New to SSDs? Read this first before asking questions! (UPDATED 07/17/2011)

[Zap]

Hello overtonesinger, and welcome to AnandTech forums.

I don't think it matters whether you leave extra space unused or unpartitioned.

You shouldn't have even defragged it the one time. Defrag does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING USEFUL on an SSD so at best you are wasting your time. Why defrag works on a hard drive is because the software knows where the data is kept on a hard drive. Why you need to do it is because of the HDD access times. Since an SSD remaps data all the time for wear leveling, it does not let the OS/software know where the data actually is kept. Also there are just about zero access times on an SSD so it won't matter how fragmented it is.

 

[overtonesinger]

Hello Zap!

Thanx a lot for Your reply!

Thank to You I understand a lot more how SSD actually works and why defrag has no effect on its performance.

 

[magreen]

Hey Zap. Really sweet guide you got going on here. Thanks for all the hard work. :thumbsup:

If you have the extra time, it would help people like me if you included the basic instructions for manually aligning the partition under XP. Thanks!

I personally have never installed XP on an SSD so I don't have personal experience. Maybe someone would like to contribute? I know that you can use Diskpart on another computer to create the partition, or you can use Vista/7 to create the partition. Maybe have a buddy of yours make a "recovery" disk with Windows Vista? It can be used to partition the drive, and then install Windows on existing partition.

Hey Zap

I've just googled my way through installing my intel x25-m g2 on my winxp laptop. I'm happy to share my findings, in the hope it will help out some other people in a similar position. So I've written it up here:

Quick and Dirty Windows XP SSD Howto

Note: lots of the credit for these tips goes to the OCZ Forum guys, at this link:
http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/forum/showthread.php?55238-Guide-for-Win-Xp-installation-with-Diskpar-%28alignment%29-nLite-Ramdrive-Page-file-Tweaks-Browser-Tweaks-My-Doc-folder-move-and-Print-Spooler-on-Vertex

Step 1: manually align the partition
First, download diskpar.exe from https://kb.wisc.edu/images/group14/4556/diskpar.exe
Note: diskpar.exe is not the same thing as diskpart.exe !!!

Most instructions will tell you to install the SSD as a secondary drive in some desktop computer somewhere. But if you're like me and you're putting this in a laptop, you can't make it a secondary drive. But I figured out that you can do the manual align and format step using a USB-to-SATA adapter, so if you're like me and installing this thing on a laptop you're still ok.

Hook it all up as a secondary drive or with a USB-to-SATA adapter. Then fire up Disk Management (Administrative Tools->Computer Management->Disk Management), and check which number your SSD is. This way, you don't fry your OS drive.

Then go to a command prompt.

For me, the SSD was Disk 1 under Disk Management. So that's why I use 1. Don't screw this up, diskpar will fry your OS drive without mercy.

type diskpar -i 1 to see the current partition info on your SSD. (You could type diskpar -i 0 on your existing hard drive to see how xp uses a sector offset of 63 which is what we don't want.)

Then when ready, type diskpar -s 1
Pick a sector offset of 2048 (2048 sectors * 512 bytes/sector = 1048576 bytes = 1024kB = 1MB). This seems to be the most agreed upon offset, and it's what vista and win7 do by default when setting up a partition. Check out the OCZ forum page for more info. You could play with other sector offsets if you feel that missing that entire MEGABYTE of lost storage space on your SSD is worth wasting your life.

