New Processor = Dead Windows

[ianbergman]

OK... so I just replaced my 1.4ghz Athlon with an AthlonXP 2100+ Palomino. Got it in there, powered up, and boom, Windows XP Pro won't load. I've gotten a variety of exceptions and error messages, but most recently it'll get all the way to the account selection screen, and then as soon as you click "log in" it will go to a blue screen saying there's an error in ntfs.sys.

If I slow the FSB down to 100mhz, all of a sudden the computer thinks it has an XP 1500+ -- and everything works just fine. But anytime I go back to 133mhz, no matter the CPU multiplier setting, I get the same problems. Any ideas? Maybe I got a bum processor? Maybe Windows is on crack? All suggestions appreciated.

Thanks!

EDIT: oh yeah, and the relevant specs are --

motherboard: <FONT face=Tahoma>MSI K7T266 Pro2
processor: athlonxp 2100+
ram: 768mb crucial pc2100</FONT>

 

[mechBgon]

Double-check that you don't have your heatsink reversed, causing overheating issues.

 

[ianbergman]

check. processor's running at about 60c, which seems warm to me, but the heatsink is correctly attached, with thermal compound, and the fan is going strong.

 

[ianbergman]

edited out -- no longer true for some reason

 

[mechBgon]

Weird. How about opening the case, and positioning a house fan pointing at the motherboard and CPU to add extra cooling, and see if that helps?

 

[BigDog1]

You are certainly having the classic symdoms of bios settings that are too aggressive and/or overheating. Overheating always triggers problems if your machine is running on the edge.

You didn't mention if you have unlocked your 2100 -- I assume the 2100 is factory multiplier locked? If they are, you can't change the multiplier. It will either cause problems, or just be ignored.

I would start by checking my memory settings in CMOS setup, and back them off. If that doesn't get it, try selecting "Load optimized defaults" if your setup program has that. Look carefully at the various bus speeds to make sure one part is not being accidentally overclocked (memory speed, PCI bus speed, CPU external clock speed).

I'm not familiar with the available settings on MSI boards, but if they provide you a way to kick up the CPU and/or memory voltage you may try nudging them up a quarter volt or so. If they let you adjust the FSB and CPU bus, you might try backing them down a few mhz. Also back off on your AGP settings and see if that helps. I'm real familiar with Abit boards, and their Softmenu setup system is great -- it lets you tweak virtually everything.

You may find one setting that makes the difference.

 

[ianbergman]

well... i'm beginning to think this really is a lost cause, but i don't want to blame the processor because it works @ 100mhz FSB. I confused.

I've tried backing the memory off to all kinds of low-performance settings, including the BIOS defaults. I've been going through settings like crazy, but I hadn't messed with the AGP settings yet.

question -- could something be causing errors w/my IDE controller? I just realized I hadn't mentioned (or thought of, until right now) the fact that all of my HDs are on a PCI IDE controller... hmm... i think i'll move my primary drive to the mobo just for kicks.

BigDog1, what do you mean by unlocking the 1700? But yes, i've been tweaking BIOS settings like crazy. I have options to change just about everything in the BIOS.

agh. gonna shoot myself. or my computer.

 

[Freejack2]

1st possibility, you have the cpu:memory ratio set wrong. If you have a cpu:memory ratio of 3:4 then at 100mhz fsb the memory is running at 100 x 1.33= 133mhz (pc2100), but at 133fsb, the memory is running at 133*1.33=176mhz. Above what even crucial can handle. Check your bios to see what the cpu:memory ratio is.
2nd possibility, your heatsink isn't doing it's job. If it's a new heatsink, did you put a heatsink compound on it. If so did you remove the old compound, hell did you remember to remove the plastic cover over the compound. Some of the best techs have done that.
3rd possibility, some hardware failure, good luck tracking down this nightmare. See if you can put your cpu and memory in someone elses computer or borrow a motherboard.

 

[BigDog1]

Athlon XPs are multiplier locked at the factory to prevent people from buying, for example, a 1.0 ghz CPU to run on a 100mhz front side bus, and running it at 1.2 ghz on that same bus by changing the multiplier from 10x to 12x (ie, overclocking it).

Do a google search on "Athlon XP Unlocking" to find a bunch of articles on how to do the unlocking. But if you didn't unlock it, then you must run it at the factory-set multiplier.

I think all the Athlon XP processors are designed to run on a 133mhz FSB (but not certain). Anyway, the 2100 is a 1.73 ghz processor, and dividing that by 133mhz gives a multiplier of 13.0 ((13.0 x 133 MHz = 1733 MHz).

You have probably already done this, but take a look at the top of the CPU with a magnifying glass and make sure it really is a 2100. Then look up the specs on your MB and double check that it can support the 2100 at 133mhz.

If you end up not finding anything wrong, then you probably need to try the CPU and memory on a different mobo. It doesn't seem likely to me that the CPU is bad if it will run at a slower fsb speed.

You can get a good rock-solid used mobo such an Abit KR7A-Raid (which uses DDR memory) for about $50.

Also, I very much agree with FreeJack2 to make sure the bus ratios between your CPU and Memory are OK. In many bios setup programs you can change the ratio between the speed the CPU runs at, and the speed the memory runs at. They do this so, for example, you could run a CPU designed for a 100mhz bus with memory that is designed for (capable of) running on a 133mhz bus.

Good luck dude.

 

[ianbergman]

Memory ratio is OK - my board doesn't actually use a ratio, but instead uses FSB speed, or FSB + - 33mhz. I tried running the memory at 100mhz just for kicks with the FSB at 133; still made no difference.

heatsink gets hot enough that it appears to be doing its job. I really don't think heat is a problem, because measured temperatures are typically under 60 degrees c. Warm, but not too warm, esp for an athlon.

Part of what confuses me is that the crash is extremely predictable - Windows will load to the login screen, but as soon as you select an account and press enter, the machine will either freeze up completely (the XP login symbol will move to the center of the screen as normal, but the freeze happens before it disappears to load the desktop), or I'll get a bluescreen with an ntfs.sys error. Always, the problem happens at this stage.

Does anyone know what XP is doing in those milliseconds after you submit the login information? It doesn't matter how long I leave the computer sitting at the login screen; the problem won't occur until I actually try to log in.

Anyway, I think i found another machine to drop the processor and RAM into, so we'll see how that goes. thanks for all the suggestions!

 

[RemyCanad]

If you find that non of what has been suggested worked I would try a BIOS flash. The 266 was not the most stable of chipsets when it first came out.....

 

[ianbergman]

Originally posted by: RemyCanad
If you find that non of what has been suggested worked I would try a BIOS flash. The 266 was not the most stable of chipsets when it first came out.....

Yeah. this is actually the 266A chipset, w/the latest BIOS (3.7). I think that it was released in October.

 

[ianbergman]

I just thought I'd post a follow-up in case anyone cared..

turns out it was an overheating issue. my mobo temp sensor had been reading much lower than it was running. Some new arctic silver 3, a new heatsink and fan, and all's well again. sigh. thanks for everyone's great advice!

 

[BigDog1]

Hey, thanks for the followup post. It was pretty much sounding like either an overheating problem or a memory problem. Glad you got it figured out. Yup, can't beat Artic Silver 3 and a good HSF combo! Starting with that and high quality memory eliminates many problems.