nh-d14 fans

[DrMrLordX]

I'm looking for replacements for the stock fans on my Noctua nh-d14. The stock fans are okay,but at least according to xbit labs, it looks like a pair of fans pushing ~70cfm will max it out (triple-fan configs are not an option for me thanks to my RAM).

I don't particularly want to use the fans xbit used (TR-fdbs @ 2000 rpm) since they may be a bit noisy at full tilt, and I know nothing about their static pressure.

One option I had considered was 2x Gentle Typhoon ap-15s, which would have the right kind of static pressure . . . however, at around 53 cfm, I don't know that they move enough air.

I looked at Scythe Kaze Maru 2s, but I would only want to use one as a center fan, and the static pressure on those seems bad.

Any thoughts?

 

[MisterDonut]

Nothing's gonna beat a Scythe GT when it comes to static pressure (factoring in acceptable noise, of course). Get them, you will not be disappointed. In all honesty though, Noctua makes some decent fans too, and I really see no need to change them. Will say they're not as good as the GT's, but I don't know if this justifies $40.

 

[DrMrLordX]

The stock fans are good, but if I can drop 4C at load when overclocked, then it would probably be worth it to me. If you think the GTs will match the performance of the TR-fdbs @ 1800 rpm then I will probably pick them up.

I might even get three and replace this stupid FM-121 exhaust fan that is sound and fury signifying nothing.

 

[zagood]

FYI - the Thermalright fans are the same as the Scythe S-Flex. Might help you out since there are a lot more articles comparing the S-Flex to the GT than the TR-FDBs.

 

[DrMrLordX]

FYI - the Thermalright fans are the same as the Scythe S-Flex. Might help you out since there are a lot more articles comparing the S-Flex to the GT than the TR-FDBs.

Ah, now that does help. I found a great fan roundup at XS:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=223391

This chart was of particular interest to me:

Looks like the GTs beat Sflex-F fans on a radiator @ 12v. They'll do nicely. Thanks!

 

[zagood]

By that chart the S-Flex G (1900rpm) is a touch above the Gentle Typhoon AP15 (1850rpm). However, the GT produces less noise.

This chart is a perfect example of what we talk about with static pressure - the fans are made by the same company, the S-Flex is "rated" 73cm vs. 58cfm for the GT, yet the results after passing through a radiator show the difference of ~1cfm...

 

[DrMrLordX]

ah woops, I was looking at the sflex-f. Anyway, the xbit article mostly showed that the tr-fdb fans failed to show any improvement beyond 1800 rpm, so the GTs should have no trouble reaching that degree of airflow.

 

[ehume]

Results on radiators require more static pressure. Air coolers vary more. I am finding on my Megahalems, for example, that true cfm is more important than static pressure. I say true cfm because people who sell fans to consumers do exaggerate.

I have a D14. I have Kaze Maru 1900's and a KM2 1700 that I will be testing on the D14. It will have to wait until I am done running fans through my Megahalems, though. Based on the "face test" (fans blowing against my face), I have high expectations of the Kaze Maru 1900. I also have Slipstream 1900's to use as push and pull. I won't know how they'll all do, noise vs performance, but I will point out that the Kaze Maru 1900 is not expensive, and the Slipstream 1900 can be had for $6.00. So, for under $20 and shipping, you could find out for yourself. Put all of these fans together and they won't overload a cpu fan header, which you will set to "auto." Then, no matter how noisy they are at max, they will normally run very quietly.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I had looked at the Kaze Maru2 as an option for the center fan, but for the center fan, I really want static pressure since it has to pull and push air through fins on the HSF. I will not be using a 140mm fan in a pull role on the backside of the HSF since the fan there has to blow directly onto/into the exhaust fan, and the exhaust fan is going to be 120mm no matter what. I'd rather have a 120mm fan blowing into another 120mm fan than a 140 blowing into a 120. Maybe I'm being a bit silly in insisting on that.

I would be very interested in seeing your results from the kaze maru 1900 and kaze maru 2 1700. You will probably produce results before I can get anything shipped.

