New to Intel - What do I need to know?

[han0522]

Hello. I'm looking to build a computer in the near future. I've always built my comp.s using AMD cpus because, imo, they were more cost effective. Obviously this is no longer the case (again, imo).

Since I'm new to the Intel world, is there any advice that I need to know? For instance, is there a preferrable chipset I need to look for (looking to buy a 2.8C ghz cpu). I'm gearing up for HL2 and needed to upgrade anyway, just to show you my goal.

Also, I keep hearing that Intel likes to change socket standards. Will this be a major issue in the 800 fsb cpus?

It's late so I know I'm forgetting some questions. I'll prolly be on tomorrow to ask more.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Adul]

they will be changing sockets again next year to the socket T. I am not exactly sure when, but you have at least a years life left in the current socket.

 

[Budman]

New to Intel - What do I need to know?

You need to know that no matter what you do AMD people will try to tell you that AMD is better.

 

[Budman]

I am no Intel freak !!!

buy what you can afford, To hell with loyayties !!! it just happens that now a 2.4C is a real deal. but hey so is a 2500+ barton !!!


let your budget dictate you rig.


Like one AT member once said, ( RED DAWN) " I am a hardware whore & will buy whathever's cheapest & fastest at the time" . I am the same.


Quote might be wrong, Red feel free to correct me.

 

[DaTT]

As for Intel changing thier sockets, I don't think it happens that much, except when a new generation is born. Socket370 was around for a long time. They did, however, tale out the socket 423 rather quickly to replace it with the 478 which is now the current one. If you plan on getting a P4c, just make sure you get a 800MHz board (HT)

 

[Budman]

New to Intel - What do I need to know?

You need to get an 800 fsb cpu & a 865 or 875 chipset mobo. Get a Asus or Abit then you cant go wrong.

 

[wetcat007]

Originally posted by: Budman

New to Intel - What do I need to know?

You need to know that no matter what you do AMD people will try to tell you that AMD is better.

heh same with Intel people

 

[Slogun]

What budman said...

I was in the same boat as you.
Last 3 systems I built were AMD, was ready for an upgrade now to play all thiose great games coming out soon.
There are some big hardware improvements coming along in the next 6 months to a year, many of which will not be compatible with what we buy now (new CPUs, PCI express, no more agp, etc), but we need to upgrade now, right?

I'm thrilled with the new P4 system i built.

"You need to get an 800 fsb cpu(that would be a P4C) & a 865 or 875 (875 is the top chipset)chipset mobo. Get a Asus or Abit then you cant go wrong. "

You will also need to know about recent advances in HSF. The stock Intel HSF works just fine (and is a cinch to install compared to the old ziff clips), but the Zalman CNPS7000A-AlCu is quiet and efficient(and beautiful).

 

[han0522]

Thanks for all the replies.

Budman, you speaketh the truth. I frequent the an amd forum and didn't post anything there because I knew I wouldn't get any useful feedback.

Yeah, right now the performance/price ratio is with Intel, therefore I buy intel, imo.

Alright, Asus or Abit, 875 chipset. I think I'll wait for the P4EE to come out and see if that drops the price abit on the 2.8C-3.2C ghz. What about Ram? Can I use the same 'ole PC3200 DDR Ram or is there something else I need to be looking for?

I guess while I'm posting, I might as well ask:
As far as video cards go, I'm considering:
ATI 9700 Pro
ATI 9800
ATI 9800 Pro

I'm looking to spend between $200-$250 on the video card (I'm waiting [hopefully] for the 9800 Pro prices to drop a bit). Are there any thoughts concerning this?

Thanks for all the replies and the info!

 

[apoppin]

I'm pretty interested in this thread since my MB died (Soyo TISU POS).

What's the current best "bang for the buck" for an O/C'er?

Need (1)case, (2)MB, (3)CPU and (4)RAM

(and I already know I will get a 9700Pro).

Quick . . . before my Notebook's HD fails too.

 

[Slogun]

3 CPUs?

P4C 2.4 is obviously cheapest, but 2.6 and 2.8 will o'clock further.
The Asus and Abit 875 boards are know to overclock well, get whatever you can find cheapest. (Abit has a great new windows-based BIOS flash utiity that is very helpful,though other brands may have it too by now).

