New York Times laying down the smack on its unions

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126
So the NYT Co is giving a big "fvck you" to its unions. Of course, it won't help and the Times stock will continue its long slide to oblivion.

Story Link

The New York Times Company, which has threatened to shutter The Boston Globe, is seeking deep concessions from the Globe's largest union that could include pay cuts of up to 20 percent, the elimination of seniority rules and lifetime job guarantees, and millions of dollars in cuts in company contributions to retirement and healthcare plans.


BTW, this is the same New York Times that supports the Employee Free Choice Act on its
Op-Ed pages. Guess the grey lady only wants other companies to pay workers more, or that it only supports worker's causes on its Op-Ed pages
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,731
8,308
136
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: Hacp
Lol liberals. They are so quick to abandon their principles.

o hi troll, how are you today


Hey, don't provoke him. He may be a card carrying member of the Beck Brigades.;)

edit - On topic, like the auto workers, it's likely the workers at NYT will give concessions commensurate with the need to keep their jobs, with sunset clauses included in LOA's to seal the deal.

 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: tweaker2
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: Hacp
Lol liberals. They are so quick to abandon their principles.

o hi troll, how are you today


Hey, don't provoke him. He may be a card carrying member of the Beck Brigades.;)
You mean he'll start crying?

 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,731
8,308
136
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: tweaker2
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: Hacp
Lol liberals. They are so quick to abandon their principles.

o hi troll, how are you today


Hey, don't provoke him. He may be a card carrying member of the Beck Brigades.;)
You mean he'll start crying?

Yeah, but only when the lilting and crescendo'ing strains of Glory, Glory Hallelujah gets cued in.:D

 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,808
83
91
new york times editorial board/reporters =! the new york times company corporate board.

 

gingermeggs

Golden Member
Dec 22, 2008
1,157
0
71
oh those patriarchal Zionist Jews and how they wiggle like maggots, when they are losing money!
The only nice thing about them is their sense of family.

 

XZeroII

Lifer
Jun 30, 2001
12,572
0
0
Looks like a reasonable move to me. Just because they have a union doesn't mean that you can flip off the recession and keep your nice high wages. This sounds just like the auto industry where the union would rather run the company into the ground than make necessary changes. Any normal company would cut wages and lay off people and restructure so that they can remain profitable in hard times. This is what it all boils down to. Either they restructure their workforce or they shut down. What other options do they have other than running into massive debt and then asking for a government bailout?
 

SirStev0

Lifer
Nov 13, 2003
10,449
6
81
I guess it is all best if we just give up all our rights as workers.

I mean if the auto workers were just willing to work for $1.00 an hour in substandard facilities with huge occupational risks, the auto industry would have never left Detroit for Mexico and the pacific.

I love that everyone thinks the world would be an outstanding place if it wasn't for unions. That companies would love and coddle their workers with fair wages and benefits and job security. Please see a factory in Mexico or Singapore and get back to me.
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,224
37
91
LOL...this is too much.

When the money isnt rolling in anymore, liberal principles sure do look short-sighted. (Unless you are the US Govt, then you can just print money to continue your spending)
 

babylon5

Golden Member
Dec 11, 2000
1,363
1
0
Originally posted by: SirStev0
I mean if the auto workers were just willing to work for $1.00 an hour in substandard facilities with huge occupational risks

We already have workers willing to work cheap in USA with no benefits -- illegals. They show America that we dont' have to pay fair wages and benefits. Some people around here claim if you pay workers too much and give benefits, the entire industry would collapse (Oops...)

 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,731
8,308
136
Well, another factor that comes into play is how rank and file workers view the economic downturn and what they have to do to adjust for it.

These downturns negatively affect the middle class and poor a whole lot more than the very rich management types who have deep reserves to stave off the effects of an extended loss in wages and benefits.

Let's use a middle class auto worker as an example.

He/she makes 50k/yr, has a 1k monthly mortgage, a child in college, one in middle school and the other in high school. He/she pays 15k/yr for college tuition, 1.2k/mo for an auto loan along with stashing some $$ for the other kid's college funds, and then there's living expenses, retirement fund, etc. In other words, he/she's living right on the edge of their capabilities to finance their lifestyle, typical of most Americans.

Along comes the economic downturn. This auto worker now faces an abrupt loss of income that will force him to pull their child out of college, lose their not yet paid for car, and is threatened with losing the house he/she has been paying a mortgage on for 14 years.

Multiply that by the thousands of other auto workers that are in the same predicament.

I'd assume their main concern is to lessen the impact of the loss in wages and benefits as much as possible for as long as possible. How do they do that? Where else but at the bargaining table? They have no other recourse but to try to minimize the financial inpact on themselves while still trying to keep job security.

Ergo, hard fought over concessions are made with the thought in mind that both Management and rank and file should suffer equally.

