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Nerd thread: Cool math tricks (aka show me how to do my homework faster)

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Post your shortcuts for classic problems here... I just felt like doing this cause of the "squares in a square" thread :)

Everyone who's taken math through highschool has seen this one, and everyone who's gone on to calc in university has seen it in higher complexity. It's a classic, it can take a while for students learning the material, and now I'm gonna show you how to do it all the way up to an n-dimensional hypervolume... in your head :)

Problem:
Joe is a farmer. He has property bordering a cliff, and he has 800 feet of fencing to set up a fence. What is the largest area he can enclose using the 800 ft of fencing?

Or, here's the higher order version you do in university:

Jim has a bunch of cardboard and 24 feet of duct tape. He wants to tape up an open-topped box using the cardboard and tape. He must duct-tape the edges of the box where the cardboard is joined. What are the dimensions of the maximum volume of the box?

Crazy-arsed version:

Kodos' hyperdrive is fvcked. Fix it. Make as big a 5th dimensional uber-cube that is open topped in the x and v directions (u, v, x, y, z are your coordinate axes) as you can using 120 inches of duct tape (you didn't know it, but duct tape is hyper dimensional... :) ).

Yep, you can do all of these in your head. The first one, when learning the material requires setting up an expression for the area, using two sides of length x and the other side of length (800 - 2x), A = x(800 - 2x), A = -2x^2 + 800x, and solving that polynomial for the maximum. Using this method you get x = 200, so you have a 200 x 400 for your dimensions.

I'm not going to actually do the other two problems as they involve using lagrange multipliers, and I'm lazy.



Actually, on second thought, I'm just gonna see if you guys can figure out the method I use for these problems. I'll give hints along the way, but I want to have some fun with this :)
 

Heisenberg

Lifer
Dec 21, 2001
10,621
1
0
Ugh...it's been a while since I did anything with lagrange multipliers and I'm not gonna dig out the book to look it up at 2am. I'll sit this one out.
 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
I'm not asking for how to do it via lagrange... I know that just fine. I'm asking for you to come up with the shortcut method for a general case :)
 

GoodToGo

Diamond Member
Jul 16, 2000
3,516
1
0
The answer to the first quesiotn is wrong, the length of the other side should be 200 since 400+200+400+200>800.
 

MrCodeDude

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
13,674
1
76
Any single digit # x 11 is just the single digit # repeated twice. So 4 x 11 = 44

Any double digit # x 11 is the number, with the sum of each digit in the middle. So 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)2 = 123 or 12 x 27 = 2(2+7)7 = 279
-- mrcodedude
 

GoodToGo

Diamond Member
Jul 16, 2000
3,516
1
0
Originally posted by: GoodToGo
The answer to the first quesiotn is wrong, the length of the other side should be 200 since 400+200+400+200>800.

And yes, you set the differenteial to zero, standard newtons rule.
 

Haircut

Platinum Member
Apr 23, 2000
2,248
0
0
Originally posted by: GoodToGo
The answer to the first quesiotn is wrong, the length of the other side should be 200 since 400+200+400+200>800.
He said the property is bordering a cliff. 200+400+200 = 800
 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Originally posted by: GoodToGo
The answer to the first quesiotn is wrong, the length of the other side should be 200 since 400+200+400+200>800.

No. You're building the fence with the cliff as one edge... So you have (400, 200, 200) of fence, and 400 of cliff...


Oh, and upon further inspection, that last one take a bit more figuring out than I thought... But my way is still much simpler than the "real" way of doing it :)

edit: fixed numbers due to retardedness :)
 

Ferocious

Diamond Member
Feb 16, 2000
4,584
2
71
Is the shortcut dividing the number in question by the number of dimensions?

Another solution for the first one is two strips of fence each 400 ft at 45 degree angles with the furthest point being 283 feet from cliff.......which came from the 800/2 shortcut.

