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New York Becomes Only State to Offer Free Four-Year College Tuition

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This... Sorry NYS, but people who have skin in the game even if marginally will do better than what they will with a handout.

My biggest issue with all this is that instead of addressing the ever rising tuition costs to the public they just make it free. That might be part of the solution but still doesn't hold college administrators accountable.

Here in NC many years back they found a clear relationship between tuition bumps at public universities and increases in state aid to students.... The hard part was finding whether the tuition increases were in response to there being more state aid, or if increased state aid was in response to rising tuition rates. You can guess the direction that went in.

Can you link to that study? One of the primary drivers of increased tuition at public universities has been dramatically declining state subsidies. Regardless, there are GPA and courseload requirements to qualify for the scholarship so people who aren't performing can and will lose it.

Honestly, free college at state universities is long overdue, as student loans are simply getting out of hand.
 
Just figured out how much college cost me in today's dollars: $2200/year (plus books, etc.). My state subsidized in-state students (back in ancient times). I have a bias for working ones way through college because that's what I did. That said, I would have had much more time to study if I didn't work (though I commuted as my parents provided me with free rent, meals, love and whatnot). Even though I was very studious, I don't know if I would've spent the extra ~25 hours/week studying.

Kudos to NY for trying - it's a worthwhile experiment. I hope the program lasts at least a decade to see how well this works in the North East.
Complicated problem, like pretty much any worthwhile endeavor. I think it will take time to refine things like minimum required GPA, campus job allocations, etc. I didn't read the OP link, but I imagine this needs to be integrated with various options such as apprenticeships, junior college/tech schools and so forth to address as wide a population as is possible.
 
Free is a marketing gimmick that is used to present the appearance of something for nothing, often abused by retail establishments to lure people into buying something they don't need.


It should be called state sponsored or tax payer funded education, not free. Free denotes no value and devalues the item being peddled in this case education.
 
What data are you referring to? I don't think I've ever seen a convincing, objective metric of citizen informedness or whatever else. I agree that college in a net gain for many, but the further we lower the barrier-to-entry, the higher number of people that come out of it no better off than before.

There is a lot of data out there concluding higher education benefits society as a whole. Most of the original research is behind paywalls, but here are just a few from more mainstream sources.

https://www.csuohio.edu/sites/default/files/The Benefits Of Higher Education.pdf
https://www.hispanicoutlook.com/ang...igher-education-benefits-students-and-society
https://www.oecd.org/education/skills-beyond-school/EDIF 2013--N°10 (eng)--v9 FINAL bis.pdf
http://www.colorado.edu/today/1999/11/10/society-benefits-college-educated-citizens

Furthermore, it doesn't matter if decreasing the barrier-to-entry decreases the net benefit to society of the average graduate so long as decreasing the barrier-to-entry improves conditions for society as a whole. While I don't think we need to push for college educating 100% of the population, I do think we need to make college education affordable for those that want to pursue it. Just as an example. Right now our country is facing a significant teacher shortage. One of the problems is that teacher pay is too low to allow for the student debt many would be teachers accumulate obtaining their education. Now there are some programs in place to help accommodate this issue, but students have to know about these programs to make use of them. This creates a significant barrier for attracting teachers. There is a significant amount of latent talent in the US population that remains untapped right now simply because the individual comes from a background that disadvantages them within our current system. All the special programs work well for those familiar with the system, but for those that aren't, the cost of a college education can be a real detriment.
 
Well now the catch 22 comes out and now we find out free isn't so free and some are complaining about it, some even comparing it to some sort of involuntary confinement, looks like quite a few were planning to take the money, oops , EDUCATION and run while New Yorkers get stuck with the bill, thanks to the "me first corporate mentality" that our secondary schools are indoctrinating into today's generation of students.

Guess civic duty and giving back to the community that helped you out aren't as popular today.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/york-lawmakers-approve-free-middle-class-college-tuition-46698833
"
"There's a big string attached to New York's free middle-class college tuition initiative: Students must stay in the state after graduation or else pay back the benefit.

Democratic Gov. Andrew Cuomo said Monday that the requirement was added to protect the state's investment in a student's education by ensuring they don't take advantage of free tuition and then leave New York. The rule wasn't a part of Cuomo's free college tuition proposal when he unveiled it in January but was inserted during final negotiations with lawmakers over the state budget, which was approved Sunday.

The tuition initiative, which Cuomo said is a national model, covers state college or university tuition for in-state students from families earning $125,000 or less. Students must remain in New York for as many years as they received the benefit. They must repay the money as a loan if they take a job in another state.


"Why should New Yorkers pay for your college education and then you pick up and you move to California?" Cuomo said during a call with state editorial writers. "The concept of investing in you and your education is that you're going to stay here and be an asset to the state. If you don't want to stay here, then go to California now, let them pay for your college education."