See the example below:

C:> diskpar -i 1
---- Drive 1 Geometry Infomation ----
Cylinders = 9729
TracksPerCylinder = 255
SectorsPerTrack = 63
BytesPerSector = 512
DiskSize = 80023749120 (Bytes) = 76316 (MB)

End of partition information. Total existing partitions: 0

C:> diskpar -s 1
Set partition can only be done on a raw drive.
You can use Disk Manager to delete all existing partitions
Are you sure drive 1 is a raw device without any partition? (Y/N) y

---- Drive 1 Geometry Infomation ----
Cylinders = 9729
TracksPerCylinder = 255
SectorsPerTrack = 63
BytesPerSector = 512
DiskSize = 80023749120 (Bytes) = 76316 (MB)

We are going to set the new disk partition.
All data on this drive will be lost. continue (Y/N)? y

Please specify starting offset (in sectors): 2048
Please specify partition length (in MB) (Max = 76315): 76315

Done setting partition.
---- New Partition information ----
StatringOffset = 1048576
PartitionLength = 80022077440
HiddenSectors = 2048
PartitionNumber = 1
PartitionType = 7

You now should use Disk Manager to format this partition

C:>

Step 2: Format partition and put your user data on there

Go back to Disk Management (click Administrative Tools->Computer Management->Disk Management).
You might need to close and reopen it if you had it open from before you used diskpar, since it sometimes doesn't update.

You will now see your SSD, right click on it and choose Format
Choose NTFS as the File System and 4096 as the Allocation Unit Size, check Quick Format, and hit “Ok”.

Now continuing to use your SATA-to-USB adapter, you can copy on any user files you want there before you install XP to the SSD. That's because you can tell XP to install to the existing partition without wiping it out. Useful. (Don't copy the OS files or any installed programs from your hard drive to the new SSD. That would be dumb.)

Step 3: Install your SSD into your computer. Flash its firmware to the latest. Install Windows XP.
I'm going to assume you know how to take care of this step.

Step 4: Tweak Windows XP to play nice with your SSD

A. Make sure no disk defragmenting is scheduled
Go into Control Panel->Scheduled Tasks
Make sure disk defragmenter isn't in there.

B.Turn off XP hard drive optimization
Download Tweak UI, one of the Powertoys for WindowsXP. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx
Run Tweak UI
On the left side, click on General (so the word General is highlighted).
Scroll down in the settings list, and uncheck "Optimize hard disk when idle".

C. Disable Windows Prefetch
Windows XP doesn't have SuperFetch, but it does have a prefetcher. You'll want to disable it.
I didn't look up how to do this since the Intel SSD Toolbox did it for me. If you're not using an intel SSD, then you'll need to google this.

 

[Tsavo]

Ok, my SSD is a week old.

And I've got to reinstall W7 onto it because a fix suggested by the luminaries at MS totally borked the install.

Anything I need to know about reformatting the drive before I reinstall W7? Or just proceed as usual?

 

[taltamir]

proceed as usual

 

[slicksilver]

How do I know if I can install a SSD on my current mobo Intel DG33BU? The specs say the board has "Four SATA (3.0 Gb/s) ports". I"m looking to buy a sandforce based SSD. I'm on Windows 7 64bit.

Thanks in advance

 

[taltamir]

How do I know if I can install a SSD on my current mobo Intel DG33BU? The specs say the board has "Four SATA (3.0 Gb/s) ports". I"m looking to buy a sandforce based SSD. I'm on Windows 7 64bit.

Thanks in advance

if it has an SATA port, you can install it.
ideally you want AHCI support for NCQ, and you have it. According to intel website your mobo uses http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=31898 this southbridge, the ICH9DH, it has SATA v2 and AHCI but no RAID.

 

[Loyudo]

Hi, just got done building a new system and while researching for that I came across SSD's. Never heard about them before so I didn't budget for one while building the rig but now I really want one and just saved enough to get a 60GB boot drive. I've narrowed it down to two
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820220511
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233124
I prefer the Corsair brand but the Patriot has a SF-1222 compared to the Corsairs SF-1200 for practically the same price. Is there going to be any kind of noticeable difference or should I go with my brand preference. Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[slicksilver]

if it has an SATA port, you can install it.
ideally you want AHCI support for NCQ, and you have it. According to intel website your mobo uses http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=31898 this southbridge, the ICH9DH, it has SATA v2 and AHCI but no RAID.

Thanks!

