wiretapping is one thing. This is arguing for the sake of argument. Abraham Lincoln was a worse violator of the Constitution than Dubya will ever be.

Yeah he was.

We can't do anything about what Lincoln did now can we?

I don't think you understand what we're talking about.

 

[flexy]

[

Originally posted by: Amplifier
If you aren't calling terrorists there's nothing to be worried about. But you're worried? I'm starting to think you're a little red and by that I mean you prefer a hammer and sickle to a hamburger.

typical..lolmao

FIRST ..you can get your stinking McD even in MOSCOW.

SECOND...wiretapping and listening/screening in on CITIZENS happened/happens as well in Moscow as HERE.

So..who really cares about that defintion of communism, "being red" etc...etc... are those methods "worse" because they happen(ed) in the soviet union - but here they're ok ? What logic is that...

As in my above posting..the step is not far from classifying everyone with a different opinion as "terrorist" - maybe wait a few years and then, on some forum, some dude goes off against the government in a rather vehement way , maybe overdoes it with word - and might find himself in prison.

So..screw "soviet union" or "communist"...look at your OWN front door first.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: Amplifier

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: Amplifier

Originally posted by: aswedc
Wiretapping is one thing. This is arguing for the sake of argument. Abraham Lincoln was a worse violator of the Constitution than Dubya will ever be.

Yeah he was.

We can't do anything about what Lincoln did now can we?

I don't think you understand what we're talking about.

so explain.

 

[Kaervak]

Originally posted by: OrByte
According to news articles, when Qwest was approached by the NSA to hand over the information, Qwest asked them for a warrant, Qwest also asked for a letter from the AG office stating that the request was in compliance with current law. The NSA could not oblige the request with a warrant or letter. So Qwest didnt give them the info (among other reasons...but I am condensing here..)

here is that article.

If all of this is true, someone needs to ask the government WTF!?

The government following their own laws doesn't matter anymore. It's all for tracking down them terrorists, to hell with due process.

Originally posted by: flexy
As in my above posting..the step is not far from classifying everyone with a different opinion as "terrorist" - maybe wait a few years and then, on some forum, some dude goes off against the government in a rather vehement way , maybe overdoes it with word - and might find himself in prison.

So..screw "soviet union" or "communist"...look at your OWN front door first.

Just when I though no one on this forum gets it.

 

[ValkyrieofHouston]

Originally posted by: OrByte

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage
Unconstitutional, but they do it anyway.. it's sad really.

Supreme Court - 1979. It is constitutional.

The U.S. Supreme Court has drawn a legal line between collecting phone numbers and routing information, and obtaining the content of phone calls. In a ruling in 1979, the court said in Smith v. Maryland that a phone company's installation, at police request, of a device to record numbers dialed at a home did not violate the Fourth Amendment.


"We doubt that people in general entertain any actual expectation of privacy in the numbers they dial," Justice Harry Blackmun wrote. He noted the court had said "a person has no legitimate expectation of privacy in information he voluntarily turns over to third parties."

I don't see anything about data mining in there though.

I don't see anything in the constitution outlawing data mining either.

The data they are collecting (phone numbers) and how they are collecting it (through the phone companies) is perfectly legit per the Supreme Court as long as the content of the calls is not recorded without a warrant.

That isnt true. The data they are collecting still requires legal authority (Warrant), according to news reports the NSA didnt get that authority.

The Supreme Court ruling you are referencing was trumped by the Patriot Act. This is something that even President Bush argued previously while defending allegations of not using FISA courts. It was OK then to ignore previous case law, and now it isnt?

Right... exactly

By the way this was sent out to me and numerous others via email... Could be coming soon to an email to you to soon!
____________________________________________________

WORKING ASSETS ISSUES UPDATE: May 12, 2006

You are receiving this newsletter because you have previously been involved in Working Assets' progresssive activism.
Take Action -- Demand Answers on Illegal Domestic Spying

Tell your Representative in Congress you want some answers -- under oath -- about the telecom companies' cooperation with the NSA's illegal domestic wiretapping program.

Take action now!

Take Action -- Demand Answers on Illegal Domestic Spying

Tell your Representative in Congress you want some answers -- under oath -- about the telecom companies' cooperation with the NSA's illegal domestic wiretapping program.
Act For Change Link

Special Announcement

A Message From Working Assets' President

In light of new revelations about the big telecommunications carriers' handing over domestic calling records to the National Security Agency, I am writing to let you know where Working Assets stands on the NSA's increasingly alarming activities.

Working Assets believes that the warrantless monitoring of phone conversations ordered by the Bush administration is illegal and unacceptable. We also unequivocally oppose the disclosure of domestic calling records to the NSA by our nation's telecommunications providers. As reported yesterday in USA Today1, AT&T, Bell South and Verizon sold customer call records to the NSA. Working Assets would never, under any circumstances, give (let alone sell) records to the Bush administration without a warrant or court order.

In fact, as Working Assets' President, I recently signed on to an amicus brief supporting the ACLU's law suit against the National Security Agency. We are the only telephone company participating in this lawsuit.

Working Assets has never been approached by any government agency seeking our help in illegally accessing the content of conversations by our customers, and we would refuse any such request. We are actively engaged in opposing warrantless monitoring, in pushing for full disclosure by the government regarding the scope of the monitoring, and in protecting citizens from intrusive and illegal exercises of governmental power. Additionally, we are fighting Bush's nomination of General Michael V. Hayden, the architect of the NSA's illegal wiretapping program, to head the CIA.

If you are a member of AT&T (including Cingular and SBC), Bell South or Verizon, your telecom company willingly sold the private telephone records of American citizens to the Bush administration's illegal domestic spying operation. Please contact your provider now, and let them know that this is simply unacceptable.

* Contact AT&T: http://elecvol.electionvolunteers.com/cgi-bin7/DM/y/nm540OFbjb0TKD0BGO40Ep
* Contact Verizon: http://elecvol.electionvolunteers.com/cgi-bin7/DM/y/nm540OFbjb0TKD0BGO50Eq
* Contact BellSouth: http://elecvol.electionvolunteers.com/cgi-bin7/DM/y/nm540OFbjb0TKD0BGO60Er

You can also find out more about Working Assets Wireless and Working Assets Long Distance at http://elecvol.electionvolunteers.com/cgi-bin7/DM/y/nm540OFbjb0TKD0PxF0Er.

You may also be interested in a new book we are publishing, entitled How Would A Patriot Act?, a compelling analysis of how the NSA's wiretapping fits into a larger scheme by the Bush Administration to violate Constitutional restrictions on executive authority in an unprecedented manner. Click here to find out more about the book

As a telecommunications company, it is our special privilege to facilitate communications among our fellow citizens, to enable conversations on matters personal, commercial, social and political. It is therefore our special obligation to oppose warrantless interference into those communications, whatever the government's justification may be. We will keep you posted on new developments as they arise.

Thank you for your ongoing support.

Michael Kieschnick, President
Working Assets


1) USA Today: NSA has massive database of Americans' phone calls