Students at University at Albany, part of the state university system, aren't so sure.

"I don't know how much I like feeling confined, even to staying in the state for four more years," said Bobby Rickard, an 18-year-old freshman from Brewster who has not yet decided his major. "I don't know what life will have for me."

Cumorah Reed, a 19-year-old English major, said certain technology jobs are concentrated on the West Coast and many of her classmates will be surprised to learn they will not be able to apply for those positions immediately after graduation.

"I think it's going to be harder than people think," Reed said.

Ashley Mendez, 18, a journalism and communications major, said the proposal is a fair compromise because many residents will stay anyway.

"I'm a New Yorker. I wouldn't leave the state for anything," Mendez said.

Sara Goldrick-Rab, a Temple University professor who studies college affordability, said the requirement undercuts the promise of free tuition and could deliver a nasty shock to students who fail to read the fine print, or who take the money believing they will stay in New York, only to find better job opportunities elsewhere.

"It's absolutely bait and switch," she said. "You entice people with something they really, really need and then you penalize them if they can't find a decent job and have to leave."

Republican lawmakers pushed for the requirement during closed-door state budget negotiations.

"We took the governor's original plan and made it better, by requiring students to maintain a certain GPA and to live and work in New York after they graduate," said Scott Reif, a spokesman for the Senate's Republican leadership.

Students who receive free tuition and then leave the state for an advanced degree won't have to pay the money back assuming they return to New York once they complete their graduate studies. State officials also plan to make accommodations for graduates who leave the state for military service.

As part of the budget, lawmakers also approved a new tuition assistance program for students at private colleges and universities that offers up to $3,000 in tuition grants. That assistance also comes with a requirement that a student remain in New York after graduation for the same number of years they received the benefit."
 
Free is a marketing gimmick that is used to present the appearance of something for nothing, often abused by retail establishments to lure people into buying something they don't need.


It should be called state sponsored or tax payer funded education, not free. Free denotes no value and devalues the item being peddled in this case education.
I'm fine with calling it state sponsored. In this case, I don't think it is a marketing gimmick so much as an attempt to clearly convey to underprivileged students that they can indeed afford to go to college. Most adults realize that someone still has to pay for it.
 

Not really surprising colleges themselves conclude the product they are selling benefits society.
 
Wow, if a student moves to another state, they have to pay off their tuition. They already have to pay off their tuition, so why the complaint? Those who stay in NY after getting their degree in NY reap the rewards. Seems perfectly logical to me. If you go to University for the Army, you have to commit to serving in the Army for a certain amount of time. When working on a Masters degree, I had to commit to staying a year longer every semester they paid for or have to repay the company. This is SOP.

Bonus, as it turn out - free isn't exactly free. The good ppl of NY expect a student to repay the 'local economy' for the benefits they received. Awesome lesson in reasonable sacrifice for reasonable reward!
 
Wow, if a student moves to another state, they have to pay off their tuition. They already have to pay off their tuition, so why the complaint? Those who stay in NY after getting their degree in NY reap the rewards. Seems perfectly logical to me. If you go to University for the Army, you have to commit to serving in the Army for a certain amount of time. When working on a Masters degree, I had to commit to staying a year longer every semester they paid for or have to repay the company. This is SOP.

Bonus, as it turn out - free isn't exactly free. The good ppl of NY expect a student to repay the 'local economy' for the benefits they received. Awesome lesson in reasonable sacrifice for reasonable reward!

In addition, the populace of NYC doesn't have to 'foot the entire bill' as it were, as those now-educated people are contributing to the host state which pays back dividends. Good tradeoff imo.
 
Kind of like Republicans used their states as laboratories for conservatism? How is that working out? Kansas economic miracle coming along?


Well that's nice and all I guess, but I was talking about CA being the laboratory like NY. You get Bernie and all that goes with him. Then you can be the Miracle Guy.
 
Well that's nice and all I guess, but I was talking about CA being the laboratory like NY. You get Bernie and all that goes with him. Then you can be the Miracle Guy.

Do me a favor. Stay the fuck out of New York. I'm quite happy with so many rats and cockroaches and bedbugs and trash everywhere and we have absolutely no plan to ever clean it up.
 
Do me a favor. Stay the fuck out of New York. I'm quite happy with so many rats and cockroaches and bedbugs and trash everywhere and we have absolutely no plan to ever clean it up.
No problem. You stay in NYC and I'll stick with Upstate.
 
What is Cuomo going to do to create jobs for these people? Is this a program based on a hope that if you educate them the jobs will come? Sure seems like it.

This is little more than political feel-good bullshit. The kind that appeals greatly to people that can't think any further ahead than the next 20 minutes. It's too damned hard to figure out what people are going to do for a living but by golly, we can sure as shit have the taxpayers pay for their education. It's just a variation on more bread and circuses.
 
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