Note to Theater Owners

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waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
Originally posted by: electricJ
Originally posted by: waggy
its really no surprise they are losing money.

1)crowded theaters
2)rude people in theater (cell phones, baby's, kids etc)
3)dirty floors etc.
4)$7.50 a ticket here. and outrageous prices on drinks (which i never buy)

add the fact that a NEW DVD is $15 and more people are buying home theaters its not a surprise.


I only go see in the theater if it something i really want to see. last movie i went to see was the new batman. Everything else looked OK but not good enough to put up with all the crap. I can wait until its on DVD and either rent (netflix) or buy it.

Along with the the quality of movies that have been coming out, I truly think that is a HUGE part of it. Just imagine in a few years when HD-DVD/Blu-ray (whichever makes it to the top) is dominating the scene. Movies on either format on decent equipment should look just as good as the theater display assuming the the film has been mastered well. Plus, equipment will become lower and price and better in picture quality.

Also, do they not consider the slowdown of the economy of the past 5 years? I know I've had to cut back on movie-going just for that fact... especially with the recent increases in the cost to heat a home.



oh yeah i forgot that most movies out suck and you have 30 minutes of commercials BEFORE the darn movie. I do not mind pre-views of upcoming movies but when there is around 30 minutes of commercials then 10 minutes of pre-views it gets annoying.

I'm getting tired of seeing sequels and re-makes. i have seen KingKong on 2 different versions. I do not want to see a 3rd. I also do not want to see Big Momma 2 (only movie i could think of off the top of my head hah) or Cinderella 6.

come up with something good and maybe i will blow the money on the movie. IF it sucks don't expect me to spend my money and waste my time.


edit: for some reason it posted it during typing. ahh!
 

electricJ

Senior member
Apr 10, 2004
386
0
0
Originally posted by: Vic
For first-run movies, the theater owners don't set the ticket prices, the movie distributors do. The distributors also get up to 100% of the box office for the first few weeks, depending on the popularity of the particular movie. The theaters make almost all their revenue at the concessions.

And thats exactly why they will need to change the way this business is done in order to survive (unless of course they start coming out with movies that are exceptionally good all the time).
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,066
4,712
126
Originally posted by: Metron
Declining Attendance and Revenues documented here... :p

The industry is in severe trouble, I'm just making a suggestion. No need to be a jerk about it Dullard.
Unfortunately, that has nothing to do with what I asked. I wasn't intending to be a jerk. But I see this argument everyday. "If company X only lowered prices, they'd be so much better off." Well, the fact is in half the region that argument is true. In half, it is false. Small companies may have no clue what region they are in even though it is simple to test. Big companies, like the movie studios, pay people big bucks to make certain they are near the optimial point. I have no reason to assume otherwise unless you give real proof. So I was just snapping at the vastly overstated logic that is not backed up with data.
 
Aug 23, 2000
15,509
1
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More people might be inclined to spend $10 a ticket if the movies were any good, but they all suck. I saw one, count it ONE movie in the theatres last year.
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
26,271
7
81
Most people are overlooking the fact that recently released movies suck.
 

badmouse

Platinum Member
Dec 3, 2003
2,862
2
0
I started working in the Movie Theater biz back in 1971. I figured it was a temporary job, because video projection and stuff like that was going to put all the technical people out of business. Still waiting . . .

Some basics of the business: the theater does indeed make its profit on the concessions.

Also remember, this is a CASH business. As the IRS knows well, any time you have large amounts of cash, you "might" be having a large amount of that cash "disappearing". That cash is definately going somewhere . . .

Interesting fact: when i was still in the business, the last show on Friday Night was generally considered to belong to the staff. That is, all the money that came in got kept by the staff, making up for those low wages. Theater management & distributors expected it. Also, in my day, NO ONE was ever arrested for stealing. Fired, maybe - unless they started sharing the swag. If you were, say, a cashier or you sold concessions, and you knew you would be quitting soon, you automatically started pocketing every bit of $$$ that was anywhere near you. Unless you were really clueless and didn't know that everybody else was doing it. Things may have changed (but I doubt it).

I go to the movies a lot, because I like to. I don't buy stuff - if you like movie theater popcorn, try making it at home with Coconut Oil - awesome. I know how to bring in my own food, anywhere. I hate commercials. I love previews. I'm really nasty to people with cell phones, or talkers. I have no problem moving LOUDLY to another seat if people annoy me. Then again, I'm really used to theaters.

And I still have an incredible urge to chew gum and throw it on the floor or stick it to my seat. But I don't do it.



