Ok, gonna reply to multiple posts in one, here:
Originally posted by: FishTankXOh by the way, did you notice that in all implementations of RDRAM that RDRAM is capped at PC1333?
Considering that Rambus has FAR more scalable technologies like Yellowstone, I would hope that they'd put RDRAM to bed someday. Believe me, RDRAM is NOT the most exciting product coming out of Rambus. RDRAM isn't the future. Technologies like Yellowstone are.
I know the JEDEC sloth wants to use their fabs for as long as possible, but there comes a time where you're just holding back the industry as a result. JEDEC's been good at that
So what's the point of this thread anyway?? Am I supposed to switch to RIMM, confess that I bought DDR from money losing idiots, and/or buy Rambo stock to help the price go up?
No, you can use whatever the heck you want
It's all Rambus technology anyway... It's just that DDR is what's driving the semiconductor industry down because they're dumping it at a loss for reasons that have been beat to death in this thread (but no one wants to acknowledge because they bought it at such a great price).
But good or bad, RIMM is dead as long as Intel wants it to be dead.
Maybe... That possibility ALWAYS exists. Again, there's more to Rambus than RDRAM. And Intel is going to need a competitor to this PC1200 quad channel thing.
Long live AMD, DDR and bubble ram.
Tell that to AMD investors (15 years of profits wiped out this year alone).
OH! And Hynix investors (2 bailouts from the government, now being subsidized by government controlled banks).
OH! And Infineon investors (just lost in court to Rambus even though they had the Great Kenneth Starr, losing $200M per quarter, and a parent company that is considering pulling them out of the memory business completely)
And let's not forget Micron investors ($2b lost in the past 2 years, now taking out loans to stay in business, just laid off 10%, including 650 workers at a single plant alone).
Yeah. Long live AMD, DDR and Bubble Ram indeed. The major players in your "Long Live" category are all on the Rollercoaster to Ruin. I'd be more careful about who to be a cheerleader for
As for cheap DDR, the computer industry is in a serious economic slump, and it always follows that low market demand and the resulting excess manufacturing capacity leads to higher costs, price cutting and hard times.
That must be why Samsung Semiconductor is doing well
RESEARCH, people... RESEARCH. UNDERSTAND why semiconductor markets are failing. And UNDERSTAND why there's some that are standing despite poor market conditions. Geez
Spreading RIMM production capacity over a greater number of manucturers, as Intel had planned to do, would have done nothing but shift the current losses from DDR to RIMM production.
It's impossible to say for sure, but it's certainly POSSIBLE. But Rambus *the company* wouldn't have to care. They'd see their royalties no matter what. The Dram industry NEEDS consolidation. There's too many competitors trying to edge each other out, and so far only ONE is doing well. Samsung.
And, uh, I don't think it's a result of excellent DDR sales because DDR sales aren't helping ANY OTHER DRAM MANUFACTURER. You can believe whatever you want here, but I can tell you one thing: Sony isn't going broke making PS2's, and they have to get their RDRAM from somewhere. Dell also has to sell their 850E based Dimensions, and they have to be getting their RDRAM from somewhere.
There simply is not enough total computer demand to support ram manufacturing capacity, of any kind.
This I agree with completely. Consolidation is needed, case closed.
As for Rambus making money while DDR makers lose their arses: in September 2001 Intel ageed to pay Rambus a $40million/year fixed fee for 5 years. That subsidy constitutes 40% of Rambus revenue and 113% of its profits. In other words, Rambus is losing a couple of million bucks on whatever the hll else they do to pay their salaries.
Licensing agreements are what IP companies *DO*. They live and die by their patents. There *IS* no "Whatever the hell else they do". They develop and license intellectual property. This is their lifeline. They don't manufacture anything.
2002 is the first year they started collecting on Intel's cross-licensing agreements. They have several years before that well dries up. And even so, this year they start collecting on RaSeR with multiple networking equipment vendors. Next year, they collect on Yellowstone with Toshiba & Sony money. Intel has ALREADY stated that they will continue to use Rambus for their networking products, even if they decide to pull them out of their desktop roadmaps (which won't last).
I don't have enough incentive to research it but from looking at their P&L I suspect that another significant chunk of Rambus profit is coming from the royalties they have managed to extract from other money losing ram makers. So imo RIMM is not quite the profit maker that it's proported to be in this thread.
I'm talking about subsidizing losses, which is clearly what Samsung (and now Elpida) is doing.
Also, I think people are forgetting that Rambus owns DDR and SDRAM. They're entitled to 3% on each, and now thanks to the infineon loss in court, $1B in back royalties. If you EVER bought SDRAM or DDR, you've already supported Rambus, whether you like it or not. Rambus already collects royalties from every other major DRAM manufacturer with the exception of the "big three" (Hynix, Infineon, Micron) and has been for years now. Now that Infineon lost in court, the last 3 will have to pay up.
Samsung sells ALOT more than just memory buddy...plus what does making profit have to do with making a specific memory? I fail to see where you get the idea that RDRAM saves business. I'm sure there are other factors.
When I talk about Samsung in this context, I am talking ONLY about Samsung Semiconductor. I am NOT talking about their gains or losses in other business units.
And i'm not saying that RDRAM saves businesses. I'm saying that Samsung, thus far, has been able to subsidize their losses in DDR sales with RDRAM profits. If you look at the SDRAM/DDR-only manufacturers, you can plainly see that they're bleeding money. So, is DDR their "Holy Grail"?
A smart person would say "time for a new product that can make us some money". Samung did just that
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