NRA comes out against legislation on ban against bump stocks

[SlowSpyder]

False. Hundreds of people are shot & killed by accidental discharge every year-

http://smartgunlaws.org/gun-deaths-and-injuries-statistics/

I bet the other poster is right. There are a hundred million gun owners, each year some hundreds of accidents that are fatal. I bet when suicide is taking out of the mix you become more safe from having a gun in your home as suicide makes up many times the number of firearms deaths as accidents.

 

[fskimospy]

You're also more likely to die in a car accident if you drive a car. You're more likely to die in a plane crash if you fly on a plane. You're more likely to die from choking if you eat solid foods. You're more likely to die from drowning if you go into a body of water. If you want to live in fear of everything, then just sit in your home all day and never leave, but I'm pretty sure you're more likely to die in a fire if you live inside a man made structure.You're more likely to die from heart disease if you eat unhealthy foods, you're more likely to die from cancer if you smoke tobacco.

This is an irrelevant and irrational point. Since, once again, the point of owning a gun is self defense, if you’re more likely to die if you own one then that’s the end of it. Game, set, match.

The only reason you're more likely to die from a gun if you own one is from suicide. Yet Japan has more suicides than the US and they don't own guns. So that doesn't solve the problem, it's a mental health issue.

As the empirical research shows that most certainly not the only reason, although it is a big one. What the empirical research also shows is that most people who attempt suicide never do it again, which means surviving the single attempt is really important. Guns are a uniquely lethal means of committing suicide so limiting access to them is an excellent way to limit suicides. This is why every single suicide prevention organization talks about this.

It is a mental health issue to limit suicide attempts but it’s also absolutely a gun control issue to make those attempts less deadly.

 

[fskimospy]

I bet the other poster is right. There are a hundred million gun owners, each year some hundreds of accidents that are fatal. I bet when suicide is taking out of the mix you become more safe from having a gun in your home as suicide makes up many times the number of firearms deaths as accidents.

False. Gun ownership increases your risk of death from both suicide AND homicide.

 

[SlowSpyder]

False. Gun ownership increases your risk of death from both suicide AND homicide.

Let me catch you up.

Someone said that the only reason you are LIKELY to die from a gun in your home is suicide.

Jhhnn in his quest to demonize guns said that is false because there are accidental shootings too.

I opined that I bet the other poster is right. The only reason you are LIKELY to die from a gun in your home is suicide. If that is subtracted from the equation, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the statistics showed one to be safer from having a gun... weighing accidental deaths vs. self defense uses. When you include suicides in that argument it becomes a mostly worthless argument, but that statistic would very likely indeed show that guns make you less safe. But, if you never turn it on yourself, a gun probably makes you more safe as accidents are so very trivial statistically alone when weighed against actual defense uses and the number of gun owners / number of guns.

 

[fskimospy]

Let me catch you up.

Someone said that the only reason you are LIKELY to die from a gun in your home is suicide.

Jhhnn in his quest to demonize guns said that is false because there are accidental shootings too.

I opined that I bet the other poster is right. The only reason you are LIKELY to die from a gun in your home is suicide. If that is subtracted from the equation, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the statistics showed one to be safter from having a gun... weighing accidental deaths vs. self defense uses. When you include suicides in that argument it becomes a mostly worthless argument, but that statistic would very likely indeed show that guns make you less safe. But, if you never turn it on yourself, it probably makes you more safe as accidents are so very trivial statistically alone when weighed against actual defense uses and the number of gun owners / number of guns.

Like I said, this is false. Even if you totally remove suicide from the equation (which there would be no reason to do) you are more likely to be killed by someone else as well.

Another interesting point is that when researchers have analyzed ‘defensive gun use’ they have found what people categorize as defensive use to more often than not be crimes in and of themselves.

Let me repeat: if your goal is to make yourself safer the best thing you can do with a gun is throw it in the trash.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Like I said, this is false. Even if you totally remove suicide from the equation (which there would be no reason to do) you are more likely to be killed by someone else as well.

Another interesting point is that when researchers have analyzed ‘defensive gun use’ they have found what people categorize as defensive use to more often than not be crimes in and of themselves.

Let me repeat: if your goal is to make yourself safer the best thing you can do with a gun is throw it in the trash.

So guns in my home are to blame if someone else kills me? This is getting silly.

 

[Puffnstuff]

So guns in my home are to blame if someone else kills me? This is getting silly.

Blame the M&M's with peanuts.😛 The left tries to paint all gun owners as radical hate filled mass shooters but turn a blind eye to abortion related deaths.😵

 

[fskimospy]

So guns in my home are to blame if someone else kills me? This is getting silly.

Where are you getting blame from? It’s just what is. Like living? Probably shouldn’t own a gun.

