Net Neutrality Further Threatened

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KeithP

KeithP

Diamond Member
Jun 15, 2000
5,664
202
106
drebo said:
Some possibly edifying reading for you...not that it'll probably make a difference: https://signup.netflix.com/openconnect
Click to expand...

From what I have read, this is not an Open Connect deal. At least not the way it has been done in the past which Comcast had always turned down.

Other than the hardware/software required, Netflix didn't pay to have access to an ISP's network to implement Open Connect.

In this case we have an ISP with its own services being paid money so a third party's service performs competitively. It appears to be a clear cut net neutrality issue to me.

-KeithP
 
S

Soundmanred

Lifer
Oct 26, 2006
10,780
6
81
drebo said:
As I said, these types of peering arrangements are not uncommon. This is not news, nor is it new.

Find me some evidence that there's underhandedness going on and then we can talk.

Peering arrangements are not the problem. The problem is that the FCC hasn't been doing its job for a decade or more.

And yes, I know how this shit works.

Some possibly edifying reading for you...not that it'll probably make a difference: https://signup.netflix.com/openconnect
Click to expand...

Don't bother, it's like talking to a crackhead with a dictionary. No coherent thought, just a jumble of CAPITALIZATION and pseudo intellectualism. It's not cute, it's annoying and helps no one.
 
Virgorising

Virgorising

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2013
4,470
0
0
KeithP said:
From what I have read, this is not an Open Connect deal. At least not the way it has been done in the past which Comcast had always turned down.

Other than the hardware/software required, Netflix didn't pay to have access to an ISP's network to implement Open Connect.

In this case we have an ISP with its own services being paid money so a third party's service performs competitively. It appears to be a clear cut net neutrality issue to me.

-KeithP
Click to expand...


It is indeed clear cut. Anyone who does not get this, by definition, is an enabler of the greedy, ravenous foxes stealing the chicken coop.
 
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KeithTalent

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,231
118
116
I probably should care about this, but I kind of don't.

KT
 
D

drebo

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,034
1
81
KeithP said:
In this case we have an ISP with its own services being paid money so a third party's service performs competitively. It appears to be a clear cut net neutrality issue to me.
Click to expand...

Do you have a source for that? Because nothing I've read hints that this is anything over than settlement-free peering.
 
Red Squirrel

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
70,671
13,835
126
www.anyf.ca
The part that's a piss off is it seems every couple months there's something like this that we have to fight. The government and big companies just arn't giving up and wanting to destroy the internet and freedom of information.
 
Virgorising

Virgorising

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2013
4,470
0
0
Red Squirrel said:
The part that's a piss off is it seems every couple months there's something like this that we have to fight. The government and big companies just arn't giving up and wanting to destroy the internet and freedom of information.
Click to expand...


But, what is pissing you off....objectively, is a privilege to celebrate. Democracy give us privileges and RESPONSIBILITIES so that we can go on having those privileges To resent that.....means you are being a kinda ingrate.

Think SQUIRRELS: that they are engineered to spend forever gathering nuts and seeds in their cheek pouches to store in their dens so they can eat while staying warm in winter is something to celebrate. And, if they live in places where there ARE nuts and seeds SO THEY CAN DO THIS WORK.... is also something to celebrate.
 
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ImpulsE69

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
You know what? Time to boycott Netflix.

I ask myself. Could I give up the internet? TV/Movies, entertainment?

It would suck at first, but really there are tons of things to do in the world that don't involve any of the above.

Companies get away with all of this because people are lazy and materialistic. People should care but are too invested in getting their next <insert mind altering item here> to really stand up for themselves. Companies have our government in their pockets. Government does not care about the average citizen. They only care about who's going to keep them in office (and it's becoming increasingly apparent that we don't have much say in that either.)
 
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ImpulsE69

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
poofyhairguy said:
Why is it Netflix's fault? They have to play the game to stay in business. If anything they are pushing the boundary for true al a carte and ondemand video in the industry.
Click to expand...

It's an indirect fault. They played into the ISP's hands plain and simple. They are feeding the game. Just being ok with it because it is Netflix, doesn't make it better or go away. It's a crutch.