My Corsair PC3200 RAM works great. PC3500 and up are supposed to overclock better, but the price/performance ratio may not work for those without money to burn.

Video cards are the same story, Radeon 9800 Pro will perform the best, again it's the old price/performance ratio that is a very personal matter.

I'm still using my old Ti4200, waiting for the last minute before HL2 comes out to grab a 9800Pro (maybe a discount coupon with the game? doubt it but there are rumors)

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Slogun
3 CPUs?

P4C 2.4 is obviously cheapest, but 2.6 and 2.8 will o'clock further.
The Asus and Abit 875 boards are know to overclock well, get whatever you can find cheapest. (Abit has a great new windows-based BIOS flash utiity that is very helpful,though other brands may have it too by now).

My Corsair PC3200 RAM works great. PC3500 and up are supposed to overclock better, but the price/performance ratio may not work for those without money to burn.

Video cards are the same story, Radeon 9800 Pro will perform the best, again it's the old price/performance ratio that is a very personal matter.

I'm still using my old Ti4200, waiting for the last minute before HL2 comes out to grab a 9800Pro (maybe a discount coupon with the game? doubt it but there are rumors)

Mahalo.

So the 2.4 should make 3 Ghz? Any specific stepping?

I'll toss a coin on the MB depending on price . . .

CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB 64MX64 PC-3200C2PT is $123 at NewEgg. If I am "only" looking to push a 2.4 to near 3.0Ghz isn't it overkill?

I was gonna put up with an O/C'd Tualatin Celeron and a Rad 8500 for HL2 . . . The 9700Pro will be plenty for me.

What about a case? Enlight? I am guessing 350w is plenty.

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

[Slogun]

That is the memory I have. I don't think it's overkill, I think it's pretty much a nesessity to get an overclock like that that's stable. Get less costly RAM and you may have some headaches.

I've seen some recent posts about overclocking the 2.4C to about 3.2 GHz, I've got my 2.6C up to about 3.3GHz, but I am a noob to overclocking (abit and Asus make it pretty easy through BIOS).
There are a number of variables to look at when overclocking, but the details are specific to the mobo brand I believe.
You can get an idea in the Asus and Abit 875 stickied threads.

350W is plenty. I think Antec cases/power supplies are most revered without going super premium.

 

[han0522]

Alright, after reading through Tom's review of 24 intel mobo's I've narrowed my search for a mobo to these:

Abit IC7
Abit IS7
Asus P4P800
MSI 875P
MSI 865PE Neo2

I'm looking to spend no more than $150 on a good stable mobo. I don't PLAN on overclocking any, but that can change.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Slogun
That is the memory I have. I don't think it's overkill, I think it's pretty much a nesessity to get an overclock like that that's stable. Get less costly RAM and you may have some headaches.

I've seen some recent posts about overclocking the 2.4C to about 3.2 GHz, I've got my 2.6C up to about 3.3GHz, but I am a noob to overclocking (abit and Asus make it pretty easy through BIOS).
There are a number of variables to look at when overclocking, but the details are specific to the mobo brand I believe.
You can get an idea in the Asus and Abit 875 stickied threads.

350W is plenty. I think Antec cases/power supplies are most revered without going super premium.

Thanks.

I am going super-cheap - 2.4C it is . . . I don't need an extreme O/C - close to 3Ghz would be satisfactory for me.

And when I (finally) get the parts, I will spend some time reading the O/C'ing threads.

Whatever I get, will b e a major upgrade over my current meltdown . . .
(but I'd better fix the mess so I can sell it)

Abit IC7
Abit IS7
Asus P4P800
MSI 875P
MSI 865PE Neo2

Strangely, these are the same MBs I am looking at and hopefully under $150 . . . gotta find a hot deal while my notebook is still holding up.

 

[Slogun]

Well, some of those boards are 865 and some are 875 chipset.

If you can find one of those brands in an 875 under $150 then you might want to jump on it.

I have the Abit IC7-G Max II, the Max III has come out and the Max II still goes for about $180 at Newegg.

I remember when I was thinking about maybe getting an 865 chipset I was seriously considering the neo.

 

[apoppin]

Abit had a few problems awhile back (cheap capacitors) but was good to me (eventually) with my BX board.
The IC7 does look nice.

However, it seems that all of the above MBs will support a 2.4 @ 3Ghz. The 875 chipset requiring better RAM (right?)

