New Amd "Llano" Slides

[Nemesis 1]

If ya go to X bit and look at the HD3000

In civilization 5

At 1024x768 LQ 25OOk at 1100 igp speed scores 85.53 fps
At 1680x1050 LQ it scores42.82 fps .

Intels IGP is cache speed dependent .

This low end llano will be up against the 2 core SB running much higher clocks . If the AMD boys want to do Clocks for clocks I will remind you of that when BD is reviewed. The 2 core SB will compete with this low powered llano per watts . and likely be even in computainal tasK . Granted with 3 gpu programms all running at the same time probably not . But who would run a machine like that if its all ready a low powered laptop so thats really not real world as the game isn't playable at higher res.

AMD is fully aware that intels IGP is cache speed dependent .

 

[IntelUser2000]

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4083/...core-i7-2600k-i5-2500k-core-i3-2100-tested/11

Call of Duty: Black Ops and Civilization V are some of the weak points for the HD Graphics. It's especially low gain in the former where its only 40% faster than the previous HD Graphics.

OpenGL is obviously seriously crippled on the HD Graphics, moreso on the HD Graphics 2000/3000.

 

[Nemesis 1]

I can't help but notice the differance in ATs benchmarks and Xbits , in Civilazation Xbit gives much better results and in Star craft II the results are way differance , Just goes to show how important the system set up is .

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/intel-hd-graphics-2000-3000_8.html#sect3

 

[wahdangun]

can someone re-posted the image please, I can't see the image, its just stupid iced frog everywhere

 

[Nemesis 1]

In Ats review at 1024x768 in civilization LQ 16.5 fps Xbit at 1024x768 has 84.88 fps

in starcraft same settings AT has 143 fps xbit has 37.88 fps

 

[Mopetar]

In Ats review at 1024x768 in civilization LQ 16.5 fps Xbit at 1024x768 has 84.88 fps

in starcraft same settings AT has 143 fps xbit has 37.88 fps

Read their descriptions of their benchmarks.

The Anand benchmark numbers you're citing are for their GPU benchmark where they state that they navigate a single unit around the map. If you look at the results for the CPU test where it says they have six armies fight in the middle of the map the results are almost the same as the Xbit results.

Xbit doesn't say how they benchmarked Civ V, but the Anand numbers use the built-in late game benchmark. Xbit may have used the Leader benchmark which will give different numbers.

 

[ElFenix]

In Ats review at 1024x768 in civilization LQ 16.5 fps Xbit at 1024x768 has 84.88 fps

in starcraft same settings AT has 143 fps xbit has 37.88 fps

xbit uses the 'diplomatic' benchmark while AT uses the 'late game' benchmark. not sure if that actually means anything as i don't have civ 5.

starcraft is all custom benchmarks afaik, and AT has two of them. can't directly compare unless everyone is using the same benchmark.


xbit's benchmark list

 

[Axon]

Ive been up for almost 24 hours and have no idea what i'm doing so just ignore that statement

So this is what charlie sheen feels like on a daily basis

Winning bro

 

[nyker96]

gaming and productivity software at the same time. yeah my boss will want to buy 1k of these.
the benchmark that counts is LLano vs 2 core Sandybridge with full speed HD3000, intel i7-2630qm is not full speed HD3000, it's turbo maxes to only 1.1Ghz. I guess a further 25% in SB gaming performance is up Intel's sleeve without resorting to overclocking.

yes I think Llano has a place in work place where multitasking is quite useful. Not sure where company will use the video part of this chip though.

 

[Arkadrel]

"Not sure where company will use the video part of this chip though."

jeez do people still not understand what fusion is about?

The GPU isnt just for graphics... its a powerfull processor on its own (the GPU), thanks to things like CUDA (nvidia only), DirectCompute,APP,OpenCL. A GPU doesnt "just" do graphics, it can do more. (which is the point of fusion, with APUs, to have strong GPGPU)

We ll see alot of software with GPGPU come in the future, because everyone supports it now, and wants it... right from IMB,INTEL,AMD,NVIDIA,MS.

 

[Nemesis 1]

I think ,most of us understand that perfectly . Now if you would list all the programms that presently us open CL . Also a discrete graphics card from NV will work just fine if its pure performance in CL your looking for . Add that in with Intels CPU cl it will be great whenever we get programms that use it.

 

[jvroig]

can someone re-posted the image please, I can't see the image, its just stupid iced frog everywhere

Same here.

I see the imageshack images, is it some kind of filtering being done at a national level in your case?

Turns out this is just a new imageshack policy. Websites themselves must be registered to them (they have a form that webmasters can fill up, URL below the iced frog) in order for images to show up properly.

Alternately, you just need to be logged in to your imageshack account for images to show properly.

I have no desire to sign up for imageshack, so I guess until they rescind this new policy (if ever), I won't be seeing imageshack images.


@Nem,

Hey, Nem, how's it going? Has Bob gotten his hands on both HD3000-enabled SKUs and a Llano chip as well? I'm sure the Intel part is a sure thing, just not sure if he also can play around with the competition's. I can see you are very passionate about the new CPU IGP's. Just wondering if Bob has hands on both.