I don’t know why you think facts are silly, although it does explain why you would cling to your delusions about guns making you safer in the face of evidence.

 

[Thebobo]

So guns in my home are to blame if someone else kills me? This I is getting silly.

Very insightful.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Where are you getting blame from? It’s just what is. Like living? Probably shouldn’t own a gun.

I don’t know why you think facts are silly, although it does explain why you would cling to your delusions about guns making you safer in the face of evidence.

In your estimation, looking at the big picture of all causes of death, how much more likely are you to die from having a gun than not having one (as one giant big nation wide blanket statistic, any way)? What, .0000..1%? It is a meaningless statistic and far too broad.

Can't you start with the atomic bomb analogies again?

 

[fskimospy]

In your estimation, looking at the big picture of all causes of death, how much more likely are you to die from having a gun than not having one (as one giant big nation wide blanket statistic, any way)? What, .0000..1%? It is a meaningless statistic and far too broad.

Can't you start with the atomic bomb analogies again?

You’re trying really hard to find ways to wave away inconvenient facts. Why is it so hard to admit that owning a gun makes you less safe? It’s what the facts say.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

So guns in my home are to blame if someone else kills me? This is getting silly.

Yes, you see if you're a gang member and you get drunk and fsked up with your gang buddies and a rival gang from across town drives by your house and riddles it and your fellow gangsters with bullets. It's considered friends and loved ones shooting and killing you, at least by the studies that fskimo is so fond of quoting. Because you KNOW them.

 

[Thebobo]

Yes, you see if you're a gang member and you get drunk and fsked up with your gang buddies and a rival gang from across town drives by your house and riddles it and your fellow gangsters with bullets. It's considered friends and loved ones shooting and killing you, at least by the studies that fskimo is so fond of quoting. Because you KNOW them.

There once was a man from ATOT
whom posted a lot
most of it bullshit
he just wouldn't stop

Facts or reason he did not need
yet none heard his plea
yelling you all are wrong
all but the smartest, me.

Ah but friends this not the end
more time did he spend
telling the world it is wrong
this tale will continue on.

 

[jackstar7]

Blame the M&M's with peanuts.😛 The left tries to paint all gun owners as radical hate filled mass shooters but turn a blind eye to abortion related deaths.😵

Just irrational. As illustrated.

 

[Jhhnn]

Blame the M&M's with peanuts.😛 The left tries to paint all gun owners as radical hate filled mass shooters but turn a blind eye to abortion related deaths.😵

You’re trying really hard to find ways to wave away inconvenient facts. Why is it so hard to admit that owning a gun makes you less safe? It’s what the facts say.

It's a form of truthiness. Owning guns makes him feel safer, so he believes that he is & that's that.

 

[TheVrolok]

It's a form of truthiness. Owning guns makes him feel safer, so he believes that he is & that's that.

I said many posts in many threads ago, he's so blinded by his own emotion, that he thinks he's the one NOT making purely emotional arguments. It's sad, really. All of his posts could be replaced with "Buuuuuttt I liiiiiiiiiikkkkeeee theeemmmmmmmmmmmm!!!!!"

 

[Jhhnn]

Blame the M&M's with peanuts.😛 The left tries to paint all gun owners as radical hate filled mass shooters but turn a blind eye to abortion related deaths.😵

I'll ignore the duh-version & address the second sentence.

I haven't demonized gun owners in general at all. I've owned several in my lifetime, grew up in a hunting family. Hunting is a necessary part of modern wildlife management, as a matter of fact. I still have an interest in firearms, although it's mostly academic now.

Firearms are practical sorts of things. A shooter has to match the caliber & the weapon's features to what they're doing with it. They're specialized to one degree or another & many carry a military heritage. Modern military carbines & 5.56/5.45mm cartridges are highly developed & extremely specialized for combat situations. Even in semi-automatic, the sustainable firepower radically exceeds the needs of hunting or realistic home defense. The cartridge is too big for rabbits & really too small for big game while being excellent for combat. High capacity handguns have the same overkill feature. If you can't defend yourself with the first few rounds then you fail.

Yeh, sure, I know that they're most excellent toys in the hands of enthusiasts. Add a bump stock & a drum magazine for the full effect. I mean, you can really lay down some lead. Woo-hoo!

The same things that make 'em so much fun make them extremely lethal in the hands of thugs everywhere & in the hands of deranged people intent on mass murder. The cost/benefit ratio for society is such that we'd be better off without them on the market.

 

[Youreallretared]

This is an irrelevant and irrational point. Since, once again, the point of owning a gun is self defense, if you’re more likely to die if you own one then that’s the end of it. Game, set, match.



As the empirical research shows that most certainly not the only reason, although it is a big one. What the empirical research also shows is that most people who attempt suicide never do it again, which means surviving the single attempt is really important. Guns are a uniquely lethal means of committing suicide so limiting access to them is an excellent way to limit suicides. This is why every single suicide prevention organization talks about this.

