Nice Job Harry

[woolfe9999]

I don't disagree with any of that. As I said with my first post in this thread, if I were Reid (and as I think he is monkey ball sweat, I'm very glad I'm not Reid) I would be doing the same thing, lining up my votes and making amendments to buy votes until I could get it passed. That's politics; the only thing different in this case is that the bill and its support are purely for making political points. No one believes this turd has a shot at passing. I imagine the House is doing the same thing, just without as much free publicity. (Which considering the tone of some of these articles might be a good thing for them.)

Although if the economy does tank, and it's increasingly looking (in the news, not from where I'm sitting) like it will, Obama stands a decent shot at getting Stimulus 2. Government can't buy prosperity, but it can slow down the descent by artificially inflating demand to keep companies from laying off out of fear it's going to get worse. Even with our skyrocketing debt, there's a case that can be made for a stimulus bill to fight a sudden drop.

Obama thinking it is a finished bill doesn't mean Reid and Senate dems think it's finished. The democrats are not a hive mind, certainly less so than the GOP.

That said, I agree that the bill is DOA and ultimately its only value for dems is as a political stunt. Which doesn't mean it's a bad idea for creating jobs. There's two sides to the political coin here. One is that the bill is meant to make the pubbies look bad; the other is that the pubbies won't pass any bill to improve the economy. If you're the dems here, you're going to put up a bill that you think will help the economy, and say to to the GOP, either pass this bill and help the economy, which BTW will also help us get re-elected, or don't pass it and look bad, also helping us get re-elected. It's a convergence of smart politics and public interest. However, in the end the only thing that's going to matter is that the economy is in the tank so this isn't going to help Obama much.

- wolf

 

[EagleKeeper]

The bill as it is from Obama will not pass muster in the Senate by the Dems. The 25K0 limit is considered low for the high cost of living areas (CA, NY, CT, NJ).

Rework will be needed. Questions will be; what will the Republicans offer in the Senate.

Then the House also has to step up to the table.

Because the Senate tabled the bill rather than bring it to a vote removes the political stunting that the Dems can use against the Republicans in this case

 

[Jhhnn]

Of course it's political theatre, given that *no* jobs bill will get past Repubs. They see Obama as wounded, and they don't really care who else goes down with him- they're out to win at any cost to the nation, so long as the true Bush Constituency doesn't have to suffer the horrible degradation of paying higher taxes.

Reid just seeks to bring that into focus at a time & in a way of his own choosing.

Cantor has already pronounced *any* jobs bill dead in the HOR, so Dems might as well make the most of it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-on-jobs-bill/2011/03/03/gIQANe77KL_blog.html

It’s far more likely, though, that Obama and his team have concluded that nothing will force House Republicans to embrace his jobs plan, or even its major elements. The brutal truth is that there is little to no political incentive for Republicans to change course. As Republicans well know, Obama is in serious political trouble — even though Republicans are blocking provisions in the jobs bill that have strong majority support, it seems plausible that he’ll continue to bear the brunt of public anger over unemployment. The question is whether a sustained campaign to drive home to the American people who is blocking ambitious action on the economy — a campaign that Obama seems prepared to escalate today in a big way — can do anything to change that.

Reid & Obama are on the same page, I figure. If Repubs want to inhibit recovery, and it's clear that they do, they need to be made to own it.

 

[werepossum]

Obama thinking it is a finished bill doesn't mean Reid and Senate dems think it's finished. The democrats are not a hive mind, certainly less so than the GOP.

That said, I agree that the bill is DOA and ultimately its only value for dems is as a political stunt. Which doesn't mean it's a bad idea for creating jobs. There's two sides to the political coin here. One is that the bill is meant to make the pubbies look bad; the other is that the pubbies won't pass any bill to improve the economy. If you're the dems here, you're going to put up a bill that you think will help the economy, and say to to the GOP, either pass this bill and help the economy, which BTW will also help us get re-elected, or don't pass it and look bad, also helping us get re-elected. It's a convergence of smart politics and public interest. However, in the end the only thing that's going to matter is that the economy is in the tank so this isn't going to help Obama much.

- wolf

Good points. I think though that the Pubbies would happily pass a bill to improve the economy, just not one that does so by raising taxes.

The bill as it is from Obama will not pass muster in the Senate by the Dems. The 25K0 limit is considered low for the high cost of living areas (CA, NY, CT, NJ).