 

[taltamir]

Hi, just got done building a new system and while researching for that I came across SSD's. Never heard about them before so I didn't budget for one while building the rig but now I really want one and just saved enough to get a 60GB boot drive. I've narrowed it down to two
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820220511
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820233124
I prefer the Corsair brand but the Patriot has a SF-1222 compared to the Corsairs SF-1200 for practically the same price. Is there going to be any kind of noticeable difference or should I go with my brand preference. Thanks in advance for any help.

according to this: http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1472/2/
the SF-1222 is often referred to as SF-1200 for short. and thus the 2 drives would be identical. Even their prices are identical.
where they could differ is:
flash chip selection
firmware
customer support

I would suggest you try to find a review of one or both. Or just go with either since they are bound to be extremely similar.

 

[Infrnl]

Somewhere I was reading that you should leave 10-20gb unpartitioned; especially if running a raid array. Is this neccessary? I think I read that it helps performance and/or the drive to perform better as it gets fuller. My info might not be totally accurate, but it was something to this extent.
I am getting ready to setup 2 128gb c300's in raid0 and just wanted to verify. I went ahead and left 20gb unpartitioned for now; I can always change it later. Thanks

 

[boozie]

I am struggling with some basic concepts for the SSD. Reading mobo specs on Newegg I don't see mention of AHCI anywhere, how do I determine if it has this? Is it a safe assumption that newer boards have this feature?

Is the common SSD connection through a SATA port? I see there are PCIe ones also but they appear to be more expensive.

I'm looking at buying a P67 mobo and am seeing a lot of mention about an SSD "dock" but I assumed the SATA ones just attached like a normal hard drive.

I went with the AsRock Extreme 4 as well. Not only is it cheaper by almost $40, you also get the USB 3.0 5.25 bay with a SSD dock on it. That alone saved me another $15-20 just on the adapter, or as much as $50 on not having to buy a case with USB 3.0.

(http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=31049496&postcount=10)

I'm guessing that post just means you can put your SSD at the same spot as the 3.0 USB adapter in the front of your computer. Sorry if the answers are right in front of my face, I read through the first page of this thread and one of the links and wasn't able to figure it out. Thanks for any help.

 

[taltamir]

Somewhere I was reading that you should leave 10-20gb unpartitioned; especially if running a raid array. Is this neccessary? I think I read that it helps performance and/or the drive to perform better as it gets fuller. My info might not be totally accurate, but it was something to this extent.
I am getting ready to setup 2 128gb c300's in raid0 and just wanted to verify. I went ahead and left 20gb unpartitioned for now; I can always change it later. Thanks

it depends on the drive, it might only helps if you have never partitioned that space (aka, after a secure erase), and it is not necessary if the drive has enough spare area. with GC or TRIM the drive can consider ALL free space as spare area. so trim really helps in this regards

I am struggling with some basic concepts for the SSD. Reading mobo specs on Newegg I don't see mention of AHCI anywhere

Look up the mobo and see what southbridge it has. with intel it will be ICH#XX where # is a number and XX are optional letters. EX: ICH9R, you can tell based on which one it uses.

how do I determine if it has this? Is it a safe assumption that newer boards have this feature?

not necessarily, its better not to assume and to actually know.

Is the common SSD connection through a SATA port?

Yes

I see there are PCIe ones also but they appear to be more expensive.

Those are actually a RAID controller + Several SSDs in RAID0 all on one card. also available in one box (ex: colossus) and you can just do it yourself by using raid0 of several SATA SSDs...
there is no real difference between them, use whatever you want, IF you want to go the raid0 route.

I'm looking at buying a P67 mobo and am seeing a lot of mention about an SSD "dock" but I assumed the SATA ones just attached like a normal hard drive.
(http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=31049496&postcount=10)

I'm guessing that post just means you can put your SSD at the same spot as the 3.0 USB adapter in the front of your computer. Sorry if the answers are right in front of my face, I read through the first page of this thread and one of the links and wasn't able to figure it out. Thanks for any help.

that is just a box that goes in your big drive slot (where your DVD drive is) that holds the SSD and connects it to the PC via USB3.
It sounds stupid and kinda pointless... you are much better off using SATA than USB to connect your SSD.