 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Originally posted by: Ferocious
Is the shortcut dividing the number in question by the number of dimensions?

Another solution for the first one is two strips of fence each 400 ft at 45 degree angles with the furthest point being 283 feet from cliff.......which came from the 800/2 shortcut.

You're on the right track yep :)
 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Oh, and we're not dealing with a curved fence here btw... it's just straight 90 degree angle stuff (think grade 9 math, or maybe intro calc stuff).
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,402
8,574
126
Originally posted by: silverpig
Oh, and we're not dealing with a curved fence here btw... it's just straight 90 degree angle stuff (think grade 9 math, or maybe intro calc stuff).

oh. i was using half a circle.
 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Yeah, sorry fenix. I guess I didn't add that part in my question... I just figured everyone had done that problem with the straight fences in HS math.
 

Joemonkey

Diamond Member
Mar 3, 2001
8,859
4
0
Originally posted by: MrCodeDude
Any single digit # x 11 is just the single digit # repeated twice. So 4 x 11 = 44 Any double digit # x 11 is the number, with the sum of each digit in the middle. So 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)2 = 123 or 12 x 27 = 2(2+7)7 = 279 -- mrcodedude

ya typo'd... 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)3 = 132
 

bleeb

Lifer
Feb 3, 2000
10,868
0
0
Can someone please tell me how they remember all the angles in radian terms?

90 degrees is Pi/2, 180 degrees is Pi, 360 degrees is 2Pi, etc.... I find it difficult to remember the others... hehehe
 

RaynorWolfcastle

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
8,968
16
81
Originally posted by: bleeb
Can someone please tell me how they remember all the angles in radian terms?

90 degrees is Pi/2, 180 degrees is Pi, 360 degrees is 2Pi, etc.... I find it difficult to remember the others... hehehe

practice. but in reality you only have to remember that 360 deg. is 2Pi rad. The rest is simple division.... ie 180deg = pi rad, 90deg = Pi/2rad, 60deg is Pi/3 rad, 45deg is Pi/4 rad, 30deg is Pi/6 rad, etc.

They rarely expect you to remember more than that off the top of your head.
 

LordSnailz

Diamond Member
Nov 2, 1999
4,821
0
0
I don't get the 2nd question, it's been awhile since HS ...

so you want to find the maximum for x*y*z right?

4x+4y+4z = 24

I'm missing another equation ... come to think about it, x=y=z would work no? ... argh ... it's friday and it's late ... someone help me out ...
 

RatDog8102

Member
Jan 20, 2001
123
0
0
Originally posted by: MrCodeDude
Any single digit # x 11 is just the single digit # repeated twice. So 4 x 11 = 44

Any double digit # x 11 is the number, with the sum of each digit in the middle. So 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)2 = 123 or 12 x 27 = 2(2+7)7 = 279
-- mrcodedude


I'll have 2 of whatever he's drinking.

 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
12
81
Originally posted by: LordSnailz
I don't get the 2nd question, it's been awhile since HS ...

so you want to find the maximum for x*y*z right?

4x+4y+4z = 24

I'm missing another equation ... come to think about it, x=y=z would work no? ... argh ... it's friday and it's late ... someone help me out ...

No, the box is open on top, so you don't need 2x or 2y.

You have to maximize V = xyz subject to the constraint 4z + 2x + 2y = 24
 

PCboy

Senior member
Jul 9, 2001
847
0
0
Originally posted by: Joemonkey
Originally posted by: MrCodeDude
Any single digit # x 11 is just the single digit # repeated twice. So 4 x 11 = 44 Any double digit # x 11 is the number, with the sum of each digit in the middle. So 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)2 = 123 or 12 x 27 = 2(2+7)7 = 279 -- mrcodedude

ya typo'd... 12 x 11 = 1(1+2)3 = 132


12 X 11 = 1(1+2)2 = 132

12 X 27 = 2(2+7)7 = 279 (you sure bout this? Is it not 324?)