 

[ehume]

I would be very interested in seeing your results from the kaze maru 1900 and kaze maru 2 1700. You will probably produce results before I can get anything shipped.

Nope. I'm only halfway through my 4GHz Megahalems testing. Then it's on to 3652MHz testing. Only then will I dismount the Megatron and try out the D14.

I will say, though, that I have removed the rear fan and the grill that used to restrict its flow. When I put a high airflow fan on the push position I can feel a gale outside the case. The grill used to restrict that mightily, and there is no way anything but a loud fan could keep up with the airflow. I just let the air go free. YMMV.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Nope. I'm only halfway through my 4GHz Megahalems testing. Then it's on to 3652MHz testing. Only then will I dismount the Megatron and try out the D14.

I will say, though, that I have removed the rear fan and the grill that used to restrict its flow. When I put a high airflow fan on the push position I can feel a gale outside the case. The grill used to restrict that mightily, and there is no way anything but a loud fan could keep up with the airflow. I just let the air go free. YMMV.

Interesting. Too bad I don't have a Dremel handy, or I'd try that myself.

 

[ehume]

Interesting. Too bad I don't have a Dremel handy, or I'd try that myself.

Dremel, schmemel. I don't have a Dremel - they were invented after I did most of my tool learning. I used wire cutters and a file to cut and smoothe, a brush and a vacuum to get the filings out, and a modeler's semi-gloss black marker to darken the raw edges.

 

[zagood]

Cheap alternatives for a dremel from your local radio shack:
Nibbler - Can be used in sheet metal, can take a long time and a lot of cleanup.
Mini-Diagonal Cutters - Not to use on straight sheet metal, but the tip will fit inbetween most fan grills punchouts; just cut through the "posts" - not a pretty result but effective.

 

[ehume]

I used the latter - only mine were/are Harbor Freight cheapies I got through a mail-order catalog, back before the World Wide Web.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Hmm, I think I have a toolkit with something similar to the diagonal cutters around here somewhere . . . might give that a try. Thanks!

 

[ehume]

Don't forget the file - and either paint or a marker.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Gotcha.

Also, over at XS, it seems someone has provided me with evidence that the nh-d14's cooling performance continues to scale at high fan speeds.

http://lab501.ro/racire/thermalright-prolimatech-si-noctua-batalia-titanilor/34

Since my FM-121 is making a hell of a lot of noise, I'm thinking a 39dba San Ace + maybe a Delta would be a fun way to cool the nh-d14 and blow some air out a removed exhaust fan grate. The Delta will probably produce even more noise, but it can always be undervolted I guess. Dammit if San Aces aren't expensive.

 

[ehume]

Yup. Expensive. I bought three of these PWM San Aces specifically to try out on my D14. I also bought these PWM harnesses to power the three fans from Molex while getting their PWM marching orders from the cpu header. I bought them here.

They're real smokin' on the Megahalems, so I'm looking forward to three - can you imagine three San Aces coming in and singing a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out? They'll think it's a movement, and that's just what it'll be . . . (old fart joke).

 

[cbn]

Results on radiators require more static pressure. Air coolers vary more. I am finding on my Megahalems, for example, that true cfm is more important than static pressure.

I would have thought static pressure and CFM were directly related?

How can a fan have high static pressure and low CFM (or vice versa)?

P.S. So what is the consensus for best fan design for 140mm? I am waiting for Nidec servo corporation to build Gentle Typhoon in 140mm.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Yup. Expensive. I bought three of these PWM San Aces specifically to try out on my D14. I also bought these PWM harnesses to power the three fans from Molex while getting their PWM marching orders from the cpu header. I bought them here.

Whew, 51 dba? At that point I think I would have gone for the ~150 cfm Delta 120x25s but that's just me. However, PWM means not having to put up with all that noise if you don't want to. I like that PWM splitter! That is slick. Might need to order me one of those.

I got the first fan I want to use (will be restricted to 2 fans on my nh-d14 due to tall RAM) here:

It hasn't arrived yet (probably hasn't even shipped yet) but it'll get here eventually.