 

DaWhim

Lifer
Feb 3, 2003
12,985
1
81
Originally posted by: dullard
ECON 101:

Everyone get out a piece of paper to draw a graph of ticket price on the x-axis and revenue on the y-axis.
[*]At $0/ticket, the theater has $0 revenue. Put a dot at the graph origin.
[*]At $1000/ticket, the theater has $0 revenue, no one will pay that when they can rent a movie or go elsewhere. Put a dot at that point.
[*]Put a dot anwhere between $0 and $1000 and in positive revenue. I'll let you choose where to do it.
[*]Connect the dots with a smooth line. It'll look somewhat like an upside down "u".
[*]Look at the graph. Near $1000, revenue goes up by LOWERING ticket prices!
[*]But look again, near $0, revene goes up by RAISING ticket prices!

Hmm, Metron, do you have actual economic data showing which region are we in? If not, shut up until you do.

you forget to mention marginal diminish of return.
 

mindmaniac

Senior member
Dec 30, 2003
915
1
81
Originally posted by: JS80
Most people are overlooking the fact that recently released movies suck.

That is probably the best explanation of recent trends. Even if ticket prices were $2.00 I still wouldn't pay to see the Dukes of Hazard or any of the other crappy remakes they are coming out with (King Kong not included). But seriously, new books are being written but the film industry acts like there are no new ideas out at all. People saying that renting and home theater use is one reason for declining theater business are overlooking the fact that the majority are probably watching old movies that weren't crap other than the 3-4 movies a year worth investing your time into.
 

mrchan

Diamond Member
May 18, 2000
3,123
0
0
Theaters make their money from concessions, not movie tickets. Especially movies that are just released, a large percentage of movie ticket profits go to the movie and a small amount to the theater. That percentage changes as the movie has been out longer.

They probably figure the people that won't shell out $10 for a ticket, aren't going to be buying concessions and thus don't really want them in the theater.
 

miri

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2003
3,679
0
76
Dont blame the theater owners, they barely get anything off the ticket sales. The movie companies themselves are the reason why the ticket prices are so high.

You need to take econ 101, if they lowered their ticket prices, it would probably mean the theater owners subsidizing the cost of the tickets.
 

dwcal

Senior member
Jul 21, 2004
765
0
0
Originally posted by: waggy

oh yeah i forgot that most movies out suck and you have 30 minutes of commercials BEFORE the darn movie. I do not mind pre-views of upcoming movies but when there is around 30 minutes of commercials then 10 minutes of pre-views it gets annoying.

Yeah, those are my biggest annoyances. I only get 20 minutes of commercials and trailers before the movie. Trailers are fun, but commercials are annoying when you've already paid almost $10 for the movie.

And about movies that suck. It used to be that you could get a decent first weekend box office on a bad movie by advertising the hell out of it, but word of mouth travels too fast these days to get away with that (you can text "this sucks" to your friends while you're still in the movie).
 

Metron

Golden Member
Oct 16, 2003
1,163
0
0
Originally posted by: dullard
Originally posted by: Metron
Declining Attendance and Revenues documented here... :p

The industry is in severe trouble, I'm just making a suggestion. No need to be a jerk about it Dullard.
Unfortunately, that has nothing to do with what I asked. I wasn't intending to be a jerk. But I see this argument everyday. "If company X only lowered prices, they'd be so much better off." Well, the fact is in half the region that argument is true. In half, it is false. Small companies may have no clue what region they are in even though it is simple to test. Big companies, like the movie studios, pay people big bucks to make certain they are near the optimial point. I have no reason to assume otherwise unless you give real proof. So I was just snapping at the vastly overstated logic that is not backed up with data.


Unlike most people here, I don't make contentions without evidence to support them.

From previously cited website(which you obviously failed to read):

After a period of continuous growth, domestic box office receipts are expected to decline significantly in 2005 for the first time in a decade. While theaters boast high figures for admissions and concessions revenue per patron, increasing prices can no longer prop up the pronounced decline in admissions. The only sign of growth in the theatrical exhibition industry comes from the new market for digital cinema advertising.
The three-year negative trend in movie attendance can be attributed to both a saturation of celebrity-based marketing in mass media and an increased level of competition from home entertainment alternatives. As consumer attentions are splintered among myriad cable and internet offerings, marketers find it more difficult to convince consumers of a new release?s significance. Combined with home theater systems achieving ever higher standards of visual and audio quality, consumers are more apt to stay at home with a DVD or cable offering rather than chancing a trip to the theaters. A mere 14% of survey respondents agree that going to the movies is still a good value for the price.

Having emerged from the bankruptcies of the late 1990s with healthy financials, theaters now face the challenge of persuading consumers to return to the movie going tradition. Ever increasing entertainment alternatives, along with a projected demographic shift toward older age groups, will force theaters to rethink pricing practices and grow the market by recapturing older consumers. If the theatrical exhibition industry is to advance, the movie going experience must evolve to offer a stronger value proposition beyond the content of the movie itself. If the experience is limited to viewing of the movie on a large screen, growth will be impeded by the increased quality and choice in home based entertainment.