 

[Fox5]

Only twice the performance of sb integrated graphics is kind of disappoint imo. It should have been at least 3x.

 

[Arkadrel]

Only twice the performance of sb integrated graphics is kind of disappoint imo. It should have been at least 3x.

^
This... I think its because the Llano in the demo is running "slow" GPU mhz and "slow" CPU mhz (1.8ghz) and only useing DDR1333 ram, all to stay within 45 TPD or something like that.

I think the desktop ones will be faster... hope so anyways.

 

[RobertPters77]

If I could buy a Llano apu now and stick in an AM3 motherboard having it overwrite the IGP I'd be so happy.

Say does anyone know the Stream Proc count on the llano's gpu?

 

[busydude]

Say does anyone know the Stream Proc count on the llano's gpu?

Rumors range from 400-480 SP's.

 

[RobertPters77]

Rumors range from 400-480 SP's.

That's about a 5670 right?

Not bad. What about the TMUs and ROPs? Let's hope it's not pitifully weak like 4 and 4.

 

[busydude]

That's about a 5670 right?

But.. it's severely bandwidth limited.. expect performance in the range of 5570 or slightly below that. The performance you get is severely dependent on the speed of the memory you are using.

 

[RobertPters77]

But.. it's severely bandwidth limited.. expect performance in the range of 5570 or slightly below that. The performance you get is severely dependent on the speed of the memory you are using.

Isn't GDDR5 equal to DDR3? Are they not both quad pumped?

 

[busydude]

Isn't GDDR5 equal to DDR3? Are they not both quad pumped?

I am not an expert on memory technologies or anything for that matter. But I know GDDR5 is significantly faster than DDR3.. maybe it has to do with the memory clock.
Llano uses a dual channel DDR3 MC...

As you can see.. if you opt for the fastest DDR3 in the market the max bandwidth is ~27 GB/s.. and this is for the whole CPU. A 5760 has a Memory bandwidth of 64GB/s.. more than double of what you get on a 2133MHz dual channel DDR3 memory.

 

[M0RPH]

Alternately, you just need to be logged in to your imageshack account for images to show properly.

I have no desire to sign up for imageshack, so I guess until they rescind this new policy (if ever), I won't be seeing imageshack images.

I see all the images and I don't remember having any Imageshack account, at least I haven't logged in any time recently.

I think maybe they only allow so many views with hotlinked images, and I viewed the thread before the limit was reached.

 

[ydnas7]

Dual core SB are 131mm2 or 149 mm2
LLano is 228mm2
I guess that LLano will have a hard time on price/profitability
(The difference is almost entirely GPU, which will be bandwidth constrained)

 

[IntelUser2000]

Isn't GDDR5 equal to DDR3? Are they not both quad pumped?

No its not. To put it in layman's terms:

DDR3: Frequency x 8
GDDR5: Frequency x 8 x 2

Double pump the double pump and you get GDDR5.

 

[Idontcare]

Turns out this is just a new imageshack policy. Websites themselves must be registered to them (they have a form that webmasters can fill up, URL below the iced frog) in order for images to show up properly.

Alternately, you just need to be logged in to your imageshack account for images to show properly.

I have no desire to sign up for imageshack, so I guess until they rescind this new policy (if ever), I won't be seeing imageshack images.

jv, I have never had an imageshack account. And I can see the embedded images in the OP just fine.

The only members that I recall ever mentioning not being able to see imageshack pics are members who are not in the USA, which suggests to me that it is some manner of filtering going on that has nothing to do with Anandtech but is IP-address based.

 

[Concillian]

Llano is meant mostly for Laptops.. so I guess it is pretty much a valid comparison.

Also.. I will not be surprised if they implement hybrid crossfire on laptop's. It would be neat..

Laptops and the kind of desktops that sell in decent quantities (all-in-ones and small form factor machines).

I know most of the people reading these forums could care less about something like Llano. But, quite literally, everyone I know who doesn't read forums like this would get better overall performance from less CPU and more GPU, because the CPU stuff they do is not really limiting them at all, but occasionally (sometimes frequently) their lack of GPU severely limits the entertainment options of themselves or their kids.

I think as much as we can know without having pricing info, Llano is better positioned for the low end CPU market than SB duals.

The real question is if people are willing to buy AMD. This was the main hurdle when they had a CPU that was superior in almost every way than Intel. They couldn't get the average person to choose AMD over Intel.

Also, expect the pricing situation to change a bit (higher). The issue with Athlons and Phenoms is that they aren't superior to Intel counterparts in any way, so they must undercut. LLano creates a niche where they are superior in some way, and this means they can potentially justify higher pricing than current AMD CPUs.

They are doing the same thing with Bulldozer by pushing FPU performance to the point where it will likely be superior to Intel. It will create at least one market segment where the AMD CPU is clearly superior. It's smart engineering. If you can't be clearly superior than your competition, make sure at least you're better at something, even if it's a niche market. This way you can have at least one high margin market segment and don't have to fight for table scraps in every market segment.

AMD's entire strategy is centered around creating niches where they can outperform their competition, then exploiting those niches to drive unit prices up to a profitable and sustainable level. For the most part, these niches are not niches that people reading hardware forums are most interested in, however, in some cases they do represent a pretty significant portion of the market.