They want to be revolutionary and show the ISP's? Start their own. Until then, they have just become another evil empire.
 
poofyhairguy

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
ImpulsE69 said:
It's an indirect fault. They played into the ISP's hands plain and simple. They are feeding the game. Just being ok with it because it is Netflix, doesn't make it better or go away. It's a crutch.

They want to be revolutionary and show the ISP's? Start their own. Until then, they have just become another evil empire.
Click to expand...

Netflix has to spend resource licensing content. They can't blow capital on being an ISP.

Google is going that route, and even with way more resources it is taking them forever to spread their fiber.
 
Virgorising

Virgorising

Diamond Member
Apr 9, 2013
4,470
0
0
ImpulsE69 said:
Companies have our government in their pockets. Government does not care about the average citizen. They only care about who's going to keep them in office (and it's becoming increasingly apparent that we don't have much say in that either.)
Click to expand...

NOT TRUE FOR ALL OF GOVERNMENT! And, it's our job to keep the integrity driven leaders in office and do away with the lowlifes and Fausts.
 
Red Squirrel

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
70,671
13,835
126
www.anyf.ca
One possible answer to this net neutrality thing is mesh networking, even if it uses the internet as backhaul for now:

https://projectmeshnet.org/

This is different than Tor and other such networks, this is not a proxy, it's a whole new internet on top of the existing internet. I'll be starting up a node once I build my new VM server.

Politicians don't listen, it's time to solve this with technology instead. Though it wont be the end all because the government just needs to regulate/ban mesh networks. Then we have to think of something else.
 
ImpulsE69

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
Virgorising said:
NOT TRUE FOR ALL OF GOVERNMENT! And, it's our job to keep the integrity driven leaders in office and do away with the lowlifes and Fausts.
Click to expand...

Do we need to split hairs when you're talking about probably 5% of government? Even the ones who are trying to do good get shut down by everyone else.
 
destrekor

destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
Red Squirrel said:
Well people do want Capitalism. This is it. Enjoy.
Click to expand...

Capitalism works when government regulation works correctly alongside it.

Until the internet providers are treated as dumb pipes (the FCC is giving the idea thought), that is, until they are common utilities, these issues will grow worse.


Which is to say, pure capitalism without any government intervention might work just fine - it would never be introduced because governments love to get involved, mostly due to cronyism and lobbyists who can sneak new wording into legislation to protect their interests. If the companies who cannot adjust to the new markets also cannot seek out new government regulation or laws that will help them (and likely hurt their competition), pure capitalism could work.

As it is, we are so far from pure unregulated capitalism that it's simply impossible. That said, as long as regulations keep up and are entirely fair to all corporations (which may demand a company actually has to innovate or check their prices to compete or end up failing), then a regulated capitalist market can be maintained and we all benefit.
If regulations fail to keep up with the changing face of the world (new technology, new markets, etc), then we'll all suffer and the lucky corporations on the right side of the regulations are the winners... which is pretty much where we are at today.
 
D

drebo

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,034
1
81
destrekor said:
Capitalism works when government regulation works correctly alongside it.

Until the internet providers are treated as dumb pipes (the FCC is giving the idea thought), that is, until they are common utilities, these issues will grow worse.


Which is to say, pure capitalism without any government intervention might work just fine - it would never be introduced because governments love to get involved, mostly due to cronyism and lobbyists who can sneak new wording into legislation to protect their interests. If the companies who cannot adjust to the new markets also cannot seek out new government regulation or laws that will help them (and likely hurt their competition), pure capitalism could work.

As it is, we are so far from pure unregulated capitalism that it's simply impossible. That said, as long as regulations keep up and are entirely fair to all corporations (which may demand a company actually has to innovate or check their prices to compete or end up failing), then a regulated capitalist market can be maintained and we all benefit.
If regulations fail to keep up with the changing face of the world (new technology, new markets, etc), then we'll all suffer and the lucky corporations on the right side of the regulations are the winners... which is pretty much where we are at today.
Click to expand...

You do realize that the existing way in which the Internet exists in the US is a direct result of government-passed regulations, right?
 
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