New Computer

[imported_casket]

Hi everyone, I am building a computer for the first time. I will be using it for surfing the web, some gaming, listening to music, watching movies, and some programming. I basically used your guide to build this machine. I think I am spending too much though, but I want quality parts meaning I would like to keep them for as long as possible. For items like CPU, Motherboard and RAM I realize they will constantly change but the other parts should last much longer. Also want the computer to be as quiet as possible. Here is what I have at the moment:

CPU
If prices go down I will get the 3200. Should I get newcastle or clawhammer at the point?

Motherboard
I want gigabit ethernet and SATA. I like what I have read about nforce3 as well.

RAM
I want a gig and this seems pretty cheap.

Case
I want a black case that I can have for a long time. Interested in a side window but don't have to have it

PSU
Looking for a quality PSU I can use for a long time

Video Card
Do I really need such a powerful vid card. Is it worth 80 more for a 6800? Really need help with this 1.

Sound Card
I listen to music quite often. Do I need a sound card? Is this the right card for me?

Hard Drive
I will have many songs and movies on my comp at any given time so I need a good amount of space.

DVD Burner
I will be burning gigs of data(music, movies and the like).

DVD Rom
Will probably copy dvds and cds.

Speakers
2.1 is all I am interested in getting

Monitor
My computer will be black so this monitor seems ok but kind of expensive. I don't mind spending more on quality parts that will last a while.

Keyboard and Mouse
I didn't really want wireless keyboard but I did want a black, ergonomic keyboard and this was my only choice.

Floppy Drive
Looking for a quality, quiet, floppy.

Surge Suppressor
Got to make sure this computer is protected right? I this too much protection?

So this comes out to around 1700 and I don't really want to spend that much if possible. All advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[stickybytes]

Originally posted by: casket

CPU
If prices go down I will get the 3200. Should I get newcastle or clawhammer at the point?

Clawhammer 3200+ is almost impossible to come by now, get the newcastle version if you plan on running stock. Also, prices for the amd chips dropped not too long ago (iirc mid august) so don't plan on it becoming any more cheaper.

Dump the sound card use onboard and save those extra 80 bucks towards your video card and get the 6800. If you planning to play doom 3 with all the settings cranked up, you need to go 6800. Plus it has SM3 support. Why get a video card that is outdated the moment you got it?

 

[RedShirt]

You could always go P4 and get one of those new fancy PCI Express motherboards and the 199 dollar (MSRP) 6600GT Videocard! Way better for the price.

 

[Mik3y]

for the mouse and keyboard, get the logitech cordless mx duo. it's much better for the same price.

 

[Balt]

Just a few comments:

If you are looking at cutting costs, the first thing I would do is give up aesthetics rather than performance. That means saving some money on that case.

Antec SLK3700AMB w/ 350w power supply. Antec PSUs are high quality and should run the system as you have it configured.

If you are only going to do some gaming, I would say that the 9800pro will keep you happy. No need to pay more for a 6800.

If you are an audiophile, you may want to spend money on a sound card, but.. I would say try the onboard audio first and if it just doesn't sound good enough for your tastes order the sound card at that point.

That surge suppressor is rather expensive. You can buy a UPS for that price and get better protection. I didn't do much searching but found this pretty quickly.

As for speakers and monitor, that's going to be a subjective call on your part. You may be happy with a pair of high quality headphones, or you may not.

Epox motherboards seem hit or miss, but I think that particular model got pretty good reviews. If you have done research and found some good reviews, go with it.

I like NEC monitors because they still include a three-year warranty (unlike their other big competitors), so I think you've made a pretty good choice in that regard.


That's all I have to offer. I know you said you wanted a nice case, but w/o sacrificing performance I don't know where else you can cut corners. Looks like a solid setup.

 

[Sonic587]

Originally posted by: casket
Hi everyone, I am building a computer for the first time. I will be using it for surfing the web, some gaming, listening to music, watching movies, and some programming. I basically used your guide to build this machine. I think I am spending too much though, but I want quality parts meaning I would like to keep them for as long as possible. For items like CPU, Motherboard and RAM I realize they will constantly change but the other parts should last much longer. Also want the computer to be as quiet as possible. Here is what I have at the moment:

CPU
If prices go down I will get the 3200. Should I get newcastle or clawhammer at the point?

Just get the Newcastle. The performance difference is very small between the two. Not worth it to spend more for a clawhammer, IMO.

Motherboard
I want gigabit ethernet and SATA. I like what I have read about nforce3 as well.

Good choice on the motherboard.

RAM
I want a gig and this seems pretty cheap.

RAM is fine.

Case
I want a black case that I can have for a long time. Interested in a side window but don't have to have it

I wouldn't get this. TT is overly flashy and I hear a lot of people complaining about wire management in their cases. Why not get a Antec Sonata or BQE?