 

[UpstartXT]

Has anyone heard of Tony Trim or Hyperfast Diskeeper?

I have two Intel X-25m SSDs that are G1 (meaning they cannot do TRIM and Intel SSD Toolbox can not optimize them).

I am looking for some sort of option for increasing performance. I have checked these two things out, but they confuse me because they look like they do defragmentation, which I keep hearing is the one thing you don't want to do with an SSD.

 

[Zap]

Do you feel that performance is way below what it was when new? Some of that could be contributed to Windows getting cluttered. Otherwise, yeah, you will experience less performance than new.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2738/15

When drives ship with ATA-TRIM support, hopefully late this year, they will do a better job of staying closer to their maximum performance. But the problem won’t be solved completely.

Your best bet for making that SSD perform like a virgin is to back up your data, do a secure erase and then do a fresh install of Windows 7. That way you get the SSD back in pristine form, and Windows uncluttered.

Still, even in a reduced performance state, your SSD should still outperform hard drives.

BTW, read performance should not be affected much, only writes, so stuff should still run super fast off an SSD.

 

[UpstartXT]

Well I'm not really sure whether it's much different than when I first used the drive. If it gradually degraded, then I wouldn't have noticed a stark difference. I have my SSDs on a gaming computer, which, once the game is installed, doesn't really require much writing to the drive, just a lot of reading. As you said, the read performance as I understand it should not be too greatly affected.

That being said, if there is something free, or at least pretty cheap, that I can do to improve the performance of my computer, I'm interested.

I have heard of methods such as Tony Trim and Hyperfast Diskeeper that will group all of your "free space" together, and then write a bunch of 1's on all the sectors. Meanwhile your data remains intact. This supposedly greatly helps write speeds.

Seperate question: if I did a secure erase and then restored using a WHS backup, that would work as well, correct? I have a WHS, although I've never had to use it to restore so I'm not sure how it works.

 

[boozie]

Had a few more noobie SSD questions.

I need clarification on

Make sure you have MBR partition and run as administrator

I really don't know what that is referring to, I read in this thread about manually aligning a partition (don't know anything about this), is that applicable to me if I use Win 7 64-bit?

I also wanted to just make sure you can update firmware mid-use without need of formatting or anything.

 

[Zap]

I have heard of methods such as Tony Trim and Hyperfast Diskeeper that will group all of your "free space" together, and then write a bunch of 1's on all the sectors. Meanwhile your data remains intact. This supposedly greatly helps write speeds.

It also is not 100% guaranteed to refresh performance(do a search, some have SLOWER performance afterwards). However, it IS 100% guaranteed to reduce the lifespan of your SSD.

Seperate question: if I did a secure erase and then restored using a WHS backup, that would work as well, correct? I have a WHS, although I've never had to use it to restore so I'm not sure how it works.

I don't have an answer for you on this, as I've never used WHS and there is lots of conflicting info regarding image restoration.

I really don't know what that is referring to, I read in this thread about manually aligning a partition (don't know anything about this), is that applicable to me if I use Win 7 64-bit?

I don't know what you are referring to either. Have you read the first part of this thread about installing with Windows 7? If so, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

Specifically... if you are lazy and don't want to read it all, read just this section.

I also wanted to just make sure you can update firmware mid-use without need of formatting or anything.

Here's a real question.

I'm not aware of any SSD firmware update that keeps your data. AFAIK they always lose your data.

Note that there are only a few instances of needing to update firmware. They are either to add a major feature (Intel G2 and Indilinx got Trim during their early days, but that doesn't happen every day) or to do a major bug fix (Crucial C300 had bricking issues initially, often OCZ drives are sold as essentially beta).

I should add this to the sticky.

 

[boozie]

I don't know what you are referring to either. Have you read the first part of this thread about installing with Windows 7? If so, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

Specifically... if you are lazy and don't want to read it all, read just this section.