 

[orion7144]

Originally posted by: Slogun
That is the memory I have. I don't think it's overkill, I think it's pretty much a nesessity to get an overclock like that that's stable. Get less costly RAM and you may have some headaches.

I've seen some recent posts about overclocking the 2.4C to about 3.2 GHz, I've got my 2.6C up to about 3.3GHz, but I am a noob to overclocking (abit and Asus make it pretty easy through BIOS).
There are a number of variables to look at when overclocking, but the details are specific to the mobo brand I believe.
You can get an idea in the Asus and Abit 875 stickied threads.

350W is plenty. I think Antec cases/power supplies are most revered without going super premium.

You may want to rethink that statement if you are going to OC. I had a 420W with my IC7G and was unstable however as soon as I put my new Antec 550 in it it was fine. The 420 works great on a 845 board.

I have 3 2.4C's and 2 of them are at 3.4gig easy and the other one is at 3gig but that is in a cheapo board and is being done by software.

 

[pm]

Keeping in mind that my end goal is primarily highest performance and reliability at the cheapest price, I'd recommend:

Asus P4P800
512MB Crucial DDR400
Intel Pentium 4 2.4GHz w/ 800 FSB

I personally bought:
Asus P4C800-E Deluxe
1024MB Crucial DDR400 ECC

for my CPU. But I use mine frequently for CPU simulations and really wanted ECC due to the length of the simulations and the altitude that I'm at. I was seeing an ECC hit every couple of weeks on my old system.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: orion7144

Originally posted by: Slogun
That is the memory I have. I don't think it's overkill, I think it's pretty much a nesessity to get an overclock like that that's stable. Get less costly RAM and you may have some headaches.

I've seen some recent posts about overclocking the 2.4C to about 3.2 GHz, I've got my 2.6C up to about 3.3GHz, but I am a noob to overclocking (abit and Asus make it pretty easy through BIOS).
There are a number of variables to look at when overclocking, but the details are specific to the mobo brand I believe.
You can get an idea in the Asus and Abit 875 stickied threads.

350W is plenty. I think Antec cases/power supplies are most revered without going super premium.

You may want to rethink that statement if you are going to OC. I had a 420W with my IC7G and was unstable however as soon as I put my new Antec 550 in it it was fine. The 420 works great on a 845 board.

I have 3 2.4C's and 2 of them are at 3.4gig easy and the other one is at 3gig but that is in a cheapo board and is being done by software.

I can't agree. Perhaps 420w is necessary for an extreme O/C. The amount of wattage necessary has been debated endlessly here and I am one that thinks a 350w Enlight will handle what I will throw at it.

Thanks for the suggestions.

BTW, pm, I guess you are not interested in O/Cing.
(ECC would be way overkill for my "gaming" system.)

 

[SkaarjMaster]

Out of the MBs you're considering and others mentioned, I would get the Asus P4C800-E Deluxe.

I'm building a new system in about 5 months and getting a Soyo Dragon2 I875 MB, P4 3.2 CPU, ATI Radeon 9800Pro 256MB, 2 WD 200GB HDs, DVD-RAM drive, Creative SB Audigy2, Samsung 19" 955DF monitor, Antec True 550W PS, etc. I'm still not sure about the heatsink but am looking at the Thermaltake Spark 7+ Xaser Edition and the Zalman mentioned above. I'm also hoping a lot of this stuff goes down in price some before then.

I have two questions for anyone:

1. How do you find out when new Intel CPUs and MB chipsets are being released? The 3.2s and I875Ps have been out for a while, when are the new ones going to be released?

2. I'm not overclocking, so what RAM should I get? I usually get Crucial, but will most likely get Corsair this time. I'm looking at the XMS PC3200 1024 ECC (2x512) versions, but am also wondering besides aggressive default memory timings of the MB what would be the advantage of getting PC3500, PC3700 or PC4000?

Thanks.

 

[han0522]

I've been thinking about this and am starting to consider the idea of overclocking. Sounds like alot of people here are o/c'ing. Could a 2.6 or 2.8 o/c to around 3.0 or 3.2 without stability problems? I assume this is done by increasing the fsb. Also, would Crucial ram be ideal for o/c'ing?

