Couldn't agree more ! I have spent BIG bucks on my 4 AmEx cards over the past 4 years ... but because of all these new developments AmEx is fast losing my business.
I used to use the Private Payments a lot. I consider the Private Payments method to be a LOT MORE HASSLE FREE than 100% fraud protection guarantee. As someone already mentioned, with Private Payments, once a number has been used, I can forget worrying about it being stolen. I could care less if someone tries to use it next, since the charge will automatically be denied. With my real account number, even with 100% fraud protection I have to continually check my statements closely to figure out if all charges were valid. This is the biggest difference to me.
Anyway, I am glad that I recently got my Citibank Illumina card with virtual numbers. I like their system a lot better anyways. A HUGE advantage of Citibank virtual numbers over AmEx Private Payments is that with virtual numbers you can set a $ limit on the transaction ... which is particularly good for paying for small transactions to some really shady place.
Goodbye AmEx ! We had a good ride. Citibank, here I come ...
or maybe they just ran outta #s to use for one time use cards? do u think they recycle #s?
//krunk (^_^x)
I also noticed this change. I sent them an email explaining how unhappy I was about it. They have removed most of the reasons I got the blue card when they came out with it.
I'm going to cash in my reward points and cancel. I might get their blue cash card. 3% cash back sounds pretty good. Over all I'm pissed at Amex though.
I have discover too, I'll have to see if I can find their "private payment" option.
I'm going to cash in my reward points and cancel. I might get their blue cash card. 3% cash back sounds pretty good. Over all I'm pissed at Amex though.
I have discover too, I'll have to see if I can find their "private payment" option.
Okay, I found the Discover Card one time use numbers. While a neat program, the Amex way was much easier and cleaner. It would work with any browser.
Discovers seems to require macro media.
Discovers seems to require macro media.
I think you're either oversimplifying the solution or you don't understand the nature of this board. Many of the deals here involve merchants that fall into this category. The Private Payments numbers provided an extra level of security when jumping on those deals.
And it's not always merchants that seem sketchy on the surface. Do you remember a couple of years ago when Spiegel decided to dishonor a coupon, after it had shipped out an item that tons of people on various deal boards had ordered? They put through a second charge on all those customers' credit cards for the coupon amount. In a situation like that, the fraud isn't as black-and-white as it is in the case of a stolen card number. Now you're getting into a grey area that will probably require you to waste a lot of time with your credit card company proving, over the objections of the vendor, that the second charge should not have been made.
Anyone who used a Private Payments number avoided this problem since the second charge was declined in the first place.
I have had several experiences where vendors attempted to double charge me on things. One was even from Amazon. The reason I found out was I got E-mails from those vendors telling me the charges were declined, but instead of having to waste time with either the vendor or card company each time, I was able to look at the E-mail and simply think, oh well, you shouldn't have tried to do that to begin with.
THAT'S why those single-use numbers are so useful.
AMEX's Private Payments was one of the first (if not the first) of its kind. But I stopped using AMEX's Private Payments when Citibank introduced their Virtual Numbers. Citibank's has more features, and a better Flash interface.
With AMEX Private Payments:
1) I wasn't able to set a spending limit - can not stop overcharging
2) I wasn't able to create a multiple-charge number (with spending limit) for one vendor - Many retailers (Staples, officemax, etc.) when splitting an order into two for various reasons (in-stock items shipping first, some items shipped from different warehouse, etc.) will charge each portion of the order separately. Not allowing multiple charges would cause problems.
3) I wasn't able to set my own expiration date - without ability to create multiple-charge number or expiration date, forget about using a virtual cc number for subscription services.
4) No CVC/CVV number was generated - some retailers ask for this as additional verification.
Hopefully, AMEX is discontinuing Private Payments to roll out a service more comparable to the competition.
With AMEX Private Payments:
1) I wasn't able to set a spending limit - can not stop overcharging
2) I wasn't able to create a multiple-charge number (with spending limit) for one vendor - Many retailers (Staples, officemax, etc.) when splitting an order into two for various reasons (in-stock items shipping first, some items shipped from different warehouse, etc.) will charge each portion of the order separately. Not allowing multiple charges would cause problems.
3) I wasn't able to set my own expiration date - without ability to create multiple-charge number or expiration date, forget about using a virtual cc number for subscription services.
4) No CVC/CVV number was generated - some retailers ask for this as additional verification.