PSU
Looking for a quality PSU I can use for a long time

Good choice on PSU. Upgrade it if you want (As your budget permits).

Video Card
Do I really need such a powerful vid card. Is it worth 80 more for a 6800? Really need help with this 1.

9800 Pro is probably a little bit of overkill for light gaming. It depends on what games you'll be playing, though.

Sound Card
I listen to music quite often. Do I need a sound card? Is this the right card for me?

Get the chaintech AV-710. It's supposed to be better for music than the Audigy line. And it's only about $25. Look at the http://www.head-fi.com forums on how to set it up.
http://www.newegg.com/app/view...=29-120-103&depa=1

Hard Drive
I will have many songs and movies on my comp at any given time so I need a good amount of space.

Good choice on the HDD.

DVD Burner
I will be burning gigs of data(music, movies and the like).

Good choice on the burner.

DVD Rom
Will probably copy dvds and cds.

Good choice on the DVDROM.

Speakers
2.1 is all I am interested in getting


Monitor
My computer will be black so this monitor seems ok but kind of expensive. I don't mind spending more on quality parts that will last a while.

Keyboard and Mouse
I didn't really want wireless keyboard but I did want a black, ergonomic keyboard and this was my only choice.

Floppy Drive
Looking for a quality, quiet, floppy.

Like you will be using it?

Surge Suppressor
Got to make sure this computer is protected right? I this too much protection?

So this comes out to around 1700 and I don't really want to spend that much if possible. All advice is greatly appreciated.

My advice ^^^^. Didn't comment on the things I'm unfamiliar with.

EDIT: Now with links!

 

[Mik3y]

the newcastle is unnoticably faster then the clawhammer at stock speeds.

 

[RedShirt]

If you wanted to go the PCI - Express route I'd suggest these components over what is listed:

Mobo
Proc
Case as mentioned by Balt
VideoCard 6600GT when they become available.
No need for sound with the great sound on the mobo.

This is only if you want to go the PCI express route. Seems to be about the same price either way. It's just preferance.

 

[Mik3y]

Originally posted by: RedShirt
If you wanted to go the PCI - Express route I'd suggest these components over what is listed:

Mobo
Proc
Case as mentioned by Balt
VideoCard 6600GT when they become available.
No need for sound with the great sound on the mobo.

This is only if you want to go the PCI express route. Seems to be about the same price either way. It's just preferance.

pci-e is currently a worse performer then agp and agp will not go away for a while, perhaps a couple years. and 2 years from now, there wouldnt be a point to upgrading just a new video card for the system. the cpu, ram, motherboard, and socket may be too outdated to keep up with performance. and i'm talking about siding with intel for it's ddr2 and pci-e. 2 years for a computer is very long IMO, it doesnt matter if you go with amd or intel. the hardware will be outdated either way and by upgrading one component, the rest of the system may be bottlenecking.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

Mik3y:
Agreed, accept for the part about buying those nastey Intel products, that's no good.

AMD W00H00 yeah! =D

Seriously though, there is no reason to get PCI-E unless it is a rediculously good deal, AGP is JUST AS GOOD, literaly no difference

 

[RedShirt]

Originally posted by: Mik3y

Originally posted by: RedShirt
If you wanted to go the PCI - Express route I'd suggest these components over what is listed:

Mobo
Proc
Case as mentioned by Balt
VideoCard 6600GT when they become available.
No need for sound with the great sound on the mobo.

This is only if you want to go the PCI express route. Seems to be about the same price either way. It's just preferance.

pci-e is currently a worse performer then agp and agp will not go away for a while, perhaps a couple years. and 2 years from now, there wouldnt be a point to upgrading just a new video card for the system. the cpu, ram, motherboard, and socket may be too outdated to keep up with performance. and i'm talking about siding with intel for it's ddr2 and pci-e. 2 years for a computer is very long IMO, it doesnt matter if you go with amd or intel. the hardware will be outdated either way and by upgrading one component, the rest of the system may be bottlenecking.

PCI Express is better than AGP! The only reason the AGP cards have performed better is because the PCI express cards are just AGP cards with an extra chip on them to convert them to PCI Express.

ATI has native PCI express cards out and Nvidia's 6600GT is native PCI express. The AGP version of this card will perform worse because the card will need an extra chip on there to convert to AGP.

I'm just throwing it out there. the 6600GT is WAY better than a 9800 pro for the same price. Plus the onboard audio of that board rocks. In addition there is 4 SATA ports instead of 2.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

Yes, of course the PCI-E slot technology is better, its almost 4x better than AGP 8X! but the point is, none of the cards that are on PCI-E are any better than a mid-upper level AGP 8X card-- the AGP cards still own the top, because the motherboards and video cards cant support the full potential of the PCI-E. so to clarify, when I say PCI-E is useless, I mean at present, not that it won't, someday, take over AGP-- because it will eventually rule the market.