Rework will be needed. Questions will be; what will the Republicans offer in the Senate.

Then the House also has to step up to the table.

Because the Senate tabled the bill rather than bring it to a vote removes the political stunting that the Dems can use against the Republicans in this case

I'd be willing to bet that the average household income in those high cost of living areas isn't half of that. Not saying that it's a good bill, but people tend to look at their own income and think this is middle class, I shouldn't pay a lot of taxes even if they are actually far better off than average. But you're obviously right that the bill will not pass muster among the Democrats. And the Dems may be smart in having Obama scold the Republicans for not passing it while Reid prevents them from even voting on it. How many people get their news from the Daily Show, HuffPo, etc.? I'd bet a lot of people see Obama scolding the Republicans but never even know that Reid is preventing a vote on it. Stupid people vote too.

 

[werepossum]

Of course it's political theatre, given that *no* jobs bill will get past Repubs. They see Obama as wounded, and they don't really care who else goes down with him- they're out to win at any cost to the nation, so long as the true Bush Constituency doesn't have to suffer the horrible degradation of paying higher taxes.

Reid just seeks to bring that into focus at a time & in a way of his own choosing.

Cantor has already pronounced *any* jobs bill dead in the HOR, so Dems might as well make the most of it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-on-jobs-bill/2011/03/03/gIQANe77KL_blog.html



Reid & Obama are on the same page, I figure. If Repubs want to inhibit recovery, and it's clear that they do, they need to be made to own it.

Dude, there's some serious fail in that blog, and yet you can't be happy even with that. This guy says the Republicans are blocking reforms that have majority support. Reid refuses the bring the bill up for a vote or debate, which means that Republicans literally have nothing to block. Then you say that "Cantor has already pronounced *any* jobs bill dead in the HOR"; that's a flat out lie not even supported by your own blog post. Cantor pronounced the OBAMA jobs bill dead in the House. Not ANY jobs bill, nor even any jobs bill Obama might care to bring, but the Obama jobs bill currently languishing in the Senate.

As I said, the Democrats are banking on the outright stupidity of the electorate, and they may have the smarter tract considering that they basically have nothing more to offer than punish the rich and reward our friends. But it's far from a done deal. Typically the American public holds the President responsible for the economy. Attempting to shift that blame to the Republicans may be the Democrats' best hope, but it's going to be an uphill climb.

 

[PokerGuy]

Look, he said the media isn't reporting on this.

Wrong. That's not what I said. This is what I said: "obummer should be screaming at Reid and his fellow idiots, but the media is not reporting it. ". In other words, the media should be correctly reporting that it is Reid and the democrats that are holding this up, not the republicans.

He then shifted the goal posts once by implicitly admitting that they are reporting it, but claimed they are reporting it in a biased manner because their headline wasn't "hypocrites attack gop for not passing the bill then hold up voting on it when the republicans want to bring it to a vote." Really now? Is that how a headline in a non-editorial news article should read?

Yes, that is what it should read. Not word for word, but something like "democrats hold up presidents bill, blame republicans". That's the gist of it. Instead, they present it as a "he said she said" issue, when the simple fact beyond any dispute is that Reid is holding up a vote on the bill. That's part of the biased reporting we've come to expect from the liberal media.

What does Obama being on vacation have to do with Congress passing or not passing a bill because they're on vacation?

It's not congress on vacation that's holding up the bill, it's Reid and the democrats. The article could and should have pointed this out.

My whole point was exactly that: the media will parrot obummer and his minions instead of critically evaluating what they say and exposing it for the garbage that it is. They should be doing that to both sides. At this point, the hypocrisy is all on the left. If the republicans vote down the bill or don't allow it to come to a vote, then they can say "republicans refuse to pass president's bill".

 

[Jhhnn]

Then you say that "Cantor has already pronounced *any* jobs bill dead in the HOR"; that's a flat out lie not even supported by your own blog post. Cantor pronounced the OBAMA jobs bill dead in the House. Not ANY jobs bill, nor even any jobs bill Obama might care to bring, but the Obama jobs bill currently languishing in the Senate.

I'm sorry, I should have said any honest jobs bill, not one that invokes voodoo economics & the voluntary actions of the non-Job Creators. The only jobs bills that they've introduced are complete shams and it's high time that's recognized for what it is.