Hopefully, AMEX is discontinuing Private Payments to roll out a service more comparable to the competition.
jrichrds, if possible, could you try to generate a Virtual Number with your citibank card using Mozilla on a non-windows machine (say Linux, BSD or Mac)? I'm leaning towards switching to the Citibank card but I want to first verify that I'll actually be able to use it. Thanks!
While the additional Citibank features are cool and since Amex is killing PPayments, the point is moot anyway, but I wanna' note that #2 and #4 were never an issue for me.
Contrary to some beliefs, multiple charges can be (and are) made against a single Amex PP# (for better or worse). And when I order from ColumbiaHouse or office supply retailers, I haven't ever had a problem when they split the payment into 2 and charge them separately to the same 'single use' number.
And as far as #4, I always just include the CVV# from my plastic Amex card and it works just fine.
Most likely this is a result of a local DFW company. They 'own' the patent to the idea of one time use or virtual credit card numbers. They're currently in negotiations with citibank and if that can't be resolved a cease and desist will be enacted. We actually had the guy who created the company come and speak to us in an IT security class at my school. Interesting idea for a company, but will likely fail. However, he does own the patents to this idea and many others regarding privacy and protecting transactions. I saw them with my own eyes. www.myprivacypolicy.com
Agreed, there customer service has always been good.
But, I may not keep it if I can get private payments elsewhere.
"Buy it Now", "one-click purchase", now private payments. All extorted from general public use by patent holders.
I'm going to patent Engish, $1 Bills, and Toilet Paper. I'll collect a royalty from every one of you.
Bunk!
I hope good CS is not the only thing left at the end of the day. So far, they have taken away BVG and now PP. The next thing can go is their 60-day Return policy. Not good.
I'm a unix admin in the web complex at AXP and I can verify that the PP site isn't generating the kind of traffic needed to keep it alive. Good bad or indifferent, it costs real money to keep this stuff up. AXP has some really sharp bean counters, they could probably tell you exactly how much volume of charge traffic it takes to finance that site and it isn't there. if it was they wouldn't be taking it down. one thing those people can do is run the numbers. AXP Digital Wallet faded away too, same thing. They count carefully before writing off the kind of nut it takes to get stuff like that up and running. An E10K with 64 processors and 40TB of SAN is not something that falls off a tree, and that's just the hardware, the cheap part.
mawg
mawg
Absolute security and identity theft prevention....somebody slick enough to get your number could call your credit card company and get a csr to give additional personal information.
I guess that is why they don't care that I will be canceling my Amex card. The bean counter has already counted on me doing that.
Thanks, wasn't aware of that. I guess you could then say the benefit of Citibank's virtual numbers is that you can select between 'one-time use' and 'multiple charges from same vendor' - I've had a credit card charge denied before when a payment was split into 2 and I used a one-time use number, so I'm pretty sure Citiank means it literally.
I figured that to be the case, but switched to Citibank's virtual numbers before the need came about. But I guess when using a virtual number, it's nice to have a virtual CVV# as well.
You guys shouldn't sweat it too much. For 10 years I have used credit cards (no virtual numbers, etc.) to the tune of $15k-$20k a year. The only time I have found fraudulent activity was when someone physically filched a new card from the mail box. It's not good when you get a $500 bill before you even reicieved the card. It took me about 10 minutes to take care of that. That was pre-activation era so probably not an issue any more. Just be wise in your actions and when it happens, don't panic.
I do stay away from online usage of debit cards. They can assure me that I am protected, but I have this nightmare of finding out I have been had when my rent check bounces or I can't buy groceries. Yikes! Convincing the bank to give money back seems a whole lot scarier than convincing them you don't have to pay the bill.
I do stay away from online usage of debit cards. They can assure me that I am protected, but I have this nightmare of finding out I have been had when my rent check bounces or I can't buy groceries. Yikes! Convincing the bank to give money back seems a whole lot scarier than convincing them you don't have to pay the bill.
I guess it depends on how much experience you have with inconvenience. It seems to me that CitiBank provides the Virtual account feature because their customer service is like an interrogation process. When I lost my wallet and called to cancel I felt like they were putting me on trial for fraud even though I wasn't claiming that any charges had ocurred. They also told me that I would need to submit an affidavit if any fraudulent charges did ocurr, and that I would have to wait for an arbitrator to rule on the validity of the claim. Then of course they launched into their advertising spiel about credit protector blah blah... The other cards in my wallet did little else than ask when I lost it and tell me to get back to them if anything suspicious happened. That, in my book, is inconvenience. If AMEX works the way everyone else has described, I can see why it would be a sufficiently effective replacement with or without virtual account numbers.