It is a mental health issue to limit suicide attempts but it’s also absolutely a gun control issue to make those attempts less deadly.

You say it's an irrelevant and irrational point, yet you try to say private ownership of Atomic Bombs is the same thing as owning a gun LUL. Ownership of anything increases the chance you'll die by it, quit trying to act like it's special for guns. People use prescription drugs to try and kill themselves too, we should probably take those off the market, fuck the people that use them responsibly.

Keep living in your little bubble where you want to blame an inanimate object and not mental health or just pure evil. I'm sure Stephen Paddock was a great guy and never wanted to shoot hundreds of innocent people, it was that evil death machine that forced him to do it.

You don't care about innocent lives, so don't pretend like you do. You just don't like guns.

 

[JSt0rm]

You say it's an irrelevant and irrational point, yet you try to say private ownership of Atomic Bombs is the same thing as owning a gun LUL. Ownership of anything increases the chance you'll die by it, quit trying to act like it's special for guns. People use prescription drugs to try and kill themselves too, we should probably take those off the market, fuck the people that use them responsibly.

Keep living in your little bubble where you want to blame an inanimate object and not mental health or just pure evil. I'm sure Stephen Paddock was a great guy and never wanted to shoot hundreds of innocent people, it was that evil death machine that forced him to do it.

You don't care about innocent lives, so don't pretend like you do. You just don't like guns.

guns make you less safe. Thats the reality. People who have motorcycles know they dont make them safe yet they do it anyhow. Its ok to do things you enjoy in life that are risky. Just dont pretend.

 

[TheVrolok]

guns make you less safe. Thats the reality. People who have motorcycles know they dont make them safe yet they do it anyhow. Its ok to do things you enjoy in life that are risky. Just dont pretend.

It's funny that the gun worshippers paint the "anti gun" folks with broad strokes suggesting we all want guns banned when in reality many of us enjoy shooting from time to time, and a number of us really just want them to admit exactly what you just said. Just admit it. Unfortunately, they can't.

 

[fskimospy]

You say it's an irrelevant and irrational point, yet you try to say private ownership of Atomic Bombs is the same thing as owning a gun LUL.

Did you seriously not understand why atomic bombs are relevant? It showed that you didn’t even accept the logical conclusion of your ‘guns are just like a screwdriver’ argument.

Ownership of anything increases the chance you'll die by it, quit trying to act like it's special for guns. People use prescription drugs to try and kill themselves too, we should probably take those off the market, fuck the people that use them responsibly.

We regulate prescription drugs for exactly that reason, haha. Regardless, thanks for admitting owning a gun increases your odds of dying. Seems like you have no choice other than to accept that owning a gun for protection is stupid then. We are making progress!

Keep living in your little bubble where you want to blame an inanimate object and not mental health or just pure evil. I'm sure Stephen Paddock was a great guy and never wanted to shoot hundreds of innocent people, it was that evil death machine that forced him to do it.

You don't care about innocent lives, so don't pretend like you do. You just don't like guns.

It’s really telling that you assume everyone is as irrational as you are. If guns actually made people safer I would have no problem with them. Unfortunately that’s not reality.

All this lashing out and trying to impugn the motives of other people just comes because you know you can’t argue the merits.

 

[Youreallretared]

Did you seriously not understand why atomic bombs are relevant? It showed that you didn’t even accept the logical conclusion of your ‘guns are just like a screwdriver’ argument.




We regulate prescription drugs for exactly that reason, haha. Regardless, thanks for admitting owning a gun increases your odds of dying. Seems like you have no choice other than to accept that owning a gun for protection is stupid then. We are making progress!



It’s really telling that you assume everyone is as irrational as you are. If guns actually made people safer I would have no problem with them. Unfortunately that’s not reality.

All this lashing out and trying to impugn the motives of other people just comes because you know you can’t argue the merits.

Good thing it's not required for you to own a gun then, just don't get one and you'll be safe. Guns don't make people safe, then let's see the disarming of law enforcement as well, they're here to protect and serve the community, they can't protect us with their dangerous guns.

 

[Youreallretared]

guns make you less safe. Thats the reality. People who have motorcycles know they dont make them safe yet they do it anyhow. Its ok to do things you enjoy in life that are risky. Just dont pretend.

When you stop pretending that guns are the root cause of violence, I'll stop pretending that they make people safe. Violence occurs regardless of what's available at hand.

 

[JSt0rm]

When you stop pretending that guns are the root cause of violence, I'll stop pretending that they make people safe. Violence occurs regardless of what's available at hand.

lol. You dumb af.

 

[Youreallretared]

lol. You dumb af.

No argument so you call me dumb.