 

[RedShirt]

Originally posted by: MetalMusicMan
Yes, of course the PCI-E slot technology is better, its almost 4x better than AGP 8X! but the point is, none of the cards that are on PCI-E are any better than a mid-upper level AGP 8X card-- the AGP cards still own the top, because the motherboards and video cards cant support the full potential of the PCI-E. so to clarify, when I say PCI-E is useless, I mean at present, not that it won't, someday, take over AGP-- because it will eventually rule the market.

Yep. I agree 100%. Only problem is the 6600GT is PCI Express only right now. This card is awesome. In addition, that motherboard rocks. It has GREAT onboard sound, Gigabit Ethernet, 4 SATA ports. It's very nice.

It looks as if it would be about the same price system wise to go Intel/AMD, but the videocard would be much better.

Edit: Again, I'm not saying he should or should not do this. It's just something to think about. He doesn't seem to know what videocard to get, so I figured for the same price as the 9800pro he could get a much better card if he went Intel.

 

[Algere]

I'd change the following:

RAM
Mushkin Basic PC3200 (Better memory timings + cheaper)

Sound Card
M-Audio Revolution 5.1 if music is a priority over gaming or the non-gamer/regular version (if you wanna save $) of the Audigy 2 ZS if gaming is a greater priority over music. Also as mentioned above, the Chaintech AV-710, it's somewhat like a 2 channel version of the M-Audio Revolution sound qualitywise but the drivers aren't that great among other things.

Hard Drive
Not much performance difference between SATA and PATA hard drives of the same model and there are great deals on PATA hard drives which can be found in the "Hot Deals" section of the forums.

DVD-ROM
Unless there's a need to do a disc-to-disc copy, you can save the bucks and use the DVD burner to copy to hard drive and then write back to disc.

Speakers
Would buy from Bestbuy over NewEgg to save $.

Keyboard
Matter of personal preference: I'd opt for a cheaper black keyboard with a simple standard layout (i.e. no multimedia hotkeys) and a basic optical mouse to match.

Floppy Drive
Matter of personal preference: I personally don't use a floppy drive and found other alternative methods to do what I need/want to do that in the past would require a floppy drive.

 

[Algere]

Originally posted by: RedShirt
No need for sound with the great sound on the mobo.

Those speakers deserve better

 

[MetalMusicMan]

redshirt:

i've read the reviews on the 6600gt, i really like what i've seen, but as u said it is only pci-e. For the price, right around 200 bucks, its a helluva bang for your money, but seeing as how amd has little-to-no pci-e boards, you are stuck with intel. which, again, is a great company, but right now i see no reason to buy their processors over the 64 bits. i mean, amd is just winning right now, hands down, there is no way around it when it comes to games.

i'm sure the next gen intel processors will be very good-- perhaps better than amd, they have beaten them before, many times-- but as for what they have out now compared to their amd competition, i can't justify buying anything with the intel logo on it, no matter how good the 6600gt is.

 

[RedShirt]

Originally posted by: Algere

Originally posted by: RedShirt
No need for sound with the great sound on the mobo.

Those speakers deserve better

True. I'd reccomend the AV-710 for a 2.1 setup. But I'd at least first listen to the onboard sound. The onboard sound is supposed to be really good on that Abit board.

 

[RedShirt]

Originally posted by: MetalMusicMan
redshirt:

i've read the reviews on the 6600gt, i really like what i've seen, but as u said it is only pci-e. For the price, right around 200 bucks, its a helluva bang for your money, but seeing as how amd has little-to-no pci-e boards, you are stuck with intel. which, again, is a great company, but right now i see no reason to buy their processors over the 64 bits. i mean, amd is just winning right now, hands down, there is no way around it when it comes to games.

i'm sure the next gen intel processors will be very good-- perhaps better than amd, they have beaten them before, many times-- but as for what they have out now compared to their amd competition, i can't justify buying anything with the intel logo on it, no matter how good the 6600gt is.

See, this is what I don't understand. They do all these tests on processors using games at super low res to take out the limitations of the vid card. A 3.0 ghz Pentium 4 and a 3000+ Athlon 64 are going to perform about the same in any new game at resolutions above 800x600. We're probably talking 1-2 fps difference at most.

The Pentium has Hyperthreading, something that actually sees use. Everyone thinks their Athlon 64 is so great with it's 64-bit ability, but most people will NEVER use it. By the time 64-bit becomes mainstream a newer chip will be out and everyone will have upgraded.