Cheers
<Among the other advantages, recurring charges could not be made to your account. Say you want to sign up for a one time deal with a merchant who is known to make recurring charges, like magazines who offer you a cheap starter deal and then hit you for the full rate the next year, you could use Private Payments and know you were safe.>
I had an unusual experience with Private payments this week. In the firm belief that you should never give your CC number online, I always use Private Payments. One of the sites that I was using them on was PayPal. When I placed a transaction, I generated a new number and posted it in my account info at PayPal. Toward the end of each month, I would get a notice from PayPal that my credit card expiration was approaching and asking me to provide another one. I never sent a new number until I was planning to use the account. I sold an item on EBay and offered payPal as a payment option. The buyer selected this as his method of payment. I logged in to my account to have a check sent to me with the same name and address as I have used since the PayPal account was opened. A PayPal notice screen came up stating that my credit card had expired and that I would have to provide another one to verify my mailing address before payment was released to me. I went to AMEX and generated a new number, which I added to my account at paypal. The next screen that came up stated that my PayPal account was CLOSED for using too many CC numbers. It took me three days of phone calls and e-mails to paypal before I finally received an e-mail stating that the payment had been reversed and sent back to my (ex) buyer. No warning. CLOSED. Then they said that if I would fax them a copy of my driver's license, a credit card statement, and my utility bill, they MAY reconsider closing my account. or, if I would provide them access to my bank accounts, they may accept that. RIGHT! They just rooked me out of $75 and told me that there is nothing I could do about it and I would find this reassuring enough to send them all of my personal information and provide them with access to my bank accounts? I don't think so.
After all the preaching about online security from PayPal and telling me to safeguard my account information, my account was closed for doing just that. The ironic part is that, when I logged on to AMEX for the Private Payments number, I saw the notice that the program was ending, even before I received the mailed notice.
I had an unusual experience with Private payments this week. In the firm belief that you should never give your CC number online, I always use Private Payments. One of the sites that I was using them on was PayPal. When I placed a transaction, I generated a new number and posted it in my account info at PayPal. Toward the end of each month, I would get a notice from PayPal that my credit card expiration was approaching and asking me to provide another one. I never sent a new number until I was planning to use the account. I sold an item on EBay and offered payPal as a payment option. The buyer selected this as his method of payment. I logged in to my account to have a check sent to me with the same name and address as I have used since the PayPal account was opened. A PayPal notice screen came up stating that my credit card had expired and that I would have to provide another one to verify my mailing address before payment was released to me. I went to AMEX and generated a new number, which I added to my account at paypal. The next screen that came up stated that my PayPal account was CLOSED for using too many CC numbers. It took me three days of phone calls and e-mails to paypal before I finally received an e-mail stating that the payment had been reversed and sent back to my (ex) buyer. No warning. CLOSED. Then they said that if I would fax them a copy of my driver's license, a credit card statement, and my utility bill, they MAY reconsider closing my account. or, if I would provide them access to my bank accounts, they may accept that. RIGHT! They just rooked me out of $75 and told me that there is nothing I could do about it and I would find this reassuring enough to send them all of my personal information and provide them with access to my bank accounts? I don't think so.
After all the preaching about online security from PayPal and telling me to safeguard my account information, my account was closed for doing just that. The ironic part is that, when I logged on to AMEX for the Private Payments number, I saw the notice that the program was ending, even before I received the mailed notice.
Yeah, and like I said it's "for better or worse".
I remember the first time I saw a 2nd charge on a single 'one-time-use' number and I almost freaked. I thought "what the hell?" because there should only be ONE charge per ONE-time-use number. In the end I realized it was an additional tax charge (or something) that was completely valid. But it still bothered me that my "one time use" number somehow ended up with more than one charge to it. But I'm pretty sure it was only allowed because they were multiple charges made after a single authorization (or something like that).
In the end, I think that the CitiBank setup is probably better, but I'm still ticked that Amex, which has been my card of choice, is dorpping this feature. It really is a major reason that I pay for the card.
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