This one will be used as the center fan since I can't fit a 120x38 in there. I have been trying so so hard to find a h1011 (either the old 109s or the new ones) because ~100cfm @ 39 dba with all that static pressure would be great. Finding a suitable substitute has not been easy.

They're real smokin' on the Megahalems, so I'm looking forward to three - can you imagine three San Aces coming in and singing a bar of Alice's Restaurant and walking out? They'll think it's a movement, and that's just what it'll be . . . (old fart joke).

Ba dum, tsh.

What would really scare me is three of these:

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/de12pfexhisp.html

Yeah I know you could only use two on a nh-d14 but whatever.

Ebay Links are not allowed on AT period!
CnC Moderator Aigomorla

 

[modestninja]

I would have thought static pressure and CFM were directly related?

How can a fan have high static pressure and low CFM (or vice versa)?

Static pressure is pressure without motion (that's what the word "static" means). So there is no positive relationship between fan static pressure and flow rate, with two exceptions:

1. For a specific fan, each possible static pressure corresponds to a specific airflow. Ie, if you close a valve and increase the backpressure the fan has to overcome, the new cfm can be read from a fan curve by matching the new pressure to the curve.

2. In a situation where all of the static pressure is turned into velocity pressure - such as in a pressurized tank with an open valve, you can use Bernoulli's equation equating the two to find velocity from static pressure.

There are fans like the Scythe Slipstreams that have a high flow rate (in CFM) when they have nothing obstructing their path, but as soon as you throw some resistance in front of them, their flow rate goes way down because of their low static pressue. Fans with high static pressure lose less flow because of resistance.

 

[ehume]

I got the first fan I want to use (will be restricted to 2 fans on my nh-d14 due to tall RAM) here:

It hasn't arrived yet (probably hasn't even shipped yet) but it'll get here eventually.

This one will be used as the center fan since I can't fit a 120x38 in there. I have been trying so so hard to find a h1011 (either the old 109s or the new ones) because ~100cfm @ 39 dba with all that static pressure would be great. Finding a suitable substitute has not been easy.

This is the -H101, which you can convert to a -H1011 by cutting off the ribs with a coping saw, hacksaw or some such. You will need to put your own plug on it, though. I have two, but I only needed one.

BTW - you eBay link does not work for us non-members. Do you have a manufacturer's link?

Removed Ebay Link
CnC Moderator Aigomorla

 

[DrMrLordX]

This is the -H101, which you can convert to a -H1011 by cutting off the ribs with a coping saw, hacksaw or some such. You will need to put your own plug on it, though. I have two, but I only needed one.

Yeah, I've actually seen the conversion steps for the H101. I wonder if my folks still have their old hacksaw. I am also considering this:

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12hisp.html

and this:

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12mesp.html

Though I think having the 86 cfm fan in the pull position would be a bit silly what with a faster Delta blowing onto it.

BTW - you eBay link does not work for us non-members. Do you have a manufacturer's link?

Woops! Sorry.

# Dimensions: 120 x 120 x 25mm.
# Air Flow: 106 CFM
# Speed: 1,100 - 3,400 RPM
# Max Noise: 45 dBA.
# Input Voltage: 12VDC.
# Current: .75A
# Bearing type: Ball
# RPM/Tach?: YES
# Connector: 4-pin PWM

 

[aigomorla]

I'm thinking a 39dba San Ace + maybe a Delta would be a fun way to cool the nh-d14 and blow some air out a removed exhaust fan grate. The Delta will probably produce even more noise, but it can always be undervolted I guess. Dammit if San Aces aren't expensive.

LOLOL....

San Ace Whoreage... 8 to be exact.

I had the same idea you had... lets have some fun with a LOT and LOT of San Aces + other fans...

It ended up like this... 16 fans...

I was laughed at even on XS for making something that massive... :sneaky:

But id push the GT.
Its quiet.. very durable.. and also they perform extremely well on a sink or radiator.

 

[Rubycon]

Talk about a waste of fans...