I did read the entire first page which you would have read if you read your own thread. Specifically... if you are lazy and don't want to read it all read just this section

See I can be smug too. I am just looking for some understanding. I do appreciate this thread, and your help, but no need for calling me out. What's obvious to you isn't necessarily obvious to me.

Your Win 7 installation doesn't talk about partitions, I don't know if that means they are unnecessary, automatically included, or need manual installation for optimum SSD performance. All I know is win 7 supports them from your post. I am a novice, if that means I shouldn't be posting here then fine.

 

[Zap]

See I can be smug too.

Nice. Soon you will be creating your own stickies.

taltamir appears to have answered your earlier questions, so IDK why you are linking to them again.

My reference to "I don't know what you are referring to either" is for your quote of "Make sure you have MBR partition and run as administrator."

Your Win 7 installation doesn't talk about partitions, I don't know if that means they are unnecessary, automatically included, or need manual installation for optimum SSD performance.

It was answered with "That's it!"

It was also prefaced with

Solid State Drives are not rocket science. Too many people try too hard and over-think these things.

"But don't I have to..."

No.

"How about..."

No.

"Should I do..."

No.

"How does it compare..."

No.

Just read the rest of this post. It tells you EVERYTHING you NEED to know/do with an SSD (for Win7 at least). There is NOTHING else that is needed. NOTHING!

Got that, tiny grasshopper?

I think I added that a couple days ago. Today's edit was in regards to upgrading firmware.

Alright, just for you, I will edit that post again to add what Windows 7 does automagically during the install.

BTW your sarcasm meter is broke. I'm just sayin'.

 

[boozie]

Nice. Soon you will be creating your own stickies.

Don't you mean sticky?

taltamir appears to have answered your earlier questions, so IDK why you are linking to them again.

I was being facetious to your rudeness masked as sarcasm but I guess it went over your head... or you can say you were being sarcastic again after the fact.

All things considered, I got my answers so thank you. Breaking through mainstream/pre-built systems to building your own is not an easy task so try to cut me a little slack and I'll try not to overreact in the future.

 

[magreen]

. . .
Here's a real question.

I'm not aware of any SSD firmware update that keeps your data. AFAIK they always lose your data.

. . .

I'm fairly certain the Intel x25-m g2 firmware update does not cause loss of data.

 

[taltamir]

I'm fairly certain the Intel x25-m g2 firmware update does not cause loss of data.

NONE of the intel firmware updates (G1 either) caused loss of data. And only the early indilinx updates caused dataloss

 

[hal2kilo]

I am struggling with some basic concepts for the SSD. Reading mobo specs on Newegg I don't see mention of AHCI anywhere, how do I determine if it has this? Is it a safe assumption that newer boards have this feature?

Is the common SSD connection through a SATA port? I see there are PCIe ones also but they appear to be more expensive.

I'm looking at buying a P67 mobo and am seeing a lot of mention about an SSD "dock" but I assumed the SATA ones just attached like a normal hard drive.



(http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=31049496&postcount=10)

I'm guessing that post just means you can put your SSD at the same spot as the 3.0 USB adapter in the front of your computer. Sorry if the answers are right in front of my face, I read through the first page of this thread and one of the links and wasn't able to figure it out. Thanks for any help.

Relax. All modern Mobos support AHCI. Yes all SSDs physically have SATA interfaces, as a matter of fact, you'd be hard pressed to find one that isn't SATA II at minimum. SATA IIIs exist and more are coming out all the time. PCI's theoretically might have faster throughput, but are mainly for people that don't have a spare SATA port. This really isn't rocket science.

 

[taltamir]

Relax. All modern Mobos support AHCI. Yes all SSDs physically have SATA interfaces, as a matter of fact, you'd be hard pressed to find one that isn't SATA II at minimum. SATA IIIs exist and more are coming out all the time. PCI's theoretically might have faster throughput, but are mainly for people that don't have a spare SATA port. This really isn't rocket science.

to clarify. PCIe has is faster. PCI (no e) is much slower... yea, its badly named.