Alright, I've been looking at these motherboards and have narrowed things down to these:

Asus P4P800 (865) - $133
MSI 875P - $145
MSI 865PE Neo2 - $105

Also, after looking at Asus' mobos (I've purchased three Asus boards for my AMD cpus) I'm considering the P4C800 Deluxe ($170), even though it is a little over my price range.

My question is will the P4C800 really offer me significantly better performance for the price? The mobo I'm leaning toward the most is the MSI 865PE Neo2 because it out performed many of the 875's and 865's in Tom's review here. and, obviously, it is the cheapest out of all of them. However, the P4P800, again, according to tom, is "The Only One With Activated PAT". Honestly, I don't know much about this feature other than it should boost performance.

If the P4C800 is truly superior and worth the extra $70, then of course I will purchase this mobo.

I think pm put it best:
"... my end goal is primarily highest performance and reliability at the cheapest price ..."

Ugh, and after re-reading pm's post, I'm starting to lean toward P4P800 ...

Too many decisions!!

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: han0522
I've been thinking about this and am starting to consider the idea of overclocking. Sounds like alot of people here are o/c'ing. Could a 2.6 or 2.8 o/c to around 3.0 or 3.2 without stability problems? I assume this is done by increasing the fsb. Also, would Crucial ram be ideal for o/c'ing?

Alright, I've been looking at these motherboards and have narrowed things down to these:

Asus P4P800 (865) - $133
MSI 875P - $145
MSI 865PE Neo2 - $105

Also, after looking at Asus' mobos (I've purchased three Asus boards for my AMD cpus) I'm considering the P4C800 Deluxe ($170), even though it is a little over my price range.

My question is will the P4C800 really offer me significantly better performance for the price? The mobo I'm leaning toward the most is the MSI 865PE Neo2 because it out performed many of the 875's and 865's in Tom's review here. and, obviously, it is the cheapest out of all of them. However, the P4P800, again, according to tom, is "The Only One With Activated PAT". Honestly, I don't know much about this feature other than it should boost performance.

If the P4C800 is truly superior and worth the extra $70, then of course I will purchase this mobo.

I think pm put it best:
"... my end goal is primarily highest performance and reliability at the cheapest price ..."

Ugh, and after re-reading pm's post, I'm starting to lean toward P4P800 ...

Too many decisions!!

pm NEVER o/c's!

 

[Slogun]

Originally posted by: SkaarjMaster
Out of the MBs you're considering and others mentioned, I would get the Asus P4C800-E Deluxe.

I'm building a new system in about 5 months and getting a Soyo Dragon2 I875 MB, P4 3.2 CPU, ATI Radeon 9800Pro 256MB, 2 WD 200GB HDs, DVD-RAM drive, Creative SB Audigy2, Samsung 19" 955DF monitor, Antec True 550W PS, etc. I'm still not sure about the heatsink but am looking at the Thermaltake Spark 7+ Xaser Edition and the Zalman mentioned above. I'm also hoping a lot of this stuff goes down in price some before then.

I have two questions for anyone:

1. How do you find out when new Intel CPUs and MB chipsets are being released? The 3.2s and I875Ps have been out for a while, when are the new ones going to be released?

2. I'm not overclocking, so what RAM should I get? I usually get Crucial, but will most likely get Corsair this time. I'm looking at the XMS PC3200 1024 ECC (2x512) versions, but am also wondering besides aggressive default memory timings of the MB what would be the advantage of getting PC3500, PC3700 or PC4000?

Thanks.

Wow, that all sounds great. Sure, the prices of all those things are likely to have dropped, but who knows what may be available 5 months hence.
That's quite a long time in the world of hardware.
5 months from now might take us very close to seeing some radical hardware changes including new CPUs from both AMD and Intel; PCI Express; and the obsolescence of the AGP port along with the obsolescence of all of today's top video cards.

 

[Wingznut]

Fwiw....

• I bought an Abit IS7 a couple of months ago, and I couldn't be happier.
• After owning four MSI boards in the past, I don't think I'll be rushing out anytime soon to buy another.
• I've owned six Asus boards, and loved every one of them.

Imho, get whichever Abit or Asus board (and chipset) fits your budget. You'll be happy either way.

Oh yeah, you certainly don't NEED a 550w power supply. If you get a quality 350w, you won't have a problem. (Conversely, if you get a crappy 500w, you'll probably have issues.)