That is the REALITY of a negotiating session where concessions are the main topic of discussion.

It's ridiculously and patently FALSE to accuse any union member of attempting to commit occupational suicide by "forcing their Company into the ground", as both Union members and Management have a very real and serious reason to keep their Company afloat: Noone wants to lose their jobs.

The nuts and bolts of negotiating concessions is found in the area of how to lessen the impact of those types of necessary cuts as much as possible, as a lot of workers are staring at financial ruin and the destrcution of their family unit, and a lot of Managers are looking at a shrinking job market where managers can be had for a dime a dozen.

Everyone invloved knows that cuts are inevitable. They're all at the bargaining table negotiating where the cuts should occur, and for how long. Conflicts of interest are unavoidable, but all parties are primarily concerned with the survival of their Company.

Outside interests also have a major impact on how negotiations are handled. There are agenda's and ulterior motives galore when a crisis occurs. The sharks homing in and the vultures flying overhead all want to profit from it.

Union busting comes to the forefront whenever a crisis such as the one we're now faced wtih occurs. Takeovers that couldn't occur in good times are now possible. Stronger competitors now leverage themselves into play in the hopes of destroying their competiton. The big fish swim in hoping to gobble up the little ones.

All of this goes on while at the Auto Plant desperate folks are strategizing over desperate measures to keep things going and become a stronger competitor as an end result.

Not an easy thing to do, and hardly ever considered when making flippant judgements from behind a keyboard.









 

Hacp

Lifer
Jun 8, 2005
13,923
2
81
Originally posted by: SirStev0
I guess it is all best if we just give up all our rights as workers.

I mean if the auto workers were just willing to work for $1.00 an hour in substandard facilities with huge occupational risks, the auto industry would have never left Detroit for Mexico and the pacific.

I love that everyone thinks the world would be an outstanding place if it wasn't for unions. That companies would love and coddle their workers with fair wages and benefits and job security. Please see a factory in Mexico or Singapore and get back to me.

Life isn't fair sir.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,731
8,308
136
Originally posted by: GenHoth
Originally posted by: tweaker2

Well thought out and eloquently stated? Ban

There ya go....just what I expected, and just what I had mentioned in my closing comment. Thanks for stepping up and volunteering to proving my point.:D:beer:





 

Andrew111

Senior member
Aug 6, 2001
792
0
0
Originally posted by: SirStev0
I guess it is all best if we just give up all our rights as workers.

I mean if the auto workers were just willing to work for $1.00 an hour in substandard facilities with huge occupational risks, the auto industry would have never left Detroit for Mexico and the pacific.

I love that everyone thinks the world would be an outstanding place if it wasn't for unions. That companies would love and coddle their workers with fair wages and benefits and job security. Please see a factory in Mexico or Singapore and get back to me.

Don't give me that bleeding heart bullshit. There are already regulations in place to protect workplace working conditions in the US without having to be in a union. Union's are fine in practice but we're in a recession.........hard times means people lose their jobs or get a pay cut if need be.....if the unions don't accept the reality of the times they ultimately hurt their company. If you think unions are so great look at Europe.......where they have no qualms about going on strike and shutting down the entire transportation system....hurting the country in the process so they get what they want....screw everyone else. When unions eliminate the flexibility of companies to hire and fire people when needed the entire economy suffers. Europe's economy and labor force will not recover as fast from the recession for this very reason.....something we should keep in mind before we become more like Europe.
 

Mani

Diamond Member
Aug 9, 2001
4,808
1
0
If the gleeful idiots thinking this is an example of liberals compromising their principles stopped to think for a second, they'd realize that supporting the EFCA and asking a union to make concessions are not at all in direct conflict with each other.
 

Double Trouble

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
9,270
103
106
That's one of the very few positive aspects of this economy -- companies can use this opportunity to get rid of the unions that hamper productivity, or at least diminish their power. Get rid of employees that are involved in union activities and purge slackers of all kinds.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
0
0
Originally posted by: gingermeggs
oh those patriarchal Zionist Jews and how they wiggle like maggots, when they are losing money!
The only nice thing about them is their sense of family.

So what are you, a Muslim, or a right wing inbred skinhead?
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
Dying industry. Union needs to get on board with that. If the money isn't there, it just isn't there.

I was talking to a guy yesterday who works alongside some union workers and his company, which has filed for bankruptcy, is still giving 21 days/year to union employees. lol Those are company holidays, btw, not vacation days.
 

Strk

Lifer
Nov 23, 2003
10,197
4
76
Originally posted by: Skoorb
Dying industry. Union needs to get on board with that. If the money isn't there, it just isn't there.

I was talking to a guy yesterday who works alongside some union workers and his company, which has filed for bankruptcy, is still giving 21 days/year to union employees. lol Those are company holidays, btw, not vacation days.

I only get 12 :(