For the purposes of this report, Mintel concentrates on commercial cinema venues. Festivals, army bases, schools, museums, libraries, prisons, airlines, restaurants, cafés and other venues which license film prints and videos for profit are not included; only sites whose primary day-to-day function is the commercial display of cinema are considered.

Companies who own, lease, manage, or operate facilities for the day-to-day commercial display of films are the subject of this report, and will be referred to as theaters, exhibitors, or cinema operators. Companies that distribute and/or produce films are not the subject of this report, and will be referred to as ?film distributors.?


The above source is MarketResearch.com... the full report of their data points is $3,000. Given that they are a professional market research firm, I'm sure they have all the data points you need. :p

Cliff's:
A mere 14% of survey respondents agree that going to the movies is still a good value for the price.

increasing prices can no longer prop up the pronounced decline in admissions

will force theaters to rethink pricing practices

So if increasing prices won't sustain their revenue, and the report suggests they need to rethink pricing practices... it would seem the only alternative is to LOWER prices.
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,066
4,712
126
Originally posted by: Metron
Unlike most people here, I don't make contentions without evidence to support them.

From previously cited website(which you obviously failed to read):
And yet none of that is any evidence related to what I asked about. Give me a number. A number showing that tickets sold will increase revenue more than prices decrease hurts revenue when you decrease prices. Those are all valid points, just they don't address my post.

You are correct, I did not pay $2995 to read that. I only read the abstract.
 

FoBoT

No Lifer
Apr 30, 2001
63,084
15
81
fobot.com
price has no bearing on my movie attendance
although i prefer to go to the $2 movie over the full price one
 

ntdz

Diamond Member
Aug 5, 2004
6,989
0
0
Originally posted by: Metron
One way to increase demand (and ultimately revenue) is to lower prices.

I have a price sensitivity at the $10 price point. Back when tickets were under $5, I was much more willing to spend my money and time going to a movie. Now that tickets are almost $10 each, I'd rather buy the DVD and watch it at home.

Actually, you should retake Econ 101. Decreasing price only increases quantity demanded, not demand ;)
 

Lyfer

Diamond Member
May 28, 2003
5,842
2
81
Guys there's something that you guys are missing and might shock you:

Theater's are here to make $$$$, not to entertain people at an affordable price, (heck WTF would they want to do that?).


If I was in there same situation I would gauge every single cent I can to make a profit.:D
 

FeuerFrei

Diamond Member
Mar 30, 2005
9,144
929
126
I'm thinking the internet might have something to do with declining ticket sales. Word of mouth spreads a lot faster these days. Lots of online critics sharing their opinions with a national audience via websites. People can research movie reviews online before deciding to go. With reviews so readily available people can be more discriminating in their movie viewing. They probably don't view as many movies as they did in the pre-internet era because they know in advance if they suck or not.
 

saahmed

Golden Member
Oct 5, 2005
1,388
1
0
Only $3.75 between 4 and 6 here:thumbsup:
Evening shows are only $6 with Student ID:)
 

AgaBoogaBoo

Lifer
Feb 16, 2003
26,108
5
81
Above $9 IMO is getting a bit too high, would much rather watch it at home, still need to buy a CC and the surround speakers to fully enjoy it though.
 

Metron

Golden Member
Oct 16, 2003
1,163
0
0
Originally posted by: Lyfer
Guys there's something that you guys are missing and might shock you:

Theater's are here to make $$$$, not to entertain people at an affordable price, (heck WTF would they want to do that?).


If I was in there same situation I would gauge every single cent I can to make a profit.:D

Let me be clear... I'm not trying to deprive the theater owners / film distributors of their profits. They are in rather dire financial straits, given that theater revenues sharply declined in 2005 for the first time in 10 years, and theater attendance has declined for 3 years in a row. As MarketResearch.com points out in the sources previously cited, continuing to raise prices will not sustain revenues and profits in the face of declining attendance.

Eventually you reach a point on the demand curve where you drive customers away with price increases, and my contention is that they have arrived at that point. If they continue to raise prices (or do nothing), they will be losing money (in terms of revenue and profits).

I'll grant that my suggestion to lower prices in order to stimulate demand is a somewhat unusual, but it is possible to lower prices and increase revenue and profits (think of *gasp* Walmart or Costco)... given the proper location on the demand curve (and as dullard points out that's a big assumption on my part).
 

vegetation

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2001
4,270
2
0
The commercials are what kept me off theater properties for good. That'll be the day when I pay money to be spammed.