Edit: And in a lot of non-game applications, the P4 is better than the Athlon 64.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

speaking of sound, i think that the plain old audigy 2 sound card is the best bang for your buck right now. it has all of the sound-quality of the audigy 2 zs, but it just doesn't support 7.1-- only 6.1, but honesly, 6.1 is freakin' awesome. the OEM audigy 2's were like $75 last time that i checked.

if you don't want to spend that much, the audigy es, which is practicaly the same thing but with only 5.1
click the links below for both the cards i mentioned.

Audigy 2 OEM
Audigy ES OEM

 

[MetalMusicMan]

Originally posted by: RedShirt

Originally posted by: MetalMusicMan
redshirt:

i've read the reviews on the 6600gt, i really like what i've seen, but as u said it is only pci-e. For the price, right around 200 bucks, its a helluva bang for your money, but seeing as how amd has little-to-no pci-e boards, you are stuck with intel. which, again, is a great company, but right now i see no reason to buy their processors over the 64 bits. i mean, amd is just winning right now, hands down, there is no way around it when it comes to games.

i'm sure the next gen intel processors will be very good-- perhaps better than amd, they have beaten them before, many times-- but as for what they have out now compared to their amd competition, i can't justify buying anything with the intel logo on it, no matter how good the 6600gt is.

See, this is what I don't understand. They do all these tests on processors using games at super low res to take out the limitations of the vid card. A 3.0 ghz Pentium 4 and a 3000+ Athlon 64 are going to perform about the same in any new game at resolutions above 800x600. We're probably talking 1-2 fps difference at most.

The Pentium has Hyperthreading, something that actually sees use. Everyone thinks their Athlon 64 is so great with it's 64-bit ability, but most people will NEVER use it. By the time 64-bit becomes mainstream a newer chip will be out and everyone will have upgraded.

Edit: And in a lot of non-game applications, the P4 is better than the Athlon 64.

true, the 64 bit sees no use at all, but are you aware that Hypertransport is JUST as effective as hyperthreading? and dont forget, 99% of the programs out there don't PROPERLY use hyperTHREADING either, among the few that actually do are aquamark3d, which has no favor towards intel at all. beleive me, no one, especially ME, is saying how good the athlon 64's are because of their 64-bit nature, it's their hypertransport that makes them good-- by allowing the memory and video card to "talk" directly to the processor, it is just as effective and in some cases more so than the p4 HT-- the only place i would want a p4 is if i were burning a dvd and playing ut2004 at the SAME TIME, and when will anyone do that?

i do agree totally with the "low res" test. it's pointless, because almost no one uses 640x480 or even 800x600 on a NEW mid-high to high-end video card, that's for the low-enders.

 

[Algere]

Originally posted by: MetalMusicMan
speaking of sound, i think that the plain old audigy 2 sound card is the best bang for your buck right now. it has all of the sound-quality of the audigy 2 zs, but it just doesn't support 7.1-- only 6.1, but honesly, 6.1 is freakin' awesome. the OEM audigy 2's were like $75 last time that i checked.

if you don't want to spend that much, the audigy es, which is practicaly the same thing but with only 5.1
click the links below for both the cards i mentioned.

http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=29-102-158&amp;depa=0">Audigy 2 OEM</a>
http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=29-102-166&amp;depa=0">Audigy ES OEM</a>

NewEgg has a rebate offer for the Audigy 2 ZS and when put into consideration, the Audigy 2 ZS is cheaper than the regular Audigy 2.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

Originally posted by: Algere
NewEgg has a rebate offer for the Audigy 2 ZS and when put into consideration, the Audigy 2 ZS is cheaper than the regular Audigy 2.

Wow, I didn't notice that. Is that a new deal?--I haven't seen that rebate, maybe I over looked it. The ES is still only 43$ so it stands as a good value, but if the ZS is cheaper than the plain Audigy 2 then, heck, why not get it?

 

[RedShirt]

MetalMusicMan, I agree with the Hyperthreading and games. When it really comes into play is when you are doing multiple things at once. Like encoding a movie at low priority while playing a game or something like that. Then the Pentium really shines.

If the rig is built for only gaming, then hands down, Athlon 64 wins. Heck, if there was a PCI Express board for Athlon I'd say go for it... This is all assuming he'd even consider the 6600GT He could just get a normal 6800 with the Athlon as well and have great gaming performance.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

You got me.

Okay, we agree. Lets put our hammers down, lol.

 

[Algere]

Originally posted by: MetalMusicMan

Originally posted by: Algere
NewEgg has a rebate offer for the Audigy 2 ZS and when put into consideration, the Audigy 2 ZS is cheaper than the regular Audigy 2.

Wow, I didn't notice that. Is that a new deal?--I haven't seen that rebate, maybe I over looked it. The ES is still only 43$ so it stands as a good value, but if the ZS is cheaper than the plain Audigy 2 then, heck, why not get it?

It's new AFAIK, first spotted it in the "